All Segments
Gymshark CEO: How I Built A $1.5 Billion Business At 19! Ben Francis
62 segments available
This weeks episode entitled 'Gymshark CEO: How I built A $1.5 Billion Business At 19:' topics: 0:00 Intro 02:18 Your early years 15:16 Co-founders 18:15 Developing yourself personally & within Gymshark 36:00 The Worst Character traits in business 38:34 Learning how to speak infront of people & a camera 45:57 Why are you vlogging inside gymshark? 51:06 Gymshark through the pandemic 58:32 What do you wish you knew sooner in business? 01:03:42 Struggles with business personally 01:13:57 The future of Gymshark 01:27:19 Advice for young entrepreneurs 01:33:34 The last guests question Ben: https://www.instagram.com/benfrancis/ https://twitter.com/BenFrancis1992?s=20 @BenFrancis Listen on: Apple podcast - https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-diary-of-a-ceo-by-steven-bartlett/id1291423644 Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/show/7iQXmUT7XGuZSzAMjoNWlX FOLLOW ► Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/steven/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/SteveBartlettSC Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/steven-bartlett-56986834/ Sponsor - https://uk.huel.com/
Segments Timeline
The Vision Behind Gymshark
Ben Francis shares his early vision for Gymshark, emphasizing his passion for creating an iconic brand that inspires people globally. He reflects on his self-assessment during the initial stages, acknowledging his introverted nature and the importance of hard work in achieving success.
"if we go right back to the start i had a vision i had an idea and i was so passionate about it i just want jim sharp to be a truly iconic great brand a leader in culture and helps inspire people aroun..."
Lessons from Family and Early Experiences
Ben discusses pivotal moments from his childhood that shaped his entrepreneurial spirit, including work experience with his grandfather. He highlights the value of hard work and the lessons learned from family members, which laid the foundation for his future business endeavors.
"ben when i look back on my life i only in hindsight have managed to start piecing together some pieces that have enlightened me to why i became the person i went on to become and why i had the interes..."
The Importance of Practical Learning
Ben reflects on his educational journey, particularly his experience with BTEC IT courses that equipped him with essential skills in software like Photoshop and Dreamweaver. He connects these skills to the practical aspects of building Gymshark and the significance of hands-on learning.
"i ended up getting into sixth form i was super lucky and one of the classes that i took then was a b tech and i t and that i don't know if you remember the b text you had a levels or b text i'm not su..."
Surrounding Yourself with Great People
As Gymshark began to grow, Ben realized the necessity of surrounding himself with talented individuals. He shares how he sought mentorship and advice from experienced professionals, emphasizing the importance of collaboration and learning from others in the entrepreneurial journey.
"from i've always wondered this because you yeah last time we spoke and in subsequent interviews you've always cited those people like steven who was the ceo of jim shark and others as being really rea..."
Adapting to Business Growth
Ben discusses the challenges of evolving as a leader during Gymshark's growth. He reflects on the need to change his mindset from a singular vision to embracing collaboration and adaptability, highlighting the difficulties of managing a growing team and the importance of self-awareness.
"questions of anyone whether they're in the gym and i know there's people right there in the gym that i've asked questions too that probably rolled their eyes and thought oh god here he is again but i ..."
Navigating Loyalty and Growth
Ben shares the emotional challenges of managing relationships with loyal team members as Gymshark grows. He discusses the heartbreak of needing to step back from personal relationships to build a business that benefits everyone, emphasizing the need for self-awareness in leadership.
"challenges along the way i can agree more i always say i've said this on this podcast before but i ended up hiring like just really ambitious people that would like sleep on the floor with me that had..."
The Co-Founder Dynamic
Ben reflects on his relationship with co-founder Lewis, discussing their differing visions for Gymshark and the impact of Lewis's departure. He highlights the importance of having clear roles and responsibilities in a growing business and how their lack of structure contributed to their eventual separation.
"that's best for everyone that is going to help grow it so those are the sorts of things that i think you can never truly be prepared for and it's always hard um and yeah it was difficult i started soc..."
The Importance of Co-Founders
In this segment, Ben discusses the significance of having a co-founder during the early stages of a business. He shares his experience after Lewis left Gymshark, noting the challenges of transitioning to a solo leadership role and how it changed the dynamics of the company.
