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Tom Segura, a comedian known for specials like Completely Normal and Sledgehammer, and the creator of the TV show Bad Thoughts.
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He's been on Conan and The Late Show with Stephen Colbert, and he's here to teach us about how to write comedy.
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>> What makes Tom's humor so distinct is how observational and story-based it is.
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He's the kind of guy that can look at something you've seen a thousand times and say, "Oh my goodness, you ever notice this?
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It's absolutely hilarious."
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And you're like, "Yes, it is."
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[music] And so I said, "Dude, you got to come on the show to teach us how you find jokes like that and write them."
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Now, what follows here is his answer and a few moments that had [music] me in tears of laughter.
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As you walk through the world, do you feel like you turn the comedy thing on and off as you're looking at the world making observations, or is that just something that's always there in terms of how your brain works?
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I feel like it's there and it's whether you are engaging that muscle.
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It's kind of like the muscle, right?
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Where you're like you can sort of focus on it, you know, channel some energy towards that and you can choose not to.
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I I feel like it's it's it might sound silly, but like the best thing to do if if I think if you're a a comic is honestly uh talk a lot. Mhm.
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You're like you're going to say more funny things if you're talking more, you know?
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It's a version of like trying things.
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Like you obviously you try it on stage, but even off stage it's like when you you have certain friends that you just like spout off to. >> Mhm.
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And like the more you do that and you're you you you develop this kind of skill I think over time where you realize when you're in conversation and you say something you're like, "That's a thing." Yeah. >> You know?
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That that becomes like the honestly like the biggest muscle of it all I think is recognizing, "Oh, that's something."
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Versus I'm just kind of shooting the [ __ ] Like just talking with you.
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Sometimes you get and you you something has legs and you develop the skill of going that's a thing.
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How much of funny jokes you think is being a little bit kind of irritated, agitated, kind of like pissy about the world?
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Like I think of Seinfeld and Larry David.
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That seems to be like a core thing of what they >> Oh, yeah, 100%.
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Like being annoyed is funny.
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My 7-year-old is annoyed all the time and he's hilarious.
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And it's also like, why are you so annoyed?
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But then he's just like, what's this table doing in the middle of the room?
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I keep running into it and you're like, oh, that's like a that's a funny perspective to have, to be bothered by furniture, you know, like he's he's naturally funny, but like complaining is funny.
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What's not funny is total indifference.
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So, like you you figure out that when it comes to being funny, you have to have an opinion, right?
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Like you can be like this is the best coffee I've ever had and you can make that funny.
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This is the worst coffee, but if you're just like it's good.
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Like that's not it's not funny to be like, it's fine. I don't care. Like that's not funny.
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It's funny if you go this tastes like [ __ ] like somebody [ __ ] into a cup and boiled it.
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That's funny or if you're like, this is God's gift to the world.
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I wish I could bathe in this.
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You can make that funny, but it's not funny to like not have an opinion.
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But complaining I think leads to funny.
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Also, like I love going off of like something I've overheard, you know, like I I find those like little moments to be some of the funniest things.
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Like little chatter that you hear, conversations you overhear, interactions, like small interactions, you know, like I some like I had I was just reminding someone of this the other day because people hit me up.
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Sometimes you have jokes that you go whether you like them or not, sometimes no one ever brings them up again and then sometimes people bring them up for years.
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And one of them was that I was checking into a hotel in Charlotte, in North Carolina.
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And I you know, when you check in, you say your last name.
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You're like, "I'm checking in, Segura."
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And the guy goes, "Oh, Japanese?"
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>> [laughter] >> And I go, "Yeah, 100%."
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And he goes, "Yeah, we don't get a lot of Japanese people here."
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And I'm like, "Well, you do now." And he's like, "Yeah."
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He's like, "Yeah, like sometimes we get like French or like Spanish, but not Japanese."
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And I'm like, I'm just like, look, I'm like, "Yeah."
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He goes, and he goes, "Segura."
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I'm like, "Well, yeah, you're saying it Japanese." Like, you can say it. You can say Smith. And it's Japanese. Like, I'm Segura. It's not Japanese.
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And this guy was like dead He was like, "You're not Japanese?"
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I'm like, "Do you have eyes?"
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>> [laughter] >> Like, you know there's a look, right?
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And he's just like, "Oh, I didn't know."
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But it's like one of those like small interactions that I took to the stage, and like I didn't know if an audience would respond to it, you know?
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And then they responded to it.
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But the funny thing is like it's now been close to like 10 years.
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And I walk down the street, and people go, "Segura!"
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Like, they just yell it to me.
