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a16z Podcast | Airspace as the Next Internet-Like Platform
28 segments available
One of the most important lessons of the internet age is what happens when we give people -- including companies, developers, engineers, hobbyists, and yes, even a few bad (or dumb) actors -- a new platform, along with the freedom to innovate on top of it. For example, who could have predicted how profoundly the internet would change our economy, given how it started off as a research project -- one where commercial applications were actually frowned upon in the early days? Now, the U.S. is on the cusp of opening up another such platform for commercial and social innovation: airspace (think drones, the non-military kind). There's so many use cases for drones that we already know about, but what about new business use cases? And then, on the policy front, how do we calculate the risk of innovation on a platform made up of atoms (drones) vs. bits (the internet)? What are the pros and cons of registration? Because even though drones are like flying smartphones controlled by software, they're also hard objects that could fall out of the sky ... or go places where no one could go before, for better or worse. The guests on this episode of the a16z Podcast -- continuing our D.C. and tech/innovation/policy theme -- share their thoughts on safety, privacy, paper airplanes, and what they think are some of the most exciting things now possible in airspace. Joining the conversation are Washington, D.C.-based Mercatus Center tech policy lead Eli Dourado, along with graduate research fellow Samuel Hammond; Airware founder and CEO Jonathan Downey; and SkySafe CEO and co-founder Grant Jordan.
Segments Timeline
Introducing the Airspace Innovation Discussion
In this segment, the hosts introduce the a16z Podcast episode focused on airspace as a platform for innovation. They welcome guests Eli Dourado, Samuel Hammond, Jonathan Downey, and Grant Jordan, who bring expertise in technology policy and commercial drone applications. The discussion sets the stage for exploring the potential of drones in various industries and the implications of airspace regulation.
"hi everyone welcome to the a 6nc podcast i'm sonal and today's topic continuing our DC theme is drones and more broadly policy and airspace as a platform for innovation joining us for that conversatio..."
Airspace: The Next Platform for Innovation
Eli Dourado reflects on his op-ed discussing airspace as a new platform for innovation, drawing parallels to the early internet. He highlights the legal restrictions on commercial drone use compared to hobbyist use, emphasizing the untapped potential for commercial applications. The conversation explores how lifting these restrictions could lead to significant advancements in various sectors.
"let's just get started I think the place to start off is you know Eli you wrote an op-ed for me a few years ago where we talked about airspace as the next platform for innovation and I thought that wa..."
Global Perspectives on Commercial Drones
Jonathan Downey shares insights on the global landscape of commercial drones, noting that many countries have embraced drone technology for commercial use while the U.S. has lagged behind. He discusses the challenges faced by companies in the U.S. and the importance of regulatory frameworks like the Section 333 exemption process, which allows for limited commercial operations.
"if they if they knew where today they would have allowed commercial use from the inception right and so so to me I was I was just thinking about what would people do with airspace if if they could use..."
Understanding Drone Regulations
The discussion shifts to the regulatory environment surrounding drones, particularly the FAA's Part 107 rules. Eli Dourado explains the historical context of drone regulations and the ongoing efforts to establish comprehensive commercial drone rules. The segment highlights the complexities of navigating these regulations for businesses looking to innovate in the drone space.
"what a session it was a regulation that you just cited so part 107 is the new proposed small UAS rule and it's it sort of by us you mean unmanned people just call them drones just for quick definition..."
Drones in Dangerous Jobs
The guests discuss the application of drones in high-risk jobs, such as cell tower inspections and oil and gas infrastructure assessments. They emphasize how drones can enhance safety by reducing the need for workers to perform dangerous tasks at heights or in hazardous environments, showcasing the transformative potential of drone technology in improving workplace safety.
"and in the meantime as Jonathan said we have these three 33 exemptions that basically allows people to sort of negotiate or apply at the FAA to say I want to operate commercially for this purpose and ..."
Creative Applications of Drones
The conversation explores the creative possibilities that drones offer, particularly in photography and filmmaking. The guests discuss how drones have democratized access to aerial shots that previously required expensive helicopter rentals, enabling new forms of artistic expression and innovation in visual storytelling.
"uh it's kind of crazy you know I think part of a lot of our focus is on thinking a little bit further forward about the airspace management aspect you know I think using commercial drones early on in ..."
Innovative Use Cases for Drones
The segment highlights various innovative use cases for drones across industries, including agriculture, insurance, and wildlife conservation. The guests discuss how drones can disintermediate traditional methods that are costly or unsafe, opening up new opportunities for efficiency and effectiveness in operations.
"recently there's a lot of other jobs that are really dangerous as well for two story steep rooftop inspections of residential properties whether it's during the underwriting phase whether it's during ..."