"were you friends before we yeah we were yeah well so we met in that it class that i spoke about so we met in it when we were 16 17 whatever the first year of sort of post school is college sussex form..."
Evolving as a Leader
Ben talks about his personal growth and evolution as a leader since the early days of Gymshark. He reflects on how he became the face of the business and the importance of self-reflection in developing his public speaking and people management skills.
"our vision started to maybe move in separate directions could that have been why then because there wasn't clear like structure at the start that could well have been to be fair yeah because that's wh..."
From Nervousness to Confidence
Ben shares his journey from being a nervous entrepreneur to gaining confidence in public speaking and leadership. He emphasizes the importance of self-awareness and the need for young entrepreneurs to recognize that growth and development are possible.
"going forward so talk to me about that so first time we met i it was actually on a different series i was running at the time called like everyday entrepreneurs or something and when i met you at jim ..."
Identifying Strengths and Weaknesses
In this segment, Ben discusses the importance of self-awareness in personal development. He encourages entrepreneurs to assess their character traits and not to identify with negative aspects, advocating for a logical approach to self-improvement.
"entrepreneur everything's just amplified right your your wins are bigger your losses are larger again um your weaknesses are you know are exposed because you are exposed to the business and the world ..."
The Impact of 360 Feedback
Ben recounts his experience with 360 feedback and the emotional impact it had on him. He reflects on the importance of receiving honest feedback from peers and how it can lead to significant personal growth and self-awareness.
"so i'm not good at people management fine who's the best person i know that is i'm going to go and chat to them i'm going to pick their brains or even better i'm just gonna watch them because some peo..."
Confronting Self-Delusion
Ben discusses the challenge of confronting one's own delusions and ego when receiving feedback. He shares a pivotal moment when he realized the importance of acknowledging his weaknesses and the necessity of change for personal and professional growth.
"and i actually did this in it was around when we met so around 2015 and i had it and i printed it off and i read it and i was so upset and annoyed and i remember thinking this is not me and i took it ..."
Focusing on Strengths vs. Weaknesses
In this segment, Ben explores the dilemma of whether to focus on improving weaknesses or to lean into strengths. He shares his decision to concentrate on his strengths in creativity and marketing, illustrating how this choice shaped his role at Gymshark.
"that was the moment i realized i have to change i have to improve i have to develop and if you're talking about becoming self-aware i think that was my moment so incredibly true how our partners know ..."
Embracing Strengths Over Weaknesses
Ben Francis discusses the pivotal moment when he decided to focus on his strengths rather than his weaknesses in business. He reflects on the importance of self-awareness and how he leveraged his creativity and marketing skills at Gymshark, especially after bringing in a new CEO. This decision marked a significant turning point in his leadership journey.
"and especially when you're a winner when you've been successful in one thing it validates you it almost appears to be like validation of everything so what do you do then what do you do next yeah you'..."
The Transition of Leadership
In this segment, Ben shares his experience of transitioning leadership roles within Gymshark. He talks about the emotional challenges of stepping back from certain responsibilities and the motivation he found in watching others excel in roles he once held. This reflection highlights the balance between trust and control in leadership.
"completely innocently focused on that that was your decision yeah it's a pretty amazing decision it was heartbreaking as well because again it's one thing moving yourself out of a role it's another th..."
Building a Diverse Skill Set
Ben Francis elaborates on his journey through various roles at Gymshark, from CEO to Chief of Brand and Marketing. He emphasizes the importance of gaining a comprehensive understanding of different business areas and how this diverse experience prepared him for the challenges of leading a rapidly growing company.
"that really helped him and this was the beginning i think of the period where i was sort of becoming a ceo because i i started off as the chief of brand right so the business was smaller at this stage..."
The Challenge of Leadership
Ben discusses the challenges and responsibilities that come with being the CEO of Gymshark. He reflects on his desire to not just be a founder but to actively lead and grow the business. This segment captures his ambition and the personal growth he seeks in his role as a leader.
"was tech for a little bit um i've moved around a lot so this this ceo role is it's the first genuine home i've found since sort of running the business back in 2013 2014 and and why why why did you so..."
The Drive to Succeed
In this segment, Ben expresses his pride in founding Gymshark and his commitment to its future. He shares his motivation to continuously improve as a CEO and the excitement he feels about the challenges ahead. This reflects his passion for the brand and his ambition to lead it to greater heights.