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One guy got a [ __ ] tattoo of my face on his leg in a samurai outfit. And I was like, "What?"
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He goes, "Yeah, from that joke."
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I'm like, "That's what you want to see on your thigh?" Like, "Segura."
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Like, me as a Japanese warrior.
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And he's like, "I just love that joke."
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But you have metal problems, dude. Yeah, man.
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There's There's There's something a lot of your jokes is about the this like kind of awkwardness of conversation. >> Yes.
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Of you're really boring, or you're just kind of not getting it.
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Like, one of your jokes, I forgot what it is.
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It's like, "Yeah, you know, where are you from? Seattle." "No way. Cool. I got family in Denver." >> Yes. >> You're like, >> Yeah. "What?" >> Yeah.
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That was a guy A guy that guy we did it about.
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Why Why did you associate the two?
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Or the guy I I did one in a special too where I remember I was I was walking to this bank in LA.
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And the guy goes, you know, like he it was like the security lobby guy.
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And so I just walk in and it's like there's the lobby area and then you go into the actual bank.
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And just as like that courtesy thing, I go, you know, like how you doing?
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And he goes, well, I don't know, man.
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I haven't seen my sister in a while, but she's in Virginia.
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I was like, what the [ __ ] are you doing right now?
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And he told me like his whole like the drama of his family.
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I was like, I'm going to I'm walking through the lobby, man.
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>> needed a couple twenties.
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>> Yeah, and he just like kept going on about like his family situation and I had to be like, yeah, okay. Thanks, man.
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But it's like it is those like those small things that you you go like that antenna of yours goes up and goes like, oh, this is this is funny to me cuz ultimately I think in stand-up whether you're talking about Seinfeld or any comedian, like what you're really doing is is you're going this is what I this is what I see.
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This is what I think's funny.
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And those like little interactions have always been something that I've reported. You know what I mean?
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Like before I was on and doing stand-up, I would have taken those interactions and told friends about them.
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I told family about like I was in the hotel and this guy did the like I would have just would have told people because I find it very funny. Yeah.
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Well, this is a way to think about it is it seems like there's the things that we all experience that we know that we all experience.
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Like we're conscious that we've experienced that.
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It's raining outside today.
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You know this, I know this.
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We both had that thought today.
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But then there's the things that we all experience that we haven't had that conscious thought of, but everyone's kind of experienced.
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Like here's another example that I think has made for some really good jokes over the years is like you land the airplane and then you get to the gate and then the pilot does the ding and everyone stands up.
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And then you don't get off the airplane for like 15 minutes.
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It was one of those things I noticed probably 60, 70 times.
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Now all of a sudden someone makes a joke about this.
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They nail it and it's just hilarious.
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>> It's hilarious and you go as a comedian what happens is sometimes oh my god, it's one of the most unnerving things is exactly what you're talking about and you go, "Why didn't I just say it?" You know what I mean?
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Like you had the same observation but you never articulated it.
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And then you the some other comedian does and you're like, "Of course." Like of course.
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Like we've all experienced this but that person was the first one to actually say it.
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And sometimes you just go like, "Yeah, like I don't know."
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There's a disconnect happening from your brain that goes like I don't don't you don't have to say it, you know.
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And it's like you get a charge from hearing someone say it.
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You're like, "Yeah, I should be saying more."
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It's like the whole thing of like just say it all.
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One of my friends I was talking to him because I put out a special uh a few months ago on Netflix called Teacher.
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Once you put out a special, you know, that material's done.
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So you got to start over again.
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Normally I would go um I would take like a couple weeks off and then start again, right?
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But this time it was the first time in my whole career where the special came out and then I went right into pre-production on my show on Bad Thoughts.
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And so I went into pre-production, then we went into shooting it and then we've been in post and it's been like a very demanding schedule.
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So I've never had this amount of time off from stand-up ever in 25 years.
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So I was talking to my friend.
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I was like, "Yeah, man, like I've got to get back on stage and try new stuff."
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And I'm like, it's There's always this thing where it's a familiar feeling where you go, "I I have to start over again.
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How will I ever do it again?"
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But it You remind yourself that it happened every time.
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And I was like, "Yeah, I'm there right now where I'm like, how will I ever do this again?"
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And his advice, uh, Jeff Tate, great comic.
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He goes, "Just do them all.
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Even like write down all all the thoughts, even the dumb ones." Right.
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"And take the dumb ones on stage."
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He goes, "Just say them all."
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And I was like, "That's actually the best advice."
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Is like, "Don't try to filter through that's not good enough, that's kind of uh The editor can't come too early. No. Just go. Just go, say it.
