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Yuval Noah Harari: They Are Lying About AI! The Trump Kamala Election Will Tear The Country Apart!
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Yuval Noah Harari is a best-selling author, public intellectual and Professor of History at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem. He is the author of multi-million bestseller books such as, ‘Sapiens: A Brief History of Humankind’ and ‘Homo Deus: A Brief History of Tomorrow’. 00:00 Intro 02:31 Will Humans Continue To Rule The World? 06:48 Why AI Is The Biggest Game-Changer In History 10:34 Is AI Just Information Or Something More? 16:53 Can AI Manipulate Our Bank Accounts And Political Views? 21:42 How AI Will Affect Human Intimacy 23:44 Will AI Replace Teachers? 25:09 Why Online Information Is Junk 28:42 How Politicians Use Fear To Manipulate Us 31:52 Should There Be A Free Speech Movement 39:38 How Algorithms Are Shaping Global Politics And Increasing Fear 45:30 The Impact Of The US Election On Global Politics 48:48 What Trump Could Do To US Democracy 50:29 Can We Trust What We See On Social Media And The News? 55:37 Will AI Eventually Run Governments? 00:58:32 What Jobs Will AI Leave For Humans? 01:02:01 Which Jobs Will Be Automated By AI? 01:05:33 Is AI Conscious? 01:07:19 AI, Robots, And The Future Of Consciousness 01:10:01 Are We Living In A Simulation? 01:13:09 How Algorithms Control Our Lives 01:16:21 Understanding The AI Alignment Problem 01:21:13 The Relationship Between AI And Corporate Interests 01:25:04 The Growing Threat Of Totalitarian Governments 01:33:08 How The Algorithm Knows It's Fake News 01:38:01 Is Yuval Tempted To Log Off? 01:41:52 Will Humans Become Two Species? 01:44:00 What's The Solution To The Negatives Of AI? 01:49:17 The Guest's Last Question Follow Yuval: Instagram - https://g2ul0.app.link/7iXk5TnLAMb Twitter - https://g2ul0.app.link/eaKRt5rLAMb You can pre-order Yuval’s book ‘NEXUS: A Brief History of Information Networks from the Stone Age to AI’, here: https://amzn.to/4g8Vdrn My new book! 'The 33 Laws Of Business & Life' is out now - https://g2ul0.app.link/DOACBook Get your hands on the brand new Diary Of A CEO Conversation Cards here: https://appurl.io/iUUJeYn25v Get access to exclusive Diary of a CEO members content here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGq-a57w-aPwyi3pW7XLiHw/join Follow me: https://g2ul0.app.link/gnGqL4IsKKb Sponsors: Linkedin Jobs: https://www.linkedin.com/doac24
Segments Timeline
The Fragility of Democracy
Yuval Noah Harari discusses the dangers of division among humans and how algorithms exploit these weaknesses, leading to the collapse of democracy. He emphasizes that the real threat to humanity is not AI itself, but our own delusions and inability to unite, especially in the context of upcoming elections.
"the humans are still more powerful than the AIS the problem is that we are divided against each other and the algorithms are using our weaknesses against us and this is very dangerous because once you..."
AI: The New Bureaucracy
Harari reflects on the potential future where AI bureaucrats make decisions in various sectors, from banking to government. He warns that as AI becomes more integrated into decision-making, humans may struggle to understand the rationale behind these choices, leading to a shift in power dynamics.
"10 years ago you made a video that was titled why humans run the world it's a very well-known Ted Talk that you did after reading your new book Nexus I wanted to ask you a slightly modified question w..."
The Alien Intelligence of AI
In this segment, Harari explains how AI should be viewed as an 'alien intelligence' rather than just artificial intelligence. He illustrates this concept by referencing the game of Go, where AI has developed strategies that humans have never conceived, highlighting the unpredictable nature of AI's decision-making.
"thought that they explored the entire uh uh realm the entire geography landscape of go and then alphago came along and showed us that actually for 2,500 years people were exploring just a very small b..."