"where i can which is which was great uh that he would be so honest and open about that and then we had a two-year period of okay like are we gonna bring someone in from the outside or ben are you gonn..."
Choosing the Hard Path
Ben explains why he chose to step back into the demanding role of CEO despite the option to enjoy a more relaxed lifestyle. He emphasizes his love for the work, the people, and the challenges that come with leading Gymshark. This segment highlights his dedication and the personal fulfillment he derives from his role.
"three after year four and five for me i'm proud of the fact that i founded the business i'm proud of the fact that i've worked in the chiefs roles but to be in the front seat in the ceo role a busines..."
Learning from Feedback
Ben reflects on his growth as a leader and how he learned to give constructive feedback without being harsh. He discusses the importance of empathy and understanding in leadership, showcasing his evolution from a more direct approach to a more considerate one.
"be the best version of myself possible when i have genuine ambitions to be a great chief exec of this business one day i don't think i'm anywhere near there now and it's a bit like you know someone ha..."
Valuing Diverse Perspectives
In this segment, Ben shares his thoughts on the importance of challenging ideas within his team. He emphasizes that he values diverse opinions and does not want a culture of agreement. This approach fosters innovation and adaptability in a rapidly changing business environment.
"of a dick and you and so what happens now in terms of how have you learned not to be a dick uh learn to give feedback examples with feedback empathy understanding why people do certain things like und..."
The Importance of Adaptability
Ben discusses the traits he values in his team, particularly adaptability in a fast-paced environment. He highlights how the business landscape has changed over the years and the necessity for team members to embrace change rather than resist it.
"because of the world that we're in like 10 years ago facebook was only small snapchat didn't really exist instagram barely existed um shopify was very small like the ecosystem in the world that we pla..."
Public Speaking Evolution
Ben reflects on his journey to becoming a confident public speaker. He contrasts his early nervousness with his current ability to articulate ideas effectively, discussing the importance of practice and experience in developing this skill.
"the things you've started recently as well as your vlog online um and if we go back to when i that day that i first met you and i i could tell that you you know you were nervous in that context and th..."
Overcoming Public Speaking Anxiety
In this segment, Ben shares his initial struggles with public speaking and how he turned weaknesses into strengths. He discusses the significance of preparation, using reminders and phrases to ease nervousness, and the importance of gaining comfort through experience, which ultimately led to his success as a speaker.
"public speaking was one of the many things on my list which was a weakness but i didn't then immediately go and draw out a plan i just had that list and i said i know i think i had it as my wallpaper ..."
The Power of Preparation
Ben emphasizes the importance of preparation in public speaking, sharing a Winston Churchill quote that resonates with him. He explains how having prepared phrases and stories helped him overcome initial nervousness, allowing him to speak fluently about the Gymshark story and engage effectively with audiences.
"being terrible at it but you know that's just a necessary evil to get get good at anything really what did the public speaking lessons was there like key principles or key exercises that that you felt..."
Building Comfort on Stage
Ben discusses how becoming comfortable with public speaking has transformed his approach to presentations. He reflects on the evolution of his speaking style, noting that preparation has allowed him to process questions thoughtfully and respond confidently, highlighting the stages of learning he experienced along the way.
"me that's so funny because that's exactly what happens from practice isn't it you'll know that now just go back to it exactly i you know when i i do a lot of interviewing interviews and stuff too and ..."
The Importance of Authenticity
In this segment, Ben discusses the significance of being an authentic CEO in today's world. He contrasts the traditional 'black box' approach of CEOs with his own 'glass box' philosophy, emphasizing the value of transparency and how sharing his journey can help others learn from his experiences.
"learned about you know different things as i go on and you know so this has led you to now because you know what you're i watched your videos back then and maybe this is why i was surprised when i met..."
Vlogging as a CEO
Ben explains his decision to vlog as the CEO of Gymshark, breaking the mold of traditional corporate communication. He shares how his personal experiences and the stories behind Gymshark can inspire others, reinforcing the idea that entrepreneurship is accessible and achievable for anyone willing to put in the effort.
"but in wider society if you've never tried it all i'll ask you to do is give it a try and if you like me then you will like the world berry ready to drink you'll like the mac and cheese which is just ..."
