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How to Write Like An Athlete | with Jimmy Soni | How I Write Podcast
35 segments available
Jimmy Soni is a master of biographies and a professional speechwriter. If you want to write serious, research-backed non-fiction or build your writing career while working a full-time job, this episode is for you. TIMESTAMPS: 00:00:00 Intro 00:00:45 Writing upward vs downward 00:02:30 When an idea becomes a book 00:04:50 Peter Thiel 00:05:50 The entrepreneurial way to think about writing 00:09:30 Jimmy's process for research 00:15:25 How Jimmy manages so much information 00:17:00 Jimmy's process for note taking 00:19:00 Jimmy's experience with interviewing Elon Musk 00:21:49 Writing like an athlete 00:24:15 A painstaking part of the writing process 00:30:30 Overcoming fear and anxiety of writing 00:32:00 How Google's voice type can help with writer's block 00:34:20 Jimmy's best technique when stuck or need to be sharper 00:37:35 One of Jimmy's favorite writers, Michael Lewis 00:42:12 Why Jimmy study's other books like The Everything Store 00:45:00 Applying the Apple model to a book or piece of writing 00:47:00 Funding Secured and Elon Musk 00:49:25 Warmth and word choice 00:52:25 The writing factor with Paypal 00:55:40 Jimmy's process for notes and sources 00:58:00 How will readers get value from Jimmy's books 01:00:50 Jimmy's insanely narrow media diet 01:04:15 The life that you lead away from writing 01:05:00 Jimmy's morning routine 01:07:18 Why Jimmy needs to write 01:09:15 How writing in public changed Jimmy 01:14:00 What writers can learn from speechwriting 01:24:00 Writing as a team sport 01:25:55 How Jimmy does research before writing 01:28:45 Analysis paralysis, research paralysis 01:31:30 What Jimmy learned from Walter Isaacson 01:36:00 Making your books extremely readable 01:38:00 What Jimmy learned from Robert Caro 01:40:00 Why productive discomfort is important for Jimmy 01:42:00 Jimmy's letter to his daughter SPEAKER LINKS: Site: https://www.JimmySoni.com Twitter: https://twitter.com/jimmyasoni Books: The Founders: The Story of Paypal and the Entrepreneurs Who Shaped Silicon Valley WRITE OF PASSAGE: Want to learn more about the next class Write of Passage? Click here: https://take.writeofpassage.school/writing-sprints PODCAST LINKS: Website: https://writeofpassage.school/how-i-write/ Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-i-write/id1700171470 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2DjMSboniFAeGA8v9NpoPv ABOUT THE HOST: I’m David Perell and I’m a writer, teacher, and podcaster. I believe writing online is one of the biggest opportunities in the world today. For the first time in human history, everybody can freely share their ideas with a global audience. I seek to help as many people publish their writing online as possible.
Segments Timeline
Meet Jimmy Soni: The Writing Athlete
In this introduction, host David Perell welcomes Jimmy Soni, an author and speechwriter, who shares his passion for innovation, endurance, and creativity in writing. The conversation sets the stage for exploring how writing can be approached like an athletic endeavor, emphasizing the importance of process and mindset.
"hey there friends this is how I write and I'm your host David prel my guest today is Jimmy Sony who's an author and a speechwriter and he is obsessed with Innovation endurance and creativity and in th..."
Writing Upward vs Downward
Jimmy Soni discusses the concept of writing upward versus downward. He explains that some writers, who are experts in their fields, aim to distill complex ideas for others, while he prefers to take readers along on his learning journey, making the writing process more relatable and engaging.
"your comments on notes and sources at the end and one of the things that I found really interesting was this idea about writing a book upwards versus downwards talk about that it's more of an admissio..."
When an Idea Becomes a Book
Jimmy shares his practical approach to determining when an idea is ready to become a book. He describes maintaining a Google Doc filled with potential book ideas and emphasizes the importance of finding a unique space on the bookshelf that hasn't been filled by other authors.
"anything about these these subjects at what point does an idea become now I'm writing a book about it right like with the cloud Shannon book you discuss a conversation that you had with a friend and y..."
Insights from Peter Thiel
In this segment, Jimmy reflects on his work related to Peter Thiel, discussing the unique insights he gained while exploring Thiel's influential book 'Zero to One.' He highlights the connection between Thiel's ideas and broader themes in business and innovation.
"piece when does it have what it needs like the the core concept and I felt this with my peter teal piece like it was just obvious Peter Thiel somebody who people are interested in I felt like I had a ..."
The Entrepreneurial Mindset in Writing
Jimmy elaborates on the entrepreneurial approach to writing, likening it to identifying gaps in the market. He emphasizes the importance of originality and the desire to contribute something new to the literary landscape, rather than simply replicating existing works.
"let's walk through the Dynamics of like what made this the right time to write about the PayPal book what were we missing talk about that it's interesting I'm going to do a half beat before I answer t..."
