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Consciousness is Not a Computation (Roger Penrose) | AI Podcast Clips
10 segments available
Full episode with Roger Penrose (Mar 2020): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orMtwOz6Db0 Clips channel (Lex Clips): https://www.youtube.com/lexclips Main channel (Lex Fridman): https://www.youtube.com/lexfridman (more links below) Podcast full episodes playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLrAXtmErZgOdP_8GztsuKi9nrraNbKKp4 Podcasts clips playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLrAXtmErZgOeciFP3CBCIEElOJeitOr41 Podcast website: https://lexfridman.com/ai Podcast on Apple Podcasts (iTunes): https://apple.co/2lwqZIr Podcast on Spotify: https://spoti.fi/2nEwCF8 Podcast RSS: https://lexfridman.com/category/ai/feed/ Roger Penrose is physicist, mathematician, and philosopher at University of Oxford. He has made fundamental contributions in many disciplines from the mathematical physics of general relativity and cosmology to the limitations of a computational view of consciousness. Subscribe to this YouTube channel or connect on: - Twitter: https://twitter.com/lexfridman - LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lexfridman - Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lexfridman - Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lexfridman - Medium: https://medium.com/@lexfridman - Support on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/lexfridman
Segments Timeline
Consciousness Beyond Computation
Roger Penrose introduces his perspective that consciousness cannot be reduced to computation or physical processes. He discusses his book, 'The Emperor's New Mind,' and the limitations of computational models in understanding consciousness, emphasizing the need for a deeper exploration of the subject.
"I'm trying to say that whatever consciousness is it's not a computation yes it's not a physical process which can be described by computation but it nevertheless could be so one of the interesting mod..."
The Role of Microtubules
Penrose reflects on his ignorance of microtubules while writing his book and how they might play a crucial role in understanding consciousness. He describes how microtubules are involved in cellular processes and suggests they could be key to preserving quantum coherence in the brain.
"discussion between edward fredkin and marvin minsky and they were talking about what computers could do and they were answering and entering a big room it imagined entering this big room with the othe..."
Quantum Coherence and Consciousness
Penrose discusses the significance of quantum coherence in consciousness and how microtubules might facilitate this process. He highlights the importance of symmetry in these structures for preserving quantum states, suggesting a link between quantum mechanics and consciousness.
"interesting because he got he told me he'd got some Carl Sagan I think to rise her forward good gosh what am I gonna do I'm not gonna get anywhere unless I get somebody so I know Martin gardener so we..."
Orchestrated Objective Reduction
Penrose introduces the concept of orchestrated objective reduction (Orch-OR), proposing that consciousness arises from quantum processes within neurons. He contrasts this view with the computational perspective, emphasizing the need for a new understanding of consciousness that transcends traditional models.
"read is that the second electrical signals which go along the nerves create some effects through the brain there's no chance you can isolate it so this is hopeless so I come to the end of the book and..."
Anesthesia and Consciousness
Penrose explores the relationship between general anesthetics and consciousness, suggesting that anesthetics may affect microtubules in the brain. He discusses the implications of this idea for understanding how consciousness can be turned off and on, and the potential for experimental research in this area.
"computable source of consciousness within the human brain yeah in the biology and so what are mark if I may ask what are microtubules well you see I I was ignorant in what address I never came across ..."
The Search for Consciousness
Penrose reflects on the challenges of studying consciousness and the limited number of researchers focused on this area. He emphasizes the importance of understanding what consciousness is and how it can be experimentally investigated, particularly through the lens of microtubules.
"job of where every call it is to put people to sleep except he doesn't like calling to sleep because it's different general anesthetics in a reversible way so you want to make sure that they don't exp..."
The Nature of Quantum Mechanics
Penrose discusses the limitations of conventional quantum mechanics and the need for a deeper understanding of its implications for consciousness. He argues that current theories do not adequately explain the collapse of the wave function and the role of consciousness in this process.
"cells they inhabit pretty well all the other cells in the body but they're not all the same kind you'll get different kinds of microtubules and the ones that excited me the most and this is may still ..."
Proto-Consciousness and Quantum Choices
Penrose introduces the concept of proto-consciousness, suggesting that it is a fundamental building block of consciousness. He explains how quantum choices contribute to the emergence of consciousness and the orchestration of these processes within the brain.
"what's going on so something about the measurement process what's going on something about the structure or the microtubules yeah your intuition says maybe there's something here maybe this kind of st..."
Understanding Intelligence and Consciousness
Penrose discusses the relationship between understanding, intelligence, and consciousness. He posits that true intelligence requires understanding, and that awareness is a crucial component of this relationship, highlighting the complexities of defining these concepts.
"consciousness originates at the quantum level inside neuron so that has to do with your search for where where is it coming from so that's counter to the notion that consciousness might arise from the..."
The Future of Consciousness Research
Penrose reflects on the future of consciousness research and the potential for new theories to emerge. He emphasizes the need for interdisciplinary collaboration and innovative approaches to unravel the mysteries of consciousness and its connection to quantum mechanics.
"effects which are not just chemical in photosynthesis and this is one of the striking things in the last several years that photosynthesis seems to be a basically quantum process which is not simply c..."