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And when you Cuz the thing that happens is when like you write down the dumb one and you go, "Ah, that's not worth saying."
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When you get on stage, something happens between the idea and the performance where you will take it somewhere that you can't anticipate without an audience.
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The audience somehow manifests a different thing out of you that you go, "Oh, I wasn't even I wasn't thinking this 30 seconds ago.
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But somehow being up here, the the mixture of the pressure and the adrenaline and the thrill all comes together and something else comes out of your mouth.
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You know, and that's the part that's kind of like magical that you can't really describe. Yeah.
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How much do you think of uh good jokes being kind of about subtext and laying out the subtext?
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It can be that where like you guys are going towards the same destination together. Or Yeah.
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I think the most like the simplest way to describe like I think the best feeling of a joke always is the element of surprise.
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So it's almost like if they are anticipating anticipating and then you you turn somewhere else.
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Like you say the thing that they were not expecting, that is the biggest rush.
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Or like the idea of upsetting them.
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Like I like to upset them.
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And then have them be like shaking their head, but you still manage to get them to laugh.
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So they're reluctantly laughing.
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That's also like such a rush.
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Because they're laughing against their own judgment, you know?
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Which is also like very very fun to be like They're like, "I don't like this topic, but damn it, like you're making me laugh at it."
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That's always a fun thing to do.
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And as a comic, you can point that out.
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You're like, "Okay, guys, there's clearly something here.
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You guys are holding back."
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Yeah, you guys actually do like this.
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Like you do think this is funny.
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Comics we usually think of doing the hour in that way, too, where >> Huh.
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you you build a good rapport with them as you're doing it.
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So a lot of times, I mean, some comics will open with like Here's I'm going to say something awful, right? And that's it.
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But usually like the most provocative thing is later in the set because you've built this goodwill with them, right?
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Like even in a in a a large broad term of like minute 5 and 10 and 15, they're they're just like They're building trust.
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They're getting to know you.
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They're like, "Yeah, this is I like this guy." Mhm.
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And then minute 25, you could be like, "Here's the most awful thought."
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And they are at that point, they're on your side. Yeah.
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So you kind of get away with more.
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So like he's doing that within that bit, but you also end up doing that kind of within your hour, you know? >> Mhm.
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Like at what levels do you think you want to land the jokes?
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Do you know, do you ever think like, "I got to get these words right?"
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Cuz sometimes I'll watch comics and I'm like it almost feels like you're reading a script that you had written in the past. It's like too refined.
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Yeah, I mean, there's no substitute for doing tons of sets, right?
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Like when people especially when it comes to like let's say a taping.
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Like you kind of want to have, I think, a couple hundred runs of that set under your belt for the tape.
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Like literally like 200, 250, you know, where you're just like this is a finished piece of work.
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If you're not taping it, you know, part of that journey is like the sets that go wrong or the moments that you fall off track or but I like I also don't even want to put a big show on sale if I don't feel like I've done all that work.
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The work is like that's kind of like what you remember, too, about it.
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Like right now where I'm at this like beginning stage, it's it's like it's it it's unnerving, you know, it's like you feel totally insecure, but you know that like little by little you can do it.
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You know, you can do it, but I mean, it's also kind of the thrill because you go like what am I going to do? What am I going to say?
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And like I I started writing down just kind of like bullet point things. What about this? What about that?
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And so next week I go on stage to do like a 10-minute set.
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I have no idea how that 10-minute set will go. It could go terribly.
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I won't I mean, I won't love that it goes terribly, but but I understand that it's part of like the process of of building, yeah.
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But yeah, if you're unprepared on a big set, it's it's um it's one of the worst feelings.
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>> What is it that you love about Chris Rock's comedy?
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He is the best at like deconstructing an idea.
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He has almost like this formula of like say the thing, make the premise very clear, and then break it down.
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High-level comics break down concepts from multiple angles.
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They leave kind of like nothing there.
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They say the thing and then they go from this so you're just like it you've exhausted it and you've done it like he's, you know, like cutting and honest and brutal.
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People older than me, they're always like so they'll be like Pryor, you know, they talk about Pryor and I understand you know, it's a brilliant comedian.
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But there's also like the age in which you watch something like the impact it has. >> of like music.
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>> Kind of like music, yeah.
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Even also like honestly about sports. Like >> Yes.
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people have you know the goat debate. Honestly >> Totally.
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>> everyone who's like 35 and younger, they go oh it's LeBron.
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And it's like yeah, you grew up watching this.
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>> You never saw Jordan in the 90s.
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>> For them that's like that's some old [ __ ] and you're like yeah, I know.