Navigating Luck and Timing
Ben candidly discusses the role of luck and timing in Gymshark's success. He acknowledges the fortunate circumstances that contributed to the company's growth while encouraging others to recognize opportunities in their own lives, emphasizing that success is possible with the right mindset and approach.
"and being able to learn about those stories that eventually led to in many ways the gym shot we see today i think i would love to be able to provide that to other people around the world particularly ..."
Lessons from the Gymshark Journey
In this segment, Ben reflects on the lessons learned from his entrepreneurial journey with Gymshark. He emphasizes that even if someone doesn't want to start their own business, there are valuable insights to be gained from his experiences, encouraging listeners to take inspiration from his story.
"things happening elsewhere in the world right now that you know probably aren't being completely taken advantage of so i am aware of the fact that it's luck but i also think as well in me doing this i..."
The Importance of Personal Branding
Ben Francis discusses the significance of personal branding for CEOs, referencing public figures like Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg. He shares his initial reluctance to engage on social media during Gymshark's early days, emphasizing the need for leaders to control their narrative to avoid misrepresentation.
"that that's actually not him and some ceos out there like elon and these really public ones have that and then zuckerberg hidden a k for the last 10 years and in 2019 he announced that he was finally ..."
Navigating the Pandemic as a CEO
Ben reflects on his experience as CEO during the COVID-19 pandemic, highlighting Gymshark's preparedness for remote work. He discusses the challenges of managing a global team and the importance of mental health support during uncertain times.
"understand the idea of just knuckling down and focusing on what you're good at but you're right the problem that comes with is other people get to control the rhetoric or the language or the descripti..."
The Shift to Remote Work
In this segment, Ben talks about the transition to remote work during the pandemic. He shares insights on how Gymshark adapted quickly due to its digital infrastructure and reflects on the varying experiences of employees working from home.
"pandemic comes around um talk me through how it was being a ceo throughout that because one of the really remarkable things is you didn't follow anybody you didn't no we didn't so i wasn't ceo at the ..."
The Role of Office Culture
Ben emphasizes the importance of office culture and community at Gymshark. He discusses how being in the office fosters learning and collaboration, especially for younger employees, and the company's commitment to creating a supportive work environment.
"be really just really tough for some people from a professional perspective and then i'm chatting to my mom who worked at the qe in birmingham city center uh hospital in selly oak she was telling me a..."
Managing Growth and Pressure
Ben shares his thoughts on managing the pressures of rapid growth at Gymshark. He reflects on the challenges of scaling the business and the importance of maintaining a strong company culture amidst constant change.
"office you you have this big amazing office in the uk especially i mean you have a few but the one in birmingham yes sully hall is a tremendous new like newly built campus almost that he's built um wh..."
Learning from Early Mistakes
In this segment, Ben discusses the lessons he learned from early mistakes in building Gymshark. He highlights the importance of investing in foundational aspects of the business, such as operations and finance, to support long-term growth.
"based in hq um personally you're right the whole thing about like i said earlier being able to watch steve right was massive for my development so if i'm a youngster that's coming in to work at gymsha..."
The Value of Great Talent
Ben reflects on the significance of surrounding oneself with great talent. He shares experiences from a trip where he met top entrepreneurs and emphasizes the importance of hiring skilled individuals to drive business success.
"business one of the things you you know when i hear your story um no matter where i look it it does feel like you're just incredibly good at dealing with [ __ ] like it it appears on the surface that ..."
Pressure as a Privilege
Ben discusses the concept of pressure as a privilege within the context of Gymshark. He reflects on the unique challenges and opportunities that come with leading a rapidly growing company and the mindset required to thrive under pressure.
"majority of people in jim sharp maybe aren't as aware of the story or the way that the business works or or haven't been truly immersed in the culture both because they haven't been here for a long ti..."
Embracing Failure in Business
In this segment, Ben talks about the inevitability of failure in business. He shares insights on how to approach setbacks and the importance of resilience and adaptability in overcoming challenges.
"when i when i reflect on early days of starting my business there was a lot of unknown unknowns a lot of things i wish someone had just told me sooner or a lesson that it took me three or four years t..."
The Journey of Self-Discovery
Ben reflects on his personal journey of self-discovery as a CEO. He discusses the importance of self-awareness and continuous learning in leadership, and how these elements contribute to building a successful business.