The Future of Drone Innovation
The discussion concludes with reflections on the future of drone technology and its potential to surprise and innovate. The guests emphasize the importance of allowing creativity and experimentation in the drone space, similar to the early days of the internet, where unexpected applications emerged as the technology evolved.
"kind of outlined some of the more dangerous jobs and use cases that drones can help address now let's think about sort of some of the things that there are opportunities you wouldn't have had if it we..."
The New Era of Aerial Filming
This segment delves into the advancements in aerial filming made possible by drones, allowing filmmakers to capture shots that were once impossible or prohibitively expensive. The discussion highlights the safety and flexibility drones offer compared to traditional methods, enabling new creative possibilities in Hollywood.
"point of again not to be platitude ish but that's point of innovation like it's supposed to surprise you in terms of what's possible like we can list all the use cases we want in this room but we trul..."
Industrial Inspections Revolutionized
The conversation shifts to the industrial applications of drones, particularly in infrastructure inspections. The guests discuss how drones can access areas previously only reachable by manned helicopters, significantly reducing costs and risks associated with inspections in industries like oil and gas.
"interesting when you start understanding what wasn't even possible with man helicopters and now is becoming possible with small aircraft including you know new shots in Hollywood that previously you k..."
Hollywood's Role in Drone Adoption
This segment highlights Hollywood's early adoption of drones for filming, even before regulatory frameworks were established. The guests discuss how the film industry paved the way for commercial drone use by leveraging existing safety protocols from manned helicopter operations.
"you can go inside of buildings inside we're seeing companies do inspections of the insides of everything from you know oil larkey no large oil containers to even large gas turbines what's interesting ..."
Innovation Arbitrage in Drone Regulation
The discussion focuses on the concept of innovation arbitrage, where regulatory flexibility in other countries attracts drone-related industries. The guests draw parallels to the early internet, emphasizing the risks of stifling innovation in the U.S. by imposing restrictive regulations on drone technology.
"easily now so we discuss some of the innovation arbitrage around drones when it comes to Canada some of that was also filmed because there's film industries in Toronto and Vancouver and they could mak..."
Global Perspectives on Drone Regulation
This segment examines how different countries, like Canada and Switzerland, approach drone regulation with a risk-based mindset. The guests discuss the importance of adapting regulations to foster innovation while ensuring safety, contrasting it with the more rigid regulatory environment in the U.S.
"here when we talk about this cuz I think again people are really under estimating how much is possible in the air we're I don't gonna be cheesy but drones excite the [ __ ] out of me because I know th..."
Challenges of Drone Registration
The conversation addresses the challenges surrounding drone registration in the U.S., including the costs and complexities that deter small operators. The guests highlight the disparity between the number of consumer drones and registered units, suggesting that current regulations may inadvertently create a culture of non-compliance.
"the news I picked drones personally because as a Canadian I was seeing drones in the industry take off my mail in my home country and so we actually focused on Canada and Switzerland and Swiss that th..."
Safety Implications of Drones
This segment discusses the safety concerns associated with drones, particularly the risks of falling and causing harm. The guests explore potential solutions for accountability and liability, drawing parallels to existing regulations for cars and emphasizing the need for a structured yet flexible approach to drone safety.
"like if you're a farmer mapping your fields is to be able to go beyond the line of sight so when I restart with this to the Swiss government on this and this is another analogy of the early internet I..."
The Case for Drone Registration
The guests debate the necessity of drone registration and the implications of current weight thresholds for regulation. They discuss how a more nuanced approach to registration could enhance safety and accountability while fostering innovation in the drone industry.
"it like what's this well there's there's a consumer registry now and that that registry it's not expensive it's five dollars but uh but it could potentially potentially stop people from from taking th..."
The Paper Airplane Paradox
In this light-hearted segment, the guests humorously discuss the absurdity of current FAA regulations that classify paper airplanes as aircraft. They explore the implications of such regulations on drone operations and the need for a more rational approach to drone classification and registration.
"one of the things that we're looking at is how dangerous is it you know to have something you know a more flexible standard that goes up to like two kilograms which is what's used in in a lot of other..."
Paper Airplanes and Regulatory Thresholds
This segment humorously explores the absurdity of current drone regulations, particularly the 250-gram threshold for registration. The speakers discuss how even paper airplanes fall under FAA regulations, highlighting the challenges of defining what constitutes an aircraft. They question whether the current weight limits are appropriate and how they impact hobbyists and the general public.
"is it really 250 grams that's the right threshold for that I mean I'm I'm not worried about 250 gram drone two sticks of butter volunteers I think that that 250 gram allowance could be called the pape..."
