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The Next AI Wave Will Be Social, Not Solo | Sarah Tavel, Benchmark and ex-Pinterest
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Sarah Tavel thinks it's criminal that ChatGPT isn’t inherently social. There’s no easy way to discover great prompts or share the ones that worked. As a venture partner at Benchmark, Sarah believes that the next wave of consumer AI will be built on this missing social layer—by product-driven founders who understand people, not just models. Sarah has seen this shift before. As one of Pinterest’s first product managers, she saw the company grow from a niche consumer tool to a beloved global community. On this episode of Every's podcast AI & I, we talk about how she’s applying the lessons she learned to AI—and what it takes to build a breakout consumer AI app today. We get into: - Why product geniuses win as new tech matures. In the early days of a new technology, companies win by wrangling raw innovation into something usable. But as the infrastructure matures, Sarah says the edge shifts to product thinkers—founders who turn new capabilities into delightful user experiences. - The future of prompting is social. When Sarah had to dig through Reddit to find a prompt to help her interpret her blood test results, she saw a gap: The best prompt creators are invisible. Sarah bets that a social AI product that makes them discoverable and followable would gain traction. - Sarah’s method to spot exceptional founders. Sarah backs founders for whom building a company feels like a calling—or even an affliction. These are people who have fallen in love with the process and are obsessed with learning how to grow alongside their companies. - How to tell if your startup really has network effects. Founders raising money love to say that their business has “network effects.” Sarah has learned to look for early signs they’re real—like traction in a small, white-hot segment of the market. If there’s no evidence the flywheel is already starting to spin, it’s probably not a network effect. - How LLMs change the way the best VCs invest. Sarah thinks the future of venture will be shaped by how well VCs can turn the decisions they make into training data. After every pitch, she logs what she liked, what she didn’t, the deal terms, and her reasoning. Over time, she’s building a dataset of her own judgment—one an LLM could help her use to pressure-test decisions and avoid past mistakes. This is a must-watch for if you’re building a consumer AI product and want to see ahead of the curve. If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! Want even more? - Sign up for Every to unlock our ultimate guide to prompting ChatGPT here: https://every.ck.page/ultimate-guide-to-prompting-chatgpt. It’s usually only for paying subscribers, but you can get it here for free. To hear more from Dan Shipper: - Subscribe to Every: https://every.to/subscribe - Follow him on X: https://twitter.com/danshipper Timestamps: 00:00:00 - Episode start 00:01:10 - Introduction 00:02:26 - Why the future of consumer AI belongs to founders with product intuition 00:11:09 - What Sarah sees as ChatGPT’s biggest weakness 00:18:45 - How Sarah would design a consumer AI app with social DNA 00:24:10 - The kind of founders Sarah invests in 00:28:33 - How to know if your startup’s network-effects are real 00:35:40 - What’s catching Sarah’s eye beyond AI 00:40:41 - How AI will change the way top venture capitalists invest Links to resources mentioned in the episode: Sarah Tavel: @sarahtavel Sarah’s substack: https://www.sarahtavel.com/ Eugene Wei’s essay about Status-as-a-Service: https://www.eugenewei.com/blog/2019/2/19/status-as-a-service The book Sarah talks about in the context of founders who become CEOs in pursuit of status: https://www.amazon.com/Five-Temptations-CEO-Anniversary-Leadership/dp/0470267585
Segments Timeline
The Shift from Technical to Product Genius
Sarah Tavel discusses the evolution of successful tech companies, highlighting how the focus has shifted from deeply technical founders to product geniuses as technology matures. She draws parallels between Google and current AI products like ChatGPT, emphasizing the need for a social layer in AI to enhance user experience.
"Google was a founding team that was deeply deeply technical. As the technology, the underlying technology got more mature. The slider goes forward, forward, forward, more towards the product thinker, ..."
Consumer Technology Cycles and AI
In this segment, Sarah Tavel reflects on her experiences in consumer technology and how they inform her understanding of the current AI wave. She emphasizes the importance of product intuition in creating successful consumer AI applications, suggesting that the next wave will be driven by founders who prioritize user experience.
"Sarah, welcome to the show. Thanks so much for having me. So for people who don't know you, you are a partner at Benchmark. Yes. Before that you were early at Pinterest and before that you studied phi..."
ChatGPT's Biggest Weakness
Sarah critiques ChatGPT for lacking a social component, which she believes is essential for user engagement. She envisions a future where user-generated content (UGC) communities emerge, allowing skilled prompt creators to share their insights and enhance the AI experience for everyone.