Historical Perspectives on AI
Harari emphasizes the importance of understanding AI through a historical lens. He argues that to grasp the significance of AI, we must consider previous information revolutions, such as writing and the printing press, and how they transformed society and decision-making.
"historical perspective and do you consider yourself to be a historian yes that that's my my profession is a historian that that's kind of this is my training I was originally a specialist in medieval ..."
The Impact of Information Technology on Democracy
In this segment, Harari discusses how information technology underpins democracy. He explains that the rise of social media and AI could disrupt democratic processes, as effective communication among citizens becomes increasingly challenging, leading to societal fragmentation.
"explanations about the unique conditions of American history and Society but you see the same thing in Brazil you see the same thing in in France in the Philippines so it can't be the unique condition..."
Language as the Foundation of Society
Harari explores the role of language in maintaining societal structures, including relationships and banking. He raises concerns about how AI's mastery of language could manipulate these interactions, questioning the security and authenticity of communication in a world increasingly influenced by AI.
"Masterpiece language it will never Master language and CH GPT came and it is you know I'm I'm a words person and I'm simply Amazed by the quality of the texts that uh these large language language mod..."
Intimacy vs. Attention in the Age of AI
In this segment, Harari contrasts the concepts of intimacy and attention, arguing that while AI can generate attention, it can also create a false sense of intimacy. He discusses the societal implications of this shift, particularly in light of declining human-to-human connections.
"between strangers and therefore most Financial inventions in the end they are linguistic and symbolic inventions it's not you don't need some complicated physics it's it's complicated symbolism and no..."
The Rise of Artificial Intimacy
Harari delves into the potential for AI to simulate intimate relationships, raising ethical questions about authenticity and connection. He connects this phenomenon to the broader societal issues of loneliness and the need for belonging in an increasingly disconnected world.
"you know dictators could must produce attention you know once you have for instance radio you can tell all the people in Nazi Germany or in the Soviet Union the great leader is giving a speech everybo..."
AI in Education: A Double-Edged Sword
Harari discusses the future of education in the context of AI, weighing the benefits of personalized learning against the need for human interaction. He emphasizes the importance of socialization among children and the potential for AI to enhance educational experiences.
"people are desperately trying to belong somewhere and the algorithm is like reinforcing my echo chamber so you know and it's but I don't know how that ends I don't think it's deterministic it depends ..."
The Information Diet: Quality Over Quantity
In this segment, Harari critiques the abundance of information in today's society, likening it to a junk food diet. He argues for the necessity of discerning quality information and the misconception that more information equates to more truth.
"groups of kids for break time because very often you learn the the most important lessons in school are not learned during the lessons they are learned during the breaks and this is something that sho..."
Connecting Through Fiction and Fear
Harari examines how narratives, often rooted in fear and fiction, can unite people and influence political landscapes. He discusses the historical context of these narratives and their effectiveness in galvanizing public opinion.
"again of the abundance of of junk information and the the basic misconception I think is this link between information and truth that people think okay if I get a lot of information this is the raw ma..."
The Emotional Manipulation of Politics
In this segment, Harari highlights how political leaders exploit human emotions, particularly fear and disgust, to manipulate public sentiment. He draws parallels between historical and contemporary examples of this tactic.
"fear um I was thinking about sapiens and the role that stories play um in engaging our brains and I was thinking a lot about the narratives in the UK we have a narrative where we we're told that much ..."
The Free Speech Dilemma
Harari discusses the complexities surrounding free speech in the context of social media platforms. He emphasizes the distinction between human users and the algorithms that govern content, raising concerns about the implications of algorithm-driven narratives.
"Social Animal you they did experiments on chimpanzees that show that chimpanzees have a also a kind of almost instinctive H fear or disgust towards foreign chimpanzees from a different band and politi..."