Jimmy's Research Process
Jimmy discusses his meticulous research process, detailing how he gathers information and insights for his writing projects. He shares the importance of thorough research in crafting compelling narratives and ensuring accuracy in his biographies.
"admire about your process is just how intensely you research and so let's start off with this idea that you were sharing with me something that you picked up from Robert Caro something you admire abou..."
Managing Information Overload
In this segment, Jimmy reveals his strategies for managing the vast amount of information he encounters during research. He emphasizes the need for organization and clarity to effectively synthesize data into coherent narratives.
"this information a lot of coffee no um the the honest answer is you know I was just another Google doc they are just filling out but well that you nailed it actually yeah I don't want to act like I ha..."
The Art of Note Taking
Jimmy shares his unique approach to note-taking, highlighting how it aids in the writing process. He discusses the importance of capturing insights and ideas in a way that makes them easily accessible during the writing phase.
"the things I really struggle with as uh as a note taker is underestimating the vividness yeah of an experience when you're there and how fast memory decays yes so how do you push yourself to do that a..."
Interviewing Elon Musk
Jimmy recounts his experience interviewing Elon Musk, sharing insights into the dynamics of the conversation and what he learned from engaging with such a high-profile figure. He reflects on the challenges and rewards of interviewing influential personalities.
"have the adrenaline crash and like kind of calm myself down do you remember what you said after interviewing Elon see I don't have to remember because it's recorded but I remember I remember what I re..."
Writing Like an Athlete
In this segment, Jimmy elaborates on the concept of writing like an athlete, discussing the discipline, practice, and mindset required to excel in writing. He draws parallels between athletic training and the dedication needed for successful writing.
"writing but I think that it's a really important observation people don't think of great business people as professional athletes in terms of their dedication their rigor their intensity their Insanit..."
The Painstaking Parts of Writing
Jimmy discusses the more challenging aspects of the writing process, including the emotional and mental hurdles that writers face. He emphasizes the importance of perseverance and resilience in overcoming these obstacles.
"recorded audio and you have confinity alerts set for every single time that that word is mentioned so you find something you're like okay I just need to write this down where does that thing go so I'l..."
Conquering Writer's Block
In this segment, Jimmy shares his strategies for overcoming writer's block, including practical techniques and tools that help him regain focus and creativity during challenging writing phases.
"already within it and I like that metaphor because it takes writing from a process of creation to a process of subtraction and refinement and reduction and that idea helps a lot of people that's a muc..."
Using Google's Voice Typing
Jimmy discusses how Google's voice typing feature can assist writers in breaking through creative barriers. He explains how this tool can facilitate the writing process and enhance productivity.
"they won't get speakers blocked they can talk right totally so what I would do is if I was stuck is I would actually take a I would open up Google Docs I'd go to tools voice typing and I my understand..."
Techniques for Sharper Writing
Jimmy shares his best techniques for sharpening his writing when he feels stuck. He emphasizes the importance of clarity and precision in conveying ideas effectively.
"the other trick I use is I will often write big sections of a chapter on the phone the phone is one of the best one of the best techniques I've seen for getting material out when I'm stuck or when I'm..."
Admiring Michael Lewis
In this segment, Jimmy expresses his admiration for writer Michael Lewis, discussing the qualities that make Lewis's writing compelling and impactful. He reflects on the lessons he has learned from studying Lewis's work.
"one of my favorite writers one of the writers I most admire is Michael Lewis hmm and his books are just they're just legendary and he has a way with words that you know I'll never achieve because I di..."
Studying Influential Books
Jimmy explains why he studies other influential books, such as 'The Everything Store.' He discusses the insights he gains from analyzing successful works and how they inform his own writing.
"books I admire that might be cousin to my book and then just breaking them down so like you know we're in the therapy confession mode the book that I read I mean I must have been 16 or 17 times all th..."
Applying the Apple Model to Writing
In this segment, Jimmy explores how the principles behind Apple's success can be applied to writing. He discusses the importance of innovation and user experience in crafting engaging narratives.
"it I just have to study and understand and really dive in so that's one to answer your question like how do you know what to keep and what to cut you can develop taste through rigor you can develop ta..."
Funding Secured and Elon Musk
Jimmy shares insights into the funding process for his projects, particularly in relation to Elon Musk. He discusses the significance of securing funding and how it impacts the writing journey.
"to like fun little things right so I'll give you another example this one's fun there was a moment in the book where Elon closes the big financing round for x.com x.com is the predecessor company to P..."
Warmth and Word Choice
Jimmy emphasizes the importance of warmth and word choice in writing. He discusses how the right language can create a connection with readers and enhance the overall impact of a narrative.
"it if you're going for warm words this is sort of in that Williams answer on writing well right it's one of my favorite books about writing and he talks about warmth warmth is a is the quality for him..."
The Writing Factor with PayPal
In this segment, Jimmy discusses the unique writing factors that influenced his work on the PayPal project. He reflects on the challenges and opportunities that arose during the writing process.