"club player these are like premier league international stars they were like another level compared to what i was and we were in the business so to be able to see those when you see a great operator l..."
Coping with Business Stress
Ben opens up about his experiences with stress and anxiety as a CEO. He contrasts his approach to managing stress with that of others, emphasizing the importance of mental health and support systems in the workplace.
"it's too late yeah until too late and the for me i think like in terms of getting so you can talk about getting great people becoming self-aware becoming the best version of it yourself that you possi..."
The Weight of Public Scrutiny
Ben opens up about a challenging moment when Gymshark faced backlash due to a social media incident. He describes the emotional toll it took on him, including feelings of anxiety and the burden of public scrutiny. This segment highlights the pressures of leadership and the impact of external criticism on mental health.
"um it doesn't seem to have touched you in the same way i mean have you ever experienced anxiety or yeah i've listened i've definitely struggled there were points where again when i was first sort of i..."
Resilience in Leadership
Ben discusses the necessity of resilience in leadership, especially when facing public challenges. He reflects on the importance of supporting his team while managing his own emotions. This segment emphasizes the balance between personal feelings and professional responsibilities, showcasing Ben's commitment to his role as a leader.
"threats everything you can imagine um and that that was in that definitely hit me and it definitely hurt me and i really felt like i felt carrying that i felt like i was carrying that burden at that p..."
Navigating Mistakes and Growth
In this segment, Ben talks about how he handled the situation with the employee who made the controversial comment. He emphasizes the importance of learning from mistakes and fostering a culture of growth rather than punishment. Ben's perspective on cancel culture and the value of second chances is a key takeaway.
"understanding of it what did that moment teach you i think it's it was a so that was a bout of resilience so going back to what i said earlier every day i feel like i have to be resilient in terms of ..."
Support Systems in Tough Times
Ben shares how his partner, Robin, provides support during challenging times. He discusses the difficulty of expressing emotions and the generational patterns of masculinity that influence his communication style. This segment highlights the importance of having a support system and the ongoing journey of emotional expression.
"informed person because of it and i think that's um that's the way it is like i that what you can't have at gymshark or anywhere you can't have someone that fails particularly with good intentions and..."
Breaking Generational Cycles
Ben reflects on the generational cycles of emotional expression in his family and how he aims to break them. He discusses the importance of encouraging open communication with future children and the desire to be present in their lives. This segment emphasizes the significance of emotional intelligence and parenting.
"it's probably not the most optimal solution and i'm learning to do that but um it's given me great resilience it's made me strong um definitely made me mentally strong so yeah i'll i'll chat to robin ..."
Balancing Business and Family
In this segment, Ben contemplates the challenges of balancing a demanding career with family life. He expresses concerns about being present for future children while managing his responsibilities as CEO. This discussion highlights the struggle many entrepreneurs face in prioritizing family amidst their professional ambitions.
"so now you're married and you know one would assume that there's going to be kids at some point potentially is that something you think about like the uh i don't know i mean listen if i had a kid i wo..."
The Vision for Gymshark's Future
Ben shares his ambitious vision for Gymshark, aiming to establish it as a globally iconic British fitness brand. He discusses the importance of creating a brand that inspires people and fosters community. This segment encapsulates Ben's aspirations for Gymshark's growth and cultural impact.
"was like my mom was like cool with that she gets it's fine my dad would work a lot in like the states in europe and stuff and then my mom would look after us so i'd go and stay with my grandparents fo..."
Defining Success and Legacy
Ben reflects on what success looks like for Gymshark and the potential challenges of achieving his goals. He discusses the concept of legacy and the emotional complexities that come with reaching one's ambitions. This segment concludes with a thought-provoking exploration of success and its implications.
"nike or an adidas or whoever it might be what can you tell me about the future of jim shark so my ambition is to make so so in canada you've got lulu in the united states you've got um nike and drama ..."
The Journey Over the Destination
Ben discusses the idea that the journey of building Gymshark is more fulfilling than reaching a specific destination. He reflects on the challenges of defining when a brand becomes iconic and the importance of continuous growth and adaptation in business.
"years time we wake up jim shark is a truly iconic british brand globally you've done it now what i'll be really sad i'll have nothing to do um no i'm not sure at that point i don't know it's so funny ..."