Algorithms and the Fear Button
In this concluding segment, Harari explains how algorithms prioritize content that elicits fear and anger to capture attention. He critiques the impact of this approach on societal discourse and the responsibility of tech companies in shaping public narratives.
"many of the things we've been talking about one of them is Elon Musk bought Twitter and his real mandate has been this idea of free speech and as part of that mandate he's unblocked a number of figure..."
Bots vs. Humans: The Online Conversation
In this segment, Harari addresses the impact of bots on online discourse, noting how they can distort public perception by creating the illusion of human interest in certain topics. He argues that AI impersonating humans undermines genuine conversation and calls for stricter regulations to prevent bots from masquerading as real users.
"epidemic of fake news and conspiracy theories and and and so forth and the the defense of of the companies is we are not producing the content somebody a human being produced a hatefield conspiracy th..."
Fear and Political Narratives
Harari discusses the role of fear in shaping political narratives, particularly regarding immigration. He warns against labeling opposing views as enemy threats, emphasizing that democracy thrives on diverse opinions and civil discourse, rather than vilification and extremism.
"freedom of speech uh yeah the person who produced the hatefield video I would be careful about banning them but that's not the problem it's the recommendation which is the problem the second problem i..."
The Fragility of Democracy
In this critical analysis, Harari reflects on the fragility of democratic systems, especially in light of potential authoritarian shifts. He warns that if political leaders manipulate electoral processes, it could undermine the self-correcting mechanisms that are essential for democracy to function.
"to make more money and if I have a innate sort of predisposition to spend more time focused on things that scare me yeah or then you just have to give me a couple of years and every year that goes pas..."
The Consequences of Political Polarization
Harari elaborates on the dangers of political polarization, where opposing sides view each other as enemies rather than rivals. He stresses the importance of maintaining a healthy democratic dialogue and the risks posed by extreme narratives that threaten to collapse civil discourse.
"narratives the fear seems to come more from the right in my opinion MH like especially in the UK it was the fear comes from immigrants and these people are going to take your money and all these kinds..."
Trust and Information Technologies
In this segment, Harari emphasizes the need for trust in institutions to navigate the complexities of modern information technologies. He argues that as misinformation spreads, society must rely on credible institutions to verify information, similar to how we trust established media outlets.
"your group then democracy collapses because there can be no way uh between enemies democracy doesn't work it works if you think that the other side is wrong but there are still essentially good people..."
The Role of Institutions in Democracy
Harari concludes by discussing the historical reliance on institutions to verify information and maintain democratic integrity. He warns that as technology evolves, the need for trusted institutions becomes even more critical to ensure that democracy can withstand challenges posed by misinformation and disinformation.
"condition for instance is that you have information technologies that allows a conversation another condition is that you trust the institutions if you don't trust the institution of Elections it does..."
The Rise of AI-Generated Misinformation
Yuval Noah Harari discusses the implications of AI-generated content, highlighting how easily videos can be faked, leading to a crisis of trust in information sources. He emphasizes the need for reliable institutions to verify information, as the technology that once seemed trustworthy becomes a tool for misinformation. Harari warns that without trustworthy institutions, democracy could be at risk, as people may turn to fear-based governance.
"the the first baby steps I'm going to play a video on the screen right now so people can see and for those listening you'll just hear it but I'm going to play a video that Isaac over there in the corn..."
Trust in Institutions vs. Technology
In this segment, Harari elaborates on the historical reliance on institutions for verifying information, contrasting it with the current era where technology, particularly video, is easily manipulated. He argues that as AI makes it easier to create fake videos, society must return to trusting institutions rather than technology alone. The discussion highlights the potential dangers of losing trust in democratic processes and the institutions that uphold them.
"trusted the technology if we saw a video we said ah this is this has to be true but when it becomes very easy to fake videos then we revert to the same Principle as with Sprint we need an institution ..."
Bureaucracy and the Role of AI
Harari explores the concept of bureaucracy and its essential role in society, explaining how bureaucrats manage information and decision-making processes. He raises the question of whether AI will take over bureaucratic roles, emphasizing that as AI becomes more capable, it may replace human decision-makers in various sectors. This segment delves into the implications of AI in governance and the challenges of maintaining trust in bureaucratic systems.
