Here is my conversation with Dario Amodei, CEO of Anthropic. Dario is hilarious and has fascinating takes on what these models are doing, why they scale so well, and what it will take to align them.

𝐄𝐏𝐈𝐒𝐎𝐃𝐄 𝐋𝐈𝐍𝐊𝐒
* Transcript: https://www.dwarkeshpatel.com/dario-amodei
* Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3rZOzPA
* Spotify: https://spoti.fi/3QwMXXU
* Follow me on Twitter: https://twitter.com/dwarkesh_sp

---
I’m running an experiment on this episode.

I’m not doing an ad.

Instead, I’m just going to ask you to pay for whatever value you feel you personally got out of this conversation.

Pay here: https://bit.ly/3ONINtp
---

𝐓𝐈𝐌𝐄𝐒𝐓𝐀𝐌𝐏𝐒
00:00:00 - Introduction
00:01:00 - Scaling
00:15:46 - Language
00:22:58 - Economic Usefulness
00:38:05 - Bioterrorism
00:43:35 - Cybersecurity
00:47:19 - Alignment & mechanistic interpretability
00:57:43 - Does alignment research require scale?
01:05:30 - Misuse vs misalignment
01:09:06 - What if AI goes well?
01:11:05 - China
01:15:11 - How to think about alignment
01:31:31 - Is modern security good enough?
01:36:09 - Inefficiencies in training
01:45:53 - Anthropic’s Long Term Benefit Trust
01:51:18 - Is Claude conscious?
01:56:14 - Keeping a low profile