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Building Your Board | Glenn Kelman
24 segments available
Glenn Kelman, CEO of Redfin, talks through how he built his board of directors, and shares lessons-learned. Topics discussed: -What you’re really looking for: What to look for in an investor who’s joining your board — good board members should love your mission, listen more than they talk, and attend every meeting in-person. Glenn also discussed why it’s good to bring on a fellow operator who can relate to you as a peer (talking about Selina Tobaccowala joining the board. -Take the time to draft a job description: This should cover the background and skills needed in your next board member. Use it to guide your recruiting process. Consider asking founders at similar companies for advice, and use executives and board members from your company to source candidates. -Diversity: Incorporate diversity in the board early on. Interviewing: When interviewing potential board members, don’t focus on being impressive or being impressed. You cannot truly listen in either mode. -Problems are your problems: At the end of the day, the CEO is the one in charge of operating the company. If the product is not selling or working, that is the CEO’s problem — not a board problem. -How to get the most from your meetings: Board meetings should always be held in-person and include printed documents. The act of projecting a powerpoint can diminish participation, and you can lose a lot of people. Afterward, Glenn also recommends that you share most board meeting documents internally with the whole company to maintain transparency. This conversation took place at The Scaleup Offsite, a private CEO gathering hosted by Y Combinator Continuity and Greylock Partners in April 2017.
Segments Timeline
The Journey to a Great Board
Glenn Kelman shares his unexpected journey in building a strong board of directors for Redfin. He reflects on his initial lack of experience and the challenges he faced, emphasizing the importance of finding board members who are passionate about the mission and can form a genuine partnership. Kelman highlights the significance of having a board that understands the business deeply and is committed to its success.
"I'm Glenn um and I'm here to talk about building the board I was surprised that James slavit the Greylock partner asked me to discuss this topic because I've actually had sort of a Frau relationship w..."
Choosing the Right Investors
Kelman discusses the critical decision-making process when selecting investors for your board. He advises founders to evaluate potential partners not just by their firm's reputation but by the personal connection and compatibility with the partner. This segment underscores the long-term nature of board relationships and the importance of choosing wisely.
"for me so the board consists of some Venture capitalists and the hard part about the venture capitalist is especially if you're desperate for money you don't always get to choose who's going to be on ..."
The Value of Operator Experience
In this segment, Glenn emphasizes the importance of recruiting board members with operational experience. He recounts how bringing on operators like Selina Tobaccowala proved beneficial, as they understand the challenges faced by the company. Kelman encourages founders to seek board members who can relate to their experiences and provide relevant insights.
"really spend some time getting to know the people you're raising money from and I would not necessarily choose the firm that has the biggest name although I've heard Greylock has a good name I would c..."
Crafting Job Descriptions for Board Members
Kelman shares his experience in drafting effective job descriptions for board members. He stresses the need for clarity in the skills and backgrounds required, moving beyond vague titles to specific expertise that aligns with the company's needs. This segment highlights the importance of intentionality in board recruitment.
"recruited Selena as one operator and I've never told you this Selena but several employees were hung up on the idea that Selena worked for a company with monkey in the name they said it just doesn't s..."
Navigating Board Dynamics
Glenn reflects on the emotional challenges of working with a board, particularly during stressful times. He shares personal anecdotes about his initial resistance to authority and how he learned to view the board as a supportive entity rather than an adversary. This segment provides insights into managing board relationships and maintaining a productive dynamic.
"write job descriptions for the board members that you're seeking because at first the only job description I ever wrote was big shot and then I called Jeff marwitz and he said you're going to have to ..."
Taking Responsibility as CEO
In this concluding segment, Kelman emphasizes the CEO's ultimate responsibility for the company's success. He advises against blaming the board for operational issues and encourages CEOs to focus on their leadership role. This perspective is crucial for fostering a healthy relationship with the board and ensuring accountability.
"surprised me is I once told the board that something was going to take a little longer than I thought and we were going to need more money and I really expected them to pull the plug to just say it's ..."
Taking Responsibility for Success
In this segment, Glenn reflects on a pivotal moment when he learned to take full responsibility for his company's outcomes. He recounts a conversation with his board that shifted his perspective, illustrating how the CEO must own both successes and failures. Kelman uses the metaphor of driving a car to explain that while the board may provide input, the CEO is in control of the direction and must address the real issues at hand.
"you have gotten wrapped around the axle about the wrong issue and really what helped me get through phase one rage was when Mark Singer told me you should just think about the board as the radio in yo..."
Building Rapport with Your Board
Glenn discusses the importance of open communication with board members, sharing how he built rapport with Mark Singer through running together. He highlights the need for CEOs to be honest about their challenges and to present real problems to their boards, rather than fabricated ones. This transparency can lead to valuable support and insights from board members.
"kids and my kids were just halfway up Mount reneer um where I got to as a place where I could actually tell the board what was going on what was really bothering me and that's when the board stopped b..."
Recruiting Passionate Board Members
In this segment, Glenn emphasizes the significance of recruiting board members who are genuinely passionate about the company's mission. He warns against selecting individuals solely based on their status or past success, advocating instead for those who truly believe in the company's vision. Kelman shares insights on the qualities to look for in potential board members, including their ability to listen and adapt to the evolving landscape of the business.
"that's what I got with Mark before every board meeting we went on a run and he just said so how's it going and for the next 10 miles I would just say well there's this and there's this and I screwed t..."
The Importance of Diversity on Your Board
Glenn reflects on his experience with board diversity, noting the lack of representation in the early days of Redfin. He discusses how bringing on diverse board members not only enhances perspectives but also positively impacts employee morale. Kelman stresses the need for early-stage companies to prioritize diversity in their boards to foster a more inclusive and effective governance structure.
