"most people unfortunately are first order thinkers they very rarely take secondary and tertiary effects into formula for thinking about something when you design protocols if they're successful you mi..."

"back where um I as you mentioned I work on the ethereum protocol and it's kind of a weird uh it's it's a weird thing to work on right it's not quite a product um it's not quite like a technology platf..."

"parts of protocols that seem like narratives and I personally have been very interested in that aspect and I've been writing some essays on like protocol narratives and in a sort of more technical exa..."

"I guess this all this will show like the the different background that I come from from from Red Cat you know like I I always think of these things from like a very just uh dry perspective like you kn..."

"the the rules as constraints uh in the beginning is is a good jumping off point I I've been reading the god Problem by Howard Bloom I don't know if you guys have read that but uh he he he leads in wit..."

"quick thing add on that is um this segue pretty well into another theme that was recurrent for us which was like the idea of like dangerous protocols and you know the them being entrenched and Lasting..."

"um I feel like I have conflicting thoughts um but it feels to me like the barrier to entry to create protocols is maybe lowering because you get distribution through the internet you get better tools ..."

"the 200e story you actually go into that at some level of detail looking at pre-industrial protocols uh all the way up through the industrial era and now to our current ERA in which uh you you find me..."

"the best way to allow protocols to build and if we borrow from uh development open source closed source what what do you guys think I yeah I think this is really hard I mean this is why I started this..."

"Protocols are so malleable and sort of interoperable interoperable so you know you saying how a protocol a building protocol Thor P think about ethereum and that sort of thing and also if there's such..."

"now and and you uh make that point rather clearly that you you make the case that uh training people to be protocols first type thinkers is going to hopefully replace uh you know uh the nation state t..."

"I think and I go back to the handwashing example I'm sure you're both very familiar with the Syble Weiss uh experience when he took over the um the ward for pregnant women uh in Vienna and this is bac..."

"another aspect that you spend time on in in your work is the fictional treatment of protocols I I was really intrigued by that uh because fiction can can be very transformative if it's done right and ..."

"game of life and the what emerged from it from these very simple rules is this something that you could kind of go protocol hunting in silico could you maybe like set up a series of simple rules and t..."

"connecting this back to what you said about the game of life like um now that I think of it the game of life it's a cellular automaton but it's basically deterministic it's a grid and the rules apply ..."

"brings up the a question in my mind which is you know I you read about uh uh like military for example heavily uh protocol oriented and and yet you needed a boid to rewrite a lot of those protocols ri..."

"you mentioned you know when you think of companies you know agility is like a you know something that that that you you see is like a side of success I think for protocols it's a bit different because..."

"slightly but let's go back to something B mentioned earlier um and you sort of you mentioned it in the context of stories and storytelling but one thing I really noticed from the retrospective was tha..."

"so uh this is absolutely fascinating I I think that this is a great project because I think you're right uh and that explicitly looking at this and thinking about it and having these Challenge questio..."