"they're human beings yeah how did writing factor into the PayPal story I know they had a company newsletter you looked at a bunch of emails what else happened writing was valued at the company so one ..."
Value for Readers
Jimmy explains how he ensures that readers gain value from his books. He discusses the importance of delivering meaningful insights and engaging narratives that resonate with audiences.
"the things that I uncovered as at least I think I uncovered it as I was prepping for this was I was looking at your notes and sources from the founders and one of the things that you talk about is a w..."
Jimmy's Narrow Media Diet
In this segment, Jimmy shares his approach to consuming media, describing his intentionally narrow media diet. He explains how this focus helps him maintain clarity and creativity in his writing.
"got to where he is and what these four and a half five years in his life meant will they get value out of reading my book and I tried to find the ideas the concepts and the stories that were both new ..."
Life Beyond Writing
Jimmy discusses the importance of leading a life outside of writing. He reflects on how personal experiences and interests contribute to his writing process and overall creativity.
"can actually lead you to a really great process so let me talk about another part of the process that we haven't touched touched on yet that might be helpful to people um I have an insanely narrow med..."
Jimmy's Morning Routine
In this brief segment, Jimmy shares insights into his morning routine and how it sets the tone for his writing day. He emphasizes the role of routine in fostering productivity.
"is very intentional about the life that they live away from the page in order to facilitate good writing how does this show up in your friendships how does this show up in you live in New York City ho..."
The Need to Write
Jimmy reflects on his intrinsic need to write, discussing the motivations that drive him to put pen to paper. He shares how writing fulfills a personal and creative necessity.
"quick sure I I wake up and it's a little bit sort of like what sort of superstitious baseball players right so I have I mean how many letters did you tell them um I try not to alter a single thing in ..."
Writing in Public
In this segment, Jimmy discusses how writing in public has transformed his approach to writing. He reflects on the benefits and challenges of sharing his work with a broader audience.
"same time you don't get that though unless you need to write and I mean need with 500 E's why do you need to make things like this yeah I I don't think I'll have a complete answer because I think it w..."
Lessons from Speechwriting
Jimmy shares valuable lessons that writers can learn from the art of speechwriting. He discusses the importance of clarity, engagement, and storytelling in both mediums.
"change what you wrote I would presume level up the quality oh I worked so much harder on my college columns than on my College academic work like there's no it's not even comparison your friends are g..."
Writing as a Team Sport
In this segment, Jimmy explores the collaborative nature of writing, emphasizing that writing is often a team sport. He discusses the benefits of collaboration and feedback in the writing process.
"is so much of what you do what should writers be taking from the world of speech writing and bringing in two words on the page there are two thoughts about that the first is the books make me better a..."
Research Before Writing
Jimmy outlines his research process before embarking on a writing project. He emphasizes the importance of thorough preparation and understanding the subject matter.
"getting in response that's going to tell you a lot about what ideas aren't resonating yeah and so what I try to do is I try to use conversation as a lead into my writing and do as much of my writing i..."
Analysis Paralysis
In this segment, Jimmy discusses the concept of analysis paralysis in writing. He reflects on the challenges of overthinking and how it can hinder the creative process.
"how are you tracking research what are you looking for as you do it I front load the research and the research depends a lot on the project for this particular project the research was a mix of things..."
Lessons from Walter Isaacson
Jimmy shares insights he gained from studying the work of biographer Walter Isaacson. He discusses the qualities that make Isaacson's writing compelling and how they influence his own approach.
"worked for a while and still count as a dear friend an amazing coach named Lauren Xander and Lauren Zander people have heard about her because she's been on podcasts and various things and she's a coa..."
Making Books Readable
In this segment, Jimmy discusses the importance of making books extremely readable. He shares techniques and strategies for ensuring that his writing is accessible and engaging for readers.
"almost like a fire round but there's you've learned a lot from Walter Isaacson and Robert Carrow and I want to just hear what is the number one thing you've learned from Isaacson but let's start with ..."
Learning from Robert Caro
Jimmy reflects on the lessons he has learned from the legendary biographer Robert Caro. He discusses Caro's meticulous research and storytelling techniques that inspire his own writing.
"anybody that's writing about or talking about a writer at his level and of his quality has to be a little bit humble in like what they're trying to emulate because it's sort of tough right it's sort o..."
The Importance of Productive Discomfort
Jimmy emphasizes the significance of productive discomfort in the writing process. He discusses how embracing challenges can lead to growth and improvement as a writer.
"is in a league of his own he spends 10 years on a book right um that's I often call him like the OG like in my field he is he is the person who does the work at the level of quality that all of us asp..."
A Letter to His Daughter
In this heartfelt segment, Jimmy shares a personal letter he wrote to his daughter. He reflects on the lessons he hopes to impart and the values he wishes to pass on through his writing.
"instances with with some of the the stories in this book I I reached that level last question at the end of the book you read a letter to your daughter and you say that she should care less about the ..."