Airspace Security Challenges
The conversation shifts to the security implications of drones in airspace, comparing them to traditional aviation enforcement mechanisms. The speakers discuss the unique challenges posed by consumer drones, including the inadequacy of existing security measures for protecting sensitive areas like nuclear plants. They highlight the need for new strategies to address the evolving landscape of airspace security.
"occurring you know whereas now it's like literally one a week if not more but I think to me the big difference is that there's kind of a gap in airspace enforcement right like if you're talking about ..."
Geo-Fencing and Self-Policing Drones
In this segment, the speakers delve into geo-fencing technology as a method for controlling drone flight paths. They discuss the limitations of relying on drones to self-regulate and the potential for misuse. The conversation highlights the complexities of enforcing airspace regulations, especially in restricted zones like Washington D.C., and the confusion it creates for hobbyists.
"you're thinking about it more in the sense of how to because I know there's geo fencing where you can actually like fence in a region that a drone is sort of contained to fly but you're talking about ..."
Bird Strikes vs. Drone Safety
This segment presents a comparative analysis of bird strikes and drone collisions with manned aircraft. The speakers share research findings indicating that the risk of injury from small drones is minimal compared to the vast number of birds in the air. They discuss the implications of these findings for drone regulation and public perception of drone safety.
"about the enforcement aspect why would I think about the other safety issue or is that the other one I was thinking of was collisions with planes in the air sure the manned planes and so this is somet..."
Privacy Concerns with Drone Technology
The discussion turns to privacy issues associated with drone usage, highlighting both positive and negative implications. The speakers provide examples of how drones can be used for good, such as in journalism, while also acknowledging the potential for invasion of privacy. They argue for existing laws to be applied to drone use, emphasizing the need for technology-agnostic regulations that protect individual privacy rights.
"very worried about a small like a two kilogram drone taking out a 737 or anything like that right well I think the one of the funniest videos I've seen on the internet I'm sure you guys have all seen ..."
The Consequences of Shooting Down Drones
The conversation shifts to the legal implications of shooting down drones. The speakers highlight the serious consequences of such actions, equating it to shooting down an airplane, which can lead to severe penalties. They discuss the regulatory landscape and the FAA's authority to preempt state laws regarding airspace, emphasizing the importance of understanding these legal frameworks.
"recommend this but if a drone is trespassing over your property and you choose to shoot it down it's like she treated us she was young an airplane which is which is like 25 years in jail or something ..."
Exciting Developments in Drone Technology
This segment explores the exciting advancements in drone technology and its potential applications. The speakers note that while military use of drones is prevalent, commercial companies are just beginning to adopt drone technology for practical uses, such as insurance claims and utility inspections. They express optimism about the future integration of commercial drones into everyday business operations.
"it pertains to the national airspace great I'm just surprised it wasn't Texas so what excites you guys I mean we're talking about some of this to switch gears from the safety topic again and go back t..."
The Future of Airspace Integration
The discussion focuses on the integration of commercial drones into national airspace. The speakers highlight the need for collaboration among various stakeholders to ensure safe and efficient drone operations. They mention NASA's UTM program and the importance of accountability through proper registration and transponders, which will pave the way for innovative uses of drones in various industries.
"integration and about you know us getting to the point where we can actually have you know large quantities of commercial drones in the airspace you know kind of interacting with you know commercial t..."
The Thrill of Drone Racing
In this lively segment, the speakers share their excitement about the emerging sport of drone racing. They discuss the potential for drone racing to become a mainstream entertainment option, possibly even broadcast on major networks. The thrill of first-person view racing and the skill involved in piloting drones are highlighted, showcasing the sport's appeal to both participants and spectators.
"yeah I'm excited about the entertainment side so I follow some of the hobbyist goings-on around first person view drone racing and these are people who put on goggles and fly drones around tracks and ..."
The Vision of Autonomous Air Travel
The conversation shifts to the future of aviation, particularly the concept of autonomously piloted aircraft. The speakers discuss the potential benefits of removing human pilots from the cockpit, including increased safety and cost-effectiveness. They envision a future where air taxis could revolutionize transportation, drawing parallels to advancements in autonomous vehicles.
"racer because I just I clearly am not good enough even for this early stage of the sport and the other thing going along with the the drone racing which is all first-person view I mean I'm at I mean j..."
The Artistic Potential of Drone Swarms
In this segment, the speakers reflect on the artistic possibilities of drone swarms. They discuss how drone swarms can create beautiful and elegant aerial displays, contrasting the common perception of them as menacing. The conversation touches on the imaginative aspects of airspace, envisioning a future where aerial activities could include cafes and social interactions in the sky, inspired by cinematic portrayals of airborne life.
"maybe I mean just just huge safety benefits in general aviation something like three quarters of all of all accidents our pilot error in in commercial aviation I think it's about half and so you know ..."