"that thing in common the other thing that you have to worry about is they have to listen more than they talk because most people have been in charge for a while they haven't listened to anybody in age..."
Investing Time in Board Relationships
In this final segment, Glenn shares the importance of investing time in building relationships with board members. He recounts how spending quality time with board members, like during a successful recruitment process, can lead to stronger support and collaboration. Kelman encourages CEOs to prioritize these relationships and to seek board members who are willing to engage deeply in the company's journey.
"addressed that much earlier one thing that Reed really helped us with he gave a talk to the employees excuse me to some of the senior managers and he was actually talking about the process he went thr..."
Listening vs. Impressing in Interviews
In this segment, Glenn reflects on the dual impulses he faced during board member interviews: the desire to impress and the need to listen. He advises CEOs to focus on articulating their needs and listening carefully to candidates, rather than getting caught up in the prestige of the interviewee's background.
"and hopefully some folks on your team because if you don't find yourself calling that person a lot you're not getting your money's worth I call our board a lot because they actually really help me and..."
The Art of Rejecting Board Candidates
Kelman shares his thoughts on the importance of personally rejecting board candidates rather than delegating this task. He highlights the potential future interactions with rejected candidates and the need to maintain professionalism and respect throughout the recruitment process.
"in interviewing board candidates was that I had two impulses one was to be impressed just say holy cow you started eade I can't believe I actually didn't talk to the person who started E Trade just fa..."
Understanding Board Dynamics
In this segment, Glenn discusses the dynamics of board meetings and the importance of clear leadership. He emphasizes that the CEO should not deflect responsibility onto the board, as this undermines their authority and can create confusion among employees regarding decision-making.
"I'm not going to tell you the first no that's a joke the one thing that Jeff will offer to do is reject board candidates for you it's unpleasant and he wants to make sure to close the loop and it is s..."
Deciding After Board Meetings
Kelman advises against making immediate decisions during board meetings, advocating for a more thoughtful approach. He stresses the importance of reflecting on discussions and taking the time to consider new perspectives before finalizing decisions.
"them one thing that has really changed this is Bob milod from Price Line and I do think there was a CA change in our board mentality when he came on board he uh was the CFO at Price Line um but also w..."
Transparency in Board Decisions
Glenn discusses the necessity of transparency in board decisions and the impact on company culture. He explains how involving the management team in board discussions fosters a sense of ownership and accountability, rather than allowing decisions to be blamed solely on the board.
"in the movies they never say I'll think about it they decide on the spot you want to see him cool you want to seem in charge you want to seem decisive we've been talking about this for 45 minutes and ..."
The Power of Documentation in Board Meetings
In this segment, Kelman highlights the effectiveness of using documents instead of slides during board meetings. He explains how this approach encourages deeper thinking and more meaningful discussions, ultimately leading to better decision-making and engagement from board members.
"sometimes people say well we're doing this because the board wants it you know you want your management team to see the inner workings of the board so we actually have the whole management team at the..."
Creating a Cohesive Narrative
Kelman emphasizes the importance of crafting a cohesive narrative during board meetings. He discusses how documenting issues and decisions helps create a clear story of the company's journey, allowing for better accountability and understanding of the business's evolution.
"about what I've gotten from Amazon which is documents not slides documents are what we use for our board meeting we have a business update that we present as slides where there are the same 20 slides ..."
Creating a Unified Truth
In this segment, Glenn discusses the necessity of establishing a single version of the truth before board meetings. He highlights how candid discussions about pressing issues lead to a more rewarding experience for board members, fostering a collaborative environment where everyone is aligned on the company's direction and challenges.
"whole story um I really work hard with the executive team not to treat the board meeting like a tap dancing show because every executive wants to do well we want to look good but when you're trying to..."
Engaging New Executives Effectively
Glenn shares his strategy for integrating new executives into board discussions. He explains how pre-emptively informing them of the topics they'll be asked about helps them engage more effectively. This approach not only eases their transition into the conversation but also enhances the overall quality of the discussion.
"do it in PowerPoint slides or Google Slides or whatever format you use that's not a document there is so much in precision there there's so many different ways to narrate that but when you lay it out ..."
The Importance of Honest Responses
In this segment, Glenn stresses the value of honesty in board meetings. He encourages executives to admit when they don't know the answer to a question, modeling transparency and fostering a culture of truth-telling. This practice not only builds trust but also encourages a more open dialogue about the company's challenges.
"a successful one so that's sort of the first order business and then the other thing that everybody knows in a red fed board meeting is that when you're asked a question there are only four possible w..."
Utilizing Backup for Precision
Glenn discusses the importance of having backup materials during board meetings. He advises executives to bring relevant data to support their answers, ensuring that discussions are grounded in facts rather than memory. This practice enhances the precision of the conversation and helps maintain focus on the key issues.
"speak another thing that really helps our Executives is um they bring in backup this is coaching that I've given them so if you're the head of brand there's a brand survey we've done you does anyone i..."
Reinforcing Positive Board Dynamics
In this segment, Glenn highlights the importance of acknowledging productive board meetings. He emphasizes that board members should feel valued for their contributions and that reinforcing positive dynamics can lead to more effective collaboration in future meetings.
"right answer and actually there's this one guy uh Chris Rosy uh our controller whenever I made a statement and I heard him rifling through papers I had this massive panic attack because somebody would..."
Setting Clear Expectations for Meetings
Glenn concludes by discussing the necessity of setting clear expectations for board meetings. He reflects on a past experience where a lack of direction led to unproductive discussions and emphasizes the importance of communicating desired outcomes to ensure that meetings are focused and beneficial.
"but one of the things I really love about the board meeting I don't know if you type it on your phone James it feels that way because the cases are so weird but James sends this massive email of bulle..."