"that was deeply deeply technical. Yeah. And and re really like if you think about a product experience that you expose to the user and how much of it is like the UI that you interface with the product..."
Designing AI with Social DNA
Sarah shares her vision for designing consumer AI applications that incorporate social elements. She argues that the best AI products will facilitate community interaction and make it easier for users to discover and utilize effective prompts, ultimately enhancing the overall user experience.
"social products end up having some kind of northstar for the community participants where they're trying to achieve status in the network. And, you know, you can think of that a lot as you know, has b..."
Investing in Founders with a Calling
In this segment, Sarah discusses her investment philosophy, focusing on founders who are deeply passionate about their work. She believes that successful entrepreneurs are those who view building a company as a calling, which drives their commitment to learning and growth.
"were going to like redesign them like right now uh together like what where would you start? Uh if you were thinking about okay I want to take make something that's custom GBT like but like has social..."
Identifying Real Network Effects
Sarah explains how to determine if a startup truly has network effects. She emphasizes the importance of early traction in niche markets as a sign that the business model is effective, cautioning against claims of network effects without evidence of a functioning flywheel.
"taste in founders? Uh, I would say I'm really drawn to founders who, you know, they do think in network effects and strategy and the kind of zero to one, how do you escape competition? Like they go th..."
Beyond AI: What's Catching Sarah's Eye
Sarah shares her insights on emerging trends beyond AI that are capturing her interest. She discusses the evolving landscape of technology and how it influences her investment decisions, highlighting the importance of staying ahead of the curve.
"talk about network effects because I think that um it's one of those things it's maybe a little less so because of AI stuff but like for the last 10 years um I would say like 80% of decks were like th..."
AI's Impact on Venture Capital
In this final segment, Sarah discusses how AI is transforming the venture capital landscape. She explains how VCs can leverage AI to improve their investment decisions by turning their experiences into valuable training data, ultimately enhancing their judgment and reducing mistakes.
"this is a show about AI, but are you looking at or excited about anything that's not AI right now? I uh I'm a big believer in stable coins. Interesting. I would not have guessed. Okay. I'm on the boar..."
AI's Impact on Venture Capital Decisions
In this segment, Sarah reflects on how AI will transform the day-to-day operations of venture capitalists. She shares her method of creating training data from past investment decisions, which helps refine her judgment and improve future decision-making processes. Sarah emphasizes the importance of learning from past experiences to enhance investment strategies.
"think about um let's say 5 years from now how AI will have changed uh your day-to-day as a VC and um the kinds of businesses and the kinds of funding models will have change in any way change the VC b..."
Evaluating Talent and Decision-Making
Sarah Tavel explores the significance of evaluating talent in startups and how AI can assist in tracking talent movements globally. She discusses the potential for creating a scoring system for talent, akin to a Rotten Tomatoes score for companies, which could help investors identify promising opportunities based on talent quality.
"what I liked what I didn't like what the deal would have been and if I got yes why. If I got no if I got to no why. And so it follows that over time I'm going to, be able, to, look, back, on, that, li..."
Navigating the Evolving VC Landscape
In this insightful discussion, Sarah addresses the challenges of maintaining success in venture capital amidst a rapidly changing landscape. She reflects on the difficulty of using past training data to inform future decisions and the need for VCs to adapt their strategies as market conditions evolve.
"the third is just um you know I know there's some companies that are doing this really well which is just tracking talent globally and the movements of talent and what that ends up meaning and it foll..."
Timeless Principles in Decision-Making
Sarah shares her experiences from her time at Pinterest, emphasizing the importance of timeless principles in decision-making. She discusses how foundational concepts remain relevant despite changing market dynamics and how AI can help probe and refine decision-making processes for venture capitalists.
"about that? I think maybe that's what we're all hoping will give us job security in the future. Um, you know, uh, I remember when I was at Pinterest and I was responsible for all the discovery experie..."
The Journey of AI and VC
In the closing segment, Sarah and Dan reflect on the future of AI in venture capital and the evolving role of VCs. They discuss the potential changes in the industry and the importance of human judgment in decision-making, even as AI tools become more integrated into the investment process.
"me. Yeah. Yeah. I had a lot of fun. [Music] Oh my gosh, folks. You absolutely positively have to smash that like button and subscribe to AI and I. Why? Because this show is the epitome of awesomeness...."