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A CS Education That's Free Until You Get a Job - Austen Allred of Lambda School
43 segments available
Austen Allred is the CEO and cofounder of Lambda School. https://twitter.com/Austen https://lambdaschool.com/ Lambda School provides a CS education that's free until you get a job. They were in the Summer 2017 batch of YC. The YC podcast is hosted by Craig Cannon. https://twitter.com/craigcannon *** Topics 00:35 - Encouraging people to do something that they're scared to do 4:50 - Where did the insight for Lambda School come from? 6:00 - College vs developer schools 10:00 - Building a network 11:50 - Does Austen see value in a traditional liberal arts education? 14:30 - Steven Klaiber-Noble asks - As competitors begin to copy your model what front do you believe you'll be competing on? 17:30 - Why did Austen choose to raise money? 19:40 - Fundraising falling through on Austen's first startup 21:10 - Moving back to Utah and writing a book about growth 23:00 - Why Austen wrote a book 26:00 - "Starting a company is by definition saying, I think what I can do is worth more than what other people will pay me for." 27:00 - Mispriced human capital 29:55 - Other opportunities for Lambda School 32:20 - Modeling risk 35:10 - David Kofoed Wind asks - When Lambda School is incentivized to take in people that will land high paying jobs, how do you think about the diversity of candidates? One would imagine that it quickly becomes a game of pattern matching the stereotypical SV people. 37:25 - Will Lambda School ever not be remote? 40:50 - Dave Dawson asks - You appear to be on the successful path now, was there a point early in Lambda School when you wanted to stop? 43:20 - Helping everyone become an autodidact 46:20 - Rethinking where to start on an online course 47:45 - Dave Dawson asks - What keeps you up at night at this point? 49:20 - Dayo Koleowo asks - “I have made remarks I do not agree with” - from Austen's Twitter bio. What is that one remark you wish you didn’t have to disagree with? 53:00 - Choosing remote work as a core problem to solve in your company 55:30 - Analysts aren't good at measuring product quality 57:10 - Teaching taste
Segments Timeline
Overcoming Fear to Seize Opportunities
Austen Allred discusses the challenge of encouraging individuals to apply for Lambda School despite their fears and self-doubt. He emphasizes the importance of confidence and how many students experience impostor syndrome, which delays their job applications. By implementing mechanisms to encourage early applications, students often find success quickly, landing high-paying jobs.
"all right so today we have Austin Allred he is the CEO of lambda school which was in the summer 2017 batch and lambda school is ACS education that is free until you get a job so Austin what I wanted t..."
Addressing Accessibility in Education
Austen addresses concerns about Lambda School being an opportunity primarily for the wealthy. He explains the availability of part-time programs and living stipends to support students from diverse backgrounds. The focus is on ensuring that qualified candidates feel empowered to apply, regardless of their financial situation.
"yeah I mean I think that's that's the actually the problem we grapple with the most and you know I think Patrick Collison said something along the lines of you know if you think about it the highest l..."
The Challenge of Admission
Austen reflects on the challenges of admissions at Lambda School, noting that many potential applicants doubt their chances of acceptance. He compares this to the experience of applying to Y Combinator, highlighting the psychological barriers that prevent capable individuals from pursuing opportunities.
"wait and wait and wait and we'd be like what you know why are they not working hard what's going on and you talk to them and you realize it's massive impostor syndrome they're just not they're not con..."
The Insight Behind Lambda School
Austen shares the core insight that led to the creation of Lambda School, emphasizing the disparity in opportunities between rural areas and tech hubs like San Francisco. He discusses the risks associated with traditional education costs and how Lambda School aims to provide a more accessible path to high-paying jobs without upfront tuition.
"well so you can do it evenings and weekends we have experiments running where we pay people living stipends that will be expanding greatly we'll be announcing something in the near future along those ..."
Misaligned Incentives in Education
Austen critiques traditional education models, particularly for-profit institutions like the University of Phoenix, which often prioritize enrollment over student success. He contrasts this with Lambda School's mission to align incentives with student outcomes, ensuring that education leads to meaningful employment.
"they won't get in which is not the case right I mean so your acceptance rate maybe it's changed but I heard you say it's 25% of the people who make it through that first initial test the people that m..."
The Value of Non-Traditional Paths
Austen discusses the societal belief that college is the only path to success and how this perception is changing. He highlights the success of individuals without degrees and the growing recognition that alternative education models can provide viable career paths.
"risk of false negatives yeah or false positives I guess but but yeah that all that we need to find out is are you of average you know mental intelligence and will you work really hard yeah and I think..."
Building a Network at Lambda School
Austen explains how Lambda School helps students build professional networks, which are crucial for job placement. He outlines the curriculum's integration of networking skills and the importance of connecting with industry professionals to secure job opportunities.