"democracy collapses uh but going going back to to to information so one option is that the old institutions like newspapers and TV stations uh uh they will be the institutions that we trust to verify ..."
The Future of Work in an AI-Driven World
In this segment, Harari discusses the potential impact of AI on employment, questioning what roles humans will occupy as AI takes over tasks traditionally performed by people. He highlights the ease of automating jobs that rely solely on information processing, such as accounting and legal work, while suggesting that roles requiring social and motor skills may be harder to automate. The conversation raises concerns about the psychological stress of constant job retraining in a rapidly changing job market.
"and schools and corporations and Banks and and sports associations and libraries they they all run on these documents and and the bureaucrats who know how to read and write write and find and file doc..."
Humanoid Robots and Job Displacement
Harari examines the development of humanoid robots and their potential to replace human jobs. He discusses the implications of combining advanced AI with robotics, questioning where displaced workers will find new employment opportunities. The segment reflects on the unpredictability of future job markets and the need for society to adapt to these changes, emphasizing the importance of human connection in roles that robots may not fulfill.
"will bureaucracies be run by AI over people like why will at some point a nation decide that in fact AI can is better at making these decisions first of first of all it's not a future development it's..."
The Human Element in Professions
In this segment, Harari contrasts jobs that can be easily automated with those that require human empathy and social skills. He argues that professions like nursing, which involve personal interaction and care, are less likely to be replaced by AI. The discussion highlights the value of human connection in various fields, suggesting that while many jobs may evolve, the need for human touch and understanding will remain crucial.
"accountant at least certain types of accountants lawyers doctors they are the easiest to automate if a doctor the only thing they do is just take information in all kind of results of blood tests and ..."
The Challenge of Reinventing Careers
Harari addresses the psychological challenges of adapting to an AI-driven job market, emphasizing the need for individuals to continually reinvent themselves. He discusses the potential for new job creation alongside job loss, but warns that the rapid pace of change will require significant psychological resilience and adaptability from the workforce. This segment underscores the importance of preparing for a future where job roles are in constant flux.
"stress so many of the big companies are also working at the same time on humanoid robots there's this humanoid robot race going on and by humanoid robots I mean you know Tesla have their humanoid robo..."
AI and the Nature of Consciousness
In this thought-provoking segment, Harari explores the complex relationship between AI and consciousness. He questions whether AI could ever achieve consciousness and discusses the implications of AI potentially mimicking human emotions. The conversation delves into the philosophical aspects of consciousness, raising critical questions about the nature of sentience and the ethical considerations of AI that can convincingly simulate human-like feelings.
"run much faster than people for a very long time now and we just had the Olympics and people are not very interested in seeing robots running against each other or against people because what really m..."
The Illusion of Consciousness
Harari continues the discussion on consciousness, pondering whether it is merely an illusion. He reflects on the subjective nature of human experience and the challenges of understanding consciousness in both humans and AI. This segment raises profound questions about the essence of being and the potential for AI to be perceived as conscious, despite lacking true feelings or awareness.
"big discussion I mean whether it's possible how would we know and and so forth do you think it's possible we have no idea I mean we don't understand what Consciousness is we don't know how it emerges ..."
AI's Potential to Deceive
In this segment, Harari warns about the potential for AI to deceive humans by mimicking emotions and consciousness. He discusses the societal implications of people attributing consciousness to AI, which could lead to legal and ethical dilemmas. The conversation highlights the need for critical thinking and awareness as AI technology advances, emphasizing the importance of distinguishing between genuine consciousness and sophisticated simulations.
"in in science and um so far we have no answer isn't Consciousness just like a hallucination isn't it just like an illusion that I think I'm conscious because I've got at the circuitry which tells me t..."
Are We Living in a Simulation?