Preparing for Change
Ben talks about the inevitability of change in business and how Gymshark prepares its team for unexpected challenges. He emphasizes the need for agility and a culture that embraces change as a constant factor in a growing company.
"it's a continual process and also at times you'll get things pop the world will change and we all might go to the metaverse yeah and that's going to be a whole new challenge for you to maintain the po..."
Navigating Growth with a Lean Team
Ben explains how Gymshark, with its relatively small team of 900, maintains agility in a rapidly changing market. He contrasts this with larger competitors and discusses the importance of strategic initiatives and resource allocation.
"sense to set the team up for so in terms of nuts and bolts we'll have something that we call a brand book which is brand guidelines this is what we do this is what we don't do we'll have a strategic p..."
The High Street Dilemma
Ben reflects on Gymshark's decision to avoid high street stores until now, citing resource constraints. He shares insights on the brand's offline presence and hints at plans for a flagship store that will serve as a community hub.
"us this window like you've described macro factors with this surfboard we surf in and we'd capitalize on them the moment yeah um is there a mindset thing a way that you speak to your teams to make sur..."
Creating a Community Hub
Ben discusses the vision for Gymshark's first permanent store, emphasizing the importance of creating an experience-based community rather than just a retail space. He aims for the store to embody the brand's values and foster a sense of belonging.
"the constant change of a growing business creates a culture of a culture of change when these things do happen i'd like to think we're in a reasonable situation to deal with it and we are agile as wel..."
Maintaining Brand Specialness
Ben addresses the challenge of keeping Gymshark's brand identity special as it scales globally. He emphasizes the importance of staying true to the brand's core values and the unique culture that has developed since its inception.
"blow up of the brand was through an offline event um and then we did expose around the world and we spent every single penny we had flying around the world now in our early 20s doing these events then..."
The Role of Founders in Brand Identity
Ben reflects on the impact of a founder's vision on a brand's identity. He acknowledges that while Gymshark has a strong management team, the unique perspective and passion of the founder are irreplaceable elements that contribute to the brand's specialness.
"we need to think about is what we're trying to build here is a brand and what we don't want is something that is purely based on utility and what i mean is i don't want people to buy gymshark because ..."
Finding Your Passion as an Entrepreneur
Ben offers advice to aspiring entrepreneurs who lack funds or ideas. He stresses the importance of discovering one's true passion and how it can guide the journey of starting a business, sharing his own experiences with Gymshark's evolution.
"well but i think by staying true to that core by focusing completely and early on building the best gym product whether it's clothing whether it's accessories whatever it is we might create down the l..."
Embracing Failure as a Young Entrepreneur
In this segment, Ben discusses the inevitability of failure in entrepreneurship and encourages young entrepreneurs to embrace it. He reflects on his own journey, noting that Gymshark was not his first attempt at building a business. Ben stresses that persistence and learning from failures are crucial for eventual success.
"passion is it's so true because look you can waste a ton of time procrastinating and falling into indecision by trying to guess and as you said there i read that gymshark was actually like the seventh..."
The Power of Stability While Pursuing Dreams
Ben advises aspiring entrepreneurs to maintain their jobs while starting their businesses. He explains how having a stable income allows for reinvestment into the business and provides a safety net in case of failure. This segment underscores the importance of balancing risk with financial security when pursuing entrepreneurial ventures.
"think that's so so so important and everyone i've met by the way from the people that run businesses that are 10 times bigger than jim shark to every entrepreneur that i've met every business person e..."
Hard Work vs. Smart Work
Ben Francis discusses the balance between hard work and smart work in achieving success. He shares his experiences of working long hours while also finding innovative ways to grow Gymshark. This segment highlights that while hard work is essential, working smart is equally important for sustainable success.
"try them and hard work where does that feel what's the importance of it because there's a there's a narrative i talk about this podcast that hard work is maybe a little bit the narrative you see onlin..."
The Gift of Time
In a reflective moment, Ben shares the greatest gift he has received from others: time. He acknowledges the importance of mentorship and support from those around him, including family and colleagues. This segment emphasizes the value of time in personal and professional growth, particularly for entrepreneurs.
"we have a new tradition on the diary of a ceo i've heard about this oh yeah okay they told you okay so um the previous guest writes a question for the next guest and this is the first time i've seen t..."