"the past it's possible that YC was fooled more often by fancy degrees and PhDs and stuff like that possibly yeah not the case anymore I mean I had in my wife Ste group there were a couple they're like..."
Career Coaching and Networking Skills
Austen details the role of career coaches at Lambda School, who guide students in developing networking skills. He emphasizes the importance of informational interviews and how these connections often lead to job offers, reinforcing the value of personal relationships in the job market.
"guy in San Francisco yeah but in Utah that guy's making 30k in San Francisco that guy's making 150 and he's leaving a team so you know how does that work out is it just what jobs are available and I m..."
The Future of Lambda School's Model
Austen shares his vision for Lambda School evolving into a talent agency for tech professionals. He discusses the ongoing efforts to connect students with companies and the potential for expanding their services to better support job placement.
"can't afford that risk so why are people in these situations signing up for University of Phoenix type programs but not the dev schools because it's a similar choice right so I think the first reason ..."
Unbundling the University Experience
Austen reflects on the traditional university experience and how Lambda School focuses on job training rather than a broad liberal arts education. He acknowledges the value of liberal arts but emphasizes the need for vocational training that leads directly to employment.
"sign a piece of paper they get 80 grand okay and that's but the reason people are the reason people opt for universities generally speaking versus you know code schools is they've you know my entire l..."
Practical Learning vs. Traditional Education
Austen discusses the importance of practical experience over traditional education. He shares his own background and how real-world skills gained through work can often outweigh the benefits of a formal degree, particularly in fields like technology.
"isn't only not good advice it's probably bad advice net net and the newer generation has the benefit of seeing people with hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans and working at Starbucks ye..."
The Value of Liberal Arts Education
Austen Allred discusses the value of a traditional liberal arts education versus vocational training. He acknowledges the importance of liberal arts but argues that it doesn't have to be confined to a university setting. Allred emphasizes that for many, especially those switching careers later in life, the focus should be on practical skills that lead to financial stability before exploring liberal arts.
"like a talent agency basically for software engineers and designers and whatever else right right right so in terms of the other there are a couple questions around well so John Palmer asks can or wha..."
Unbundling Education
In this segment, Austen Allred explores the concept of unbundling the university experience. He believes that education should be job-focused and vocational, allowing students to prioritize earning potential over traditional academic pursuits. Allred argues that many valuable learning experiences can occur outside the walls of a university.
"yeah we're entirely vocational we're a trade school basically and we want to help you make as much money as you can and then when you're making a lot of money it's a a lot easier to make decisions aro..."
Competing on Student Experience
Austen Allred addresses the competitive landscape as other institutions begin to adopt Lambda School's income-sharing model. He emphasizes that Lambda School's success hinges on providing an exceptional educational experience and improving student outcomes, rather than just replicating the business model.
"sense to me yeah i mean do you see there are valid there are elements of value in unbundling other aspects and like really building that into lambda school for sure yeah yeah okay so there's another q..."
The Hard Work Behind Success
Allred shares insights into the challenges of building Lambda School, highlighting the importance of understanding student admissions and outcomes. He explains that while many can adopt the income-sharing agreement, the real challenge lies in creating a successful educational product and effectively placing students in jobs.
"making that successful so our product our educational experience is I think among the best in the world and it has to be the way we've built it in order to make a free up front and online education wo..."
Raising Capital with Purpose
In this segment, Austen Allred discusses his decision to raise funds for Lambda School. He explains how he modeled the potential growth against dilution and concluded that raising capital would allow the school to scale significantly, ultimately benefiting students and the company.
"right plugging throwing an ISA on the front end is the easy part yeah okay so you're just hoping I like your mut you're much further ahead than people realize way further yeah yeah and I'm sure there ..."
Learning from Past Failures
Allred reflects on his previous startup experience where a fundraising deal fell through unexpectedly. He shares how this experience shaped his views on venture capital and the importance of understanding the terms of any financial agreement before proceeding.
"you actually model it out and that's the reason we have continued to raise I mean before we started Lam to school I was like I'm never raising VC again right well we should tell that's right oh that w..."
The Journey to Recovery
Austen Allred recounts the difficult period following the collapse of his first startup. He discusses how he turned to writing a book as a way to recover financially and regain confidence, ultimately leading to new job opportunities and a renewed sense of purpose.
"impactful yeah well I don't actually don't think it's dissimilar from student loans like there's a dynamic where it works really well for you sure and there are other dynamics where if you don't know ..."
Finding Confidence After Setbacks
In this segment, Allred shares his journey of rebuilding confidence after being told he lacked marketable skills. He discusses how he used the process of writing a book to showcase his abilities and prove his worth in the job market, ultimately leading to better opportunities.