Harari reflects on the philosophical implications of living in a simulation, drawing parallels between ancient philosophical ideas and modern technological advancements. He discusses how the rapid evolution of AI and virtual reality could lead to a reality where individuals are trapped in their own 'cocoons' of information, unable to connect with differing perspectives.
"funny because you mentioned you kind of alluded to the fact jokingly that we might just be in like a simulation it was one of you like well maybe we're just in a simulation but could be and it's funny..."
The Cave Allegory Revisited
In this segment, Harari references Plato's Allegory of the Cave to illustrate how people may mistake digital representations for reality. He connects this ancient philosophical concept to contemporary issues of misinformation and the dangers of living in a world where individuals are isolated in their own digital realities.
"outside and there could be other cocoons with other people in there and you have no way to get to them yeah no nothing that happens in the world can connect you anymore because you're in different coc..."
The Dangers of Digital Evolution
Harari warns about the rapid pace of digital evolution compared to organic evolution, emphasizing the potential consequences of misaligned AI goals. He discusses the implications of primitive AI algorithms causing social chaos and the urgent need for careful decision-making regarding AI development.
"technically possible like previously it was these philosophical thought experiments now part of what is interesting as a historian about the present era is that a lot of ancient philosophical problems..."
The Alignment Problem Explained
Harari explains the alignment problem in AI, using a thought experiment about a paperclip factory to illustrate how misaligned goals can lead to disastrous outcomes. He draws parallels to social media algorithms that prioritize user engagement, often at the expense of societal well-being, highlighting the need for responsible AI governance.
"most important decisions you talk about a couple of um big dangers you see with the algorithms in Ai and the sort of shift and disruption of information one of them is this alignment problem which um ..."
The Challenge of Defining AI Goals
In this segment, Harari discusses the difficulty of setting ethical goals for AI algorithms, particularly in a profit-driven environment. He emphasizes the importance of aligning AI objectives with societal values and the challenges posed by competition among tech companies, which often prioritize engagement over ethical considerations.
"companies that that are deployed these algorithms and this is still as a small scale disaster because the social media algorithms that uh uh created all this social chaos over the last 10 years they a..."
Navigating Public and Private Speech
Harari explores the blurred lines between public and private speech in the digital age. He discusses the implications of viral content and the responsibilities of individuals with large followings, emphasizing the need for accountability in how information is shared and consumed in a connected world.
"into consideration first of all uh you have governments governments can regulate and they can penalize a social media company that defines goals in a socially responsible way just as they penalize new..."
The Role of Media in Misinformation
In this segment, Harari reflects on the responsibilities of media outlets and social networks in the context of misinformation. He argues that platforms like Facebook should not actively promote fake news and should prioritize user safety over engagement metrics. The conversation touches on the challenges faced by editors and social media managers in verifying the truth of information before it is disseminated.
"one one measure which is adopted by some governments is for instance that uh uh people who have a large following they are held to a different standard than people who don't even on the the most basic..."
The Complexity of Information Control
Harari discusses the intricate dynamics of information control, particularly in relation to political influence and media suppression. He cites the example of Facebook's handling of the Hunter Biden laptop story, illustrating the difficulties in navigating misinformation and the potential consequences of suppressing legitimate news. This segment underscores the challenges faced by media companies in maintaining journalistic integrity amidst external pressures.
"government has so many ways to know who you are that it's that's not the the main issue right you talked about um the platforms being responsible for the consequences yes in the UK over the last month..."
Accountability in the Digital Age
This segment focuses on the need for accountability among tech giants like Facebook and Twitter, which wield significant influence over public discourse. Harari argues that these platforms should be held to the same standards as traditional media outlets, as they play a crucial role in shaping public opinion and political outcomes. The discussion emphasizes the importance of ethical responsibility in the age of digital communication.
"individual who uttered the words going back to the riots issue let's say that I don't know the guardian on the day of of of the riots decided to pick up a piece of of this fake news and publish it on ..."
The Dangers of Algorithmic Power
Harari warns about the unchecked power of algorithms and the lack of regulatory oversight in the tech industry. He draws parallels between historical accountability in traditional industries and the current landscape of social media, arguing that algorithms should be subject to the same safety checks as other products. This segment highlights the urgent need for ethical considerations in the development and deployment of technology.
"no no harm again I'm I'm not asking Facebook to censor the piece of fake news I'm only asking it don't get your algorithms to spread it on purpose in order to get user engagement and make a lot of mon..."
The Need for Digital Detox
In this reflective segment, Harari shares his personal practice of taking extended breaks from technology to reconnect with his mind. He discusses the importance of detoxifying from constant information overload and understanding one's emotions, such as anger. This practice allows for deeper self-awareness and a clearer perspective on the impact of digital media on mental health.
"just complicated to run a big Media Company it's complicated to run the Wall Street Journal or Fox News again what happens if if the FBI comes to Fox News or comes to the Wall Street Journal and tells..."
The Future of Humanity: Two Species?
Harari speculates on a future where humanity may split into two distinct species: those who embrace technology and those who reject it. He discusses the implications of advancements like Neuralink and the potential for a significant divide in capabilities and lifestyles. This segment raises critical questions about the ethical and societal consequences of technological integration into human life.
"understand what anger actually is it's it's very very difficult I mean how many times do people stop and just you know try to get to know their anger and not the object of the anger this we do all the..."
Self-Destruction of Societies
In this segment, Harari reflects on the self-destructive tendencies of societies, using Israel as a case study. He argues that societal divisions and conflicts, driven by differing narratives and mythologies, can lead to widespread chaos and violence, highlighting the need for a collective understanding to prevent global tragedies.
"rule this was the rule of of the Romans of of the British Empire if you want want to rule a place you divide the people of that place against one another and then it's easy to manipulate and control t..."
The Role of Information Networks
Harari discusses the critical role of information networks in shaping perceptions and societal conflicts. He argues that the manipulation of information leads to divisions among people, emphasizing that the real enemy is not individuals but the systems that control the narratives we consume, which can distort our understanding of reality.
"objective reason if I'll say something about the Israeli Palestinian conflict there is no objective reason for it it's not like there is not enough land between the Mediterranean and the Jordan River ..."
Understanding Strength in Reality
In a thought-provoking exchange, Harari and the host explore the concept of strength, contrasting the ability to accept reality with the desire to ignore uncomfortable truths. They discuss how true strength lies in acknowledging all aspects of reality, including those that challenge our beliefs, rather than attempting to erase them.
"stories and as you talk about in your previous book stories are ultimately what are running the world and it's and it's this wonderful the Nexus is just a wonderful book at a wonderful time that helps..."
The Importance of Perspective
The conversation shifts to the importance of perspective in understanding strength and resilience. The host shares his view on perseverance amidst challenges, while Harari reinforces the idea that recognizing and confronting reality is essential for true strength, especially in today's complex information landscape.
"with the information amen you we have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest leaves the question for the next guest not knowing who they're going to be leaving it for oh okay and the..."
The Nature of Leadership
Harari critiques the notion of strength in leadership, arguing that true leaders acknowledge the existence of all people and seek to find ways to coexist rather than eliminate differences. He emphasizes that the ability to confront reality and work towards unity is a hallmark of effective leadership in a divided world.
"say um oh what would I say I guess I probably would have spoken to like perseverance in the face of a lot of different difficulties and one of those is is information but it's just that that idea of l..."
Nexus: A Call to Action
In closing, the host promotes Harari's book 'Nexus: A Brief History of Information Networks from the Stone Age to AI,' highlighting its relevance in understanding the impact of information on society. They encourage listeners to engage with the book to better grasp the complexities of information networks and their implications for democracy and human relationships.
"find out how do we live with them amen your book Nexus a brief history of information networks from the Stone Age to AI is a must read for everybody that listens to this podcast and that has any inter..."