"momentum driven so that's why I was very anti VC now I think there are companies that should raise we see they're companies that shouldn't be see it's just dependent on the circumstances and the detai..."
Defining Success as an Entrepreneur
Austen Allred reflects on the pressures of being a CEO and the definition of success in entrepreneurship. He discusses the psychological challenges he faced after his startup failed and how he learned to redefine his self-worth and capabilities beyond traditional metrics of success.
"a few companies saw the book and said hey come work for us one of which was lend up which is a YC company yep so this is it's still interesting because it's fairly risky you know oh you're gonna like ..."
The Importance of Self-Belief
In this concluding segment, Allred emphasizes the importance of self-belief for entrepreneurs. He shares how starting a company is an assertion of one's value and capabilities, and how overcoming external doubts can lead to personal and professional growth.
"raise to 60,000 and I went to that investor and I was like what you know how can I pull this out I don't know what I'm gonna do next and he said well you know you don't have any marketable skills you'..."
The Value of Mispriced Human Capital
In this segment, Austen discusses the concept of mispriced human capital, emphasizing how starting a company inherently involves believing in one's own worth. He draws parallels between the valuation of athletes and software engineers, highlighting the discrepancies in how talent is compensated across different industries.
"good CEO right you could debate whether or not that's true but that's yeah realistically one or zero successful right and so that calls into question well what do you actually do what are you good at ..."
The Inefficiency of Human Capital Markets
Austen critiques the inefficiencies in the labor market, particularly regarding human capital. He explains how traditional job markets fail to accurately reflect the value of individuals, leading to underpayment and missed opportunities. This segment underscores the need for a more efficient marketplace for talent.
"I can do something whether it's because you can't measure I think Paul Graham has an essay about this something about measurement and leverage and how companies can can't do any of those things very w..."
Addressing Labor Shortages in Nursing
Austen highlights the significant labor shortages in nursing and the challenges faced by nursing schools in the U.S. due to funding constraints. He discusses the potential for Lambda School to address these gaps by launching a nursing program, showcasing the need for innovative solutions in education and workforce development.
"it yeah but it's also a core to your business but that like that's that yeah I think that's the key that is the insight is saying you know there if you look at any asset class in the United States it'..."
Modeling Risk in Education Programs
In this segment, Austen explains how Lambda School approaches risk modeling for its educational programs. He discusses the importance of data-driven decision-making and the need for predictive models to assess student success, emphasizing the iterative process of refining these models over time.
"well you going because the thing is when you start out you're just applying for jobs right and you take what you can get and then like you mentioned before many of these you know quote great jobs are ..."
The Future of Lambda School's Offerings
Austen shares insights into the future opportunities for Lambda School, including potential expansions into nursing education. He discusses the importance of identifying labor market shortages and how Lambda School aims to fill those gaps, positioning itself as a leader in innovative education solutions.
"entry-level salary but and there are people in the Midwest who are capable of being paid six figures in the Midwest that are making 20 in the Midwest yeah and that's crazy to me like that's the proble..."
The 90/10 Rule in Education Funding
Austen explains the 90/10 rule that governs funding for educational institutions in the U.S. He discusses how this rule creates challenges for nursing schools and contributes to labor shortages, highlighting the need for systemic changes in education funding to better serve students and the economy.
"so right now we're hiring an economist to help us make sense of all that hmm but some of it you don't have to be an economist to see you know you can talk or download data from the US Department of La..."
Identifying Labor Market Inefficiencies
In this segment, Austen discusses Lambda School's strategy for identifying labor market inefficiencies. He emphasizes the importance of understanding where job shortages exist and how Lambda School plans to address these gaps, ultimately aiming to create a more efficient labor market for skilled workers.
"every school is just desperately trying to find that 10% and however big that 10% is they can blow the rest out with federal funds all day so nursing schools for example there's a huge shortage of nur..."
Predicting Student Success
Austen elaborates on the methods Lambda School uses to predict student success. He discusses the importance of data collection and analysis in refining their educational models, aiming to improve outcomes for students and ensure they are well-prepared for the job market.
"toll road that takes a very small toll to get you there yeah it's an enormous company so yeah I think so too yeah so ok I'm curious about then how you end up modeling that risk if the program I imagin..."
Ethical Considerations in Talent Selection
Austen addresses the ethical concerns surrounding talent selection in education. He discusses the importance of avoiding biases in hiring and admissions processes, emphasizing Lambda School's commitment to tapping into diverse talent pools and providing opportunities for underrepresented communities.
"mean not with a hundred percent accuracy but we have a pretty good sense of how successful a student will be by the time they're starting or a couple months now and you know we have we're hiring teams..."
Diversity and Opportunity in Tech Education
In this segment, Austen discusses the diversity of Lambda School's student body and how it contrasts with traditional coding schools. He highlights the untapped talent in underrepresented communities and how Lambda School's model naturally attracts a more diverse group of students, benefiting both the school and the tech industry.
"they've paid a dollar yeah and then that changes everything so what someone asks us questions I want to I want to credit them somewhere oh no I know who it was yeah David copied wind basically yes ima..."
The Future of Remote Learning
Austen shares his vision for the future of remote learning at Lambda School. He discusses the potential for hybrid models and the importance of maintaining flexibility in education delivery, while also exploring innovative housing solutions for students to enhance their learning experience.
"but that's not because we're like intentionally guess cueing admissions that way it's just because that's where a lot of untapped talent is and we try to find and train that untapped talent and compan..."
Building Engagement in Online Education
Austen reflects on the challenges of keeping students engaged in an online learning environment. He contrasts traditional classroom dynamics with the need for innovative instructional design that ensures students remain focused and motivated in a remote setting.
"online yeah I mean that this is what I've heard from you know like the guys at zapier who were just saying you basically have to be intentional and like build that it remotecall very intentional becau..."
Overcoming Doubts in the Early Days
Austen shares his journey with Lambda School, revealing moments of doubt and the pressure to conform to traditional educational models. He discusses the skepticism he faced regarding online education and how the necessity to succeed drove innovation.
"disasters credit ten percent or something yeah the good ones yeah yeah it's crazy so Dave Dawson asked several good questions he says you appear to be on the successful path now we'll just take that f..."
The Autodidact Advantage
Austen emphasizes the importance of fostering autodidactic skills among students at Lambda School. He argues that many students can learn effectively on their own, and the school's mission is to help those who struggle with self-directed learning.
"motivator yeah not getting a real job yeah yeah have you ever completed a online course before that is not right okay and in fact we were talking about the book the book was available as an online dow..."
Motivation in Learning
Austen discusses the role of motivation in education, comparing his experiences in traditional college settings to the more engaging environment at Lambda School. He highlights the need for clear goals and enjoyable learning experiences to drive student success.
"learn how to be autodidactic how to see a proxy a problem approach it figure that figure out a solution and I don't so we approached instructional design with no assumptions and I think every school e..."
Scaling Challenges at Lambda School
Austen addresses the challenges of scaling Lambda School's operations as enrollment grows rapidly. He shares insights on hiring the right executives and building effective teams to support the school's expansion.
"learned to program it's why I learned to video edit it's why I learned everything on the side because you had a clear goal like hey I want to build this thing and it's enjoyable to build the thing you..."
Remote Work vs. In-Person Collaboration
Austen reflects on the trade-offs between remote work and in-person collaboration. He discusses the benefits of bringing teams together while acknowledging the complexities of maintaining a fully remote workforce.
"be remote correct yeah so if you're looking for a job yeah please I think we're hiring for like 50 positions right now lambda school comm slash careers yeah please please all right so I want to talk a..."
Silicon Valley vs. Remote Education
Austen discusses his belief that high-growth companies will continue to emerge from Silicon Valley while also asserting that the best educational institutions can operate remotely. He explores the seeming contradiction between these two beliefs and the implications for the tech industry.
"rent and by extension not pay everybody else but I have to pay them so that they can pay rent yeah but I still think and you know a lot of our students come in wanting to be remote a I don't think rem..."
The Importance of Core Innovations
Austen reflects on insights from industry leaders about the necessity of remote work being a core innovation for companies. He emphasizes the talent advantages of remote work while acknowledging the challenges of hiring and maintaining a competitive edge in a remote environment.
"they're just trade-offs that said all of our instructors are remote all of our career coaches are remote and all of our students are remote and because we've built around that we've built into that it..."
Measuring Product Quality
Austen critiques the market's ability to measure product quality, citing that revenue is often a trailing indicator. He discusses how successful companies like Airbnb and Stripe have thrived despite competition, emphasizing the subtlety and importance of product quality over mere metrics.
"but the way he puts it now is that it has to be one of your like core things one of your like core innovations and if you're thinking like maybe we have the energy or the insight to innovate on a coup..."
Teaching Taste in Product Development
Austen explores the concept of 'taste' in product development, questioning whether it can be taught in educational settings. He shares personal experiences and observations about how exposure to quality products can help students recognize and appreciate subtle design differences.
"do that if it's still difficult to find 50 people anywhere but yeah if you've built that in like get lab and zapier have you know in other companies like envision or whatever else they've chosen that ..."
Final Thoughts and Lambda School Info
In closing, Austen invites listeners to learn more about Lambda School and its offerings. He emphasizes the importance of quality education and the unique opportunities available for students interested in pursuing a career in tech.
"in retrospect and pointing that out and then beginning to look for is when I think you start to notice the the key differences fair enough yeah I like being critical sometimes especially products alri..."