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But that's what I grew up watching, you know, so like the impact of it is different.
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So when I was like I guess I was like a junior in high school, Bring the Pain came out. It's a perfect special. It's so high-level.
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It's just eviscerates every topic like just destroys.
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And so you're like when you watch that you're like I remember watching that being like I didn't even know someone could do that. Like do it like that.
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So he was such an influence on me like I was so obsessed with his comedy that I have tapes of me doing stand-up in the early like I'm just starting and I am literally doing a bad Chris Rock impression.
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And at the time you don't realize you're doing it.
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When you watch it now you'd be like oh like I'm crouching and I'm like I have that hand like this and I'm like I'm literally like I have his cadence and rhythm down and you're like oh yeah, that's what new comics do is you emulate your favorite comedian, you know, and but yeah, he's he is fantastic.
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So I looked up some good Chris Rock jokes.
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So, this is from the 2000s. Mhm.
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You know the world is going crazy when the best rapper is a white guy, the best golfer is a black guy, the tallest guy in the NBA is Chinese, the Swiss hold the America's Cup, France is accusing the US of arrogance, Germany doesn't want to go to war, and the two most powerful men in America are named Bush and Dick. Need I say more?
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>> He is clever and it's also you can see that like it's um it's so clean in that meaning like you're not like if there's no vagueness to it.
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Like Rock's thing is like like really punches you with it, right?
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There's no like oh, there's some nuance to like what he's saying here. It's very direct. Yeah, like this.
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If you can keep your son off the pipe and your daughter off the pole, you're ahead of the game. Yeah, yeah. Dude, that's so good. It's so good. It's so good.
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Yeah, I mean that's um he's he's definitely one of the best ever and I think Have you gotten to meet him? Yeah, several times. Yeah.
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>> And what have you observed from what he does?
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Um well, the the times that I've met him have all been like social situations and he's been like super nice, like super super gracious.
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And I got to see I saw him when he came to Austin and I was backstage like hanging out and stuff and but I mean, I was total like I I have this thing too where I've always treated if you're a guy and you're 10 years older than me or whatever like I can't talk to you like a peer. Mhm.
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You know, I don't know if it's just like in how I was raised, but like I just can't. Hello, Mr. Rock. >> I mean, almost, yeah.
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Like and I and I'm and you could tell that like a a a number of these guys are like just talk to me normal and I'm like, yeah, I don't think so. I I don't think I can.
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So, uh to me it's like I'm just um I'm just like a super fan in that regard with him and and a and a bunch of guys from that generation.
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Um but I just yeah, I just admire what they've done and like they've inspired the hell out of me.
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Like like I really wanted to do it because of watching these guys, you know?
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And he's um Yeah, he's he's absolutely one of the best.
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He's one of the best ever.
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How would you break down the different kinds of comics?
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Like there's the kind of Mitch Hedberg one-liner master.
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You're more of a story guy.
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How do you break down the different categories?
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I don't think stand-up's ever been more popular.
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So what happens is the pool of how many types of how many comedians there are is so much bigger than ever.
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Like I I feel like there used to be a time where I was like, yeah, I basically know the names of every working comedian.
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And then like I kind of felt like that.
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Like I'm sure there was some that I didn't.
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But now it's it's out of the stratosphere.
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Like I I have no Like and it's also internationally very pop There's there's like super big successful comedians all over Europe, all over Africa, South America.
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Like the it's very, very popular now.
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And I think you can kind I mean, the categories storytelling's obviously one, social commentary.
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Like there's there's the ones who are really adept at at like, you know, we'll say like Rock kind of falls into that at least for part of what he does. Jon Stewart.
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But there's a bunch of them.
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And then there's the ones who are like like content-wise it's about, let's say, um hypocrisy or or then there's the ones who are like it's all about relationships.
20:50
But I think you basically break it down if you want to like not do so many categories it's storytelling it's um almost like what you call like traditional American comedian which is like um a bit more like between pure joke writer and storyteller.
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So, they kind of have that and then there's like the pure joke writer.
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The person who goes like clean setup joke, clean setup joke.
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Like Dave Attell is like the quintessential joke writer.
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And then there's a like Sam Morril gets up there and it's just joke after joke after joke.
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Anthony Jeselnik reminds me of that.
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So, I feel like you could kind of be like there's three.
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But then then someone brings up what about like this uh the like the alt type of comic where it's like you're you don't expect any of it doesn't seem like it fits into either of those categories.
21:42
You were talking earlier about having strong opinions.
21:45
Brian Voltzman is a guy, probably more than any comedian I've ever seen, who just comes at it in a way that I've never seen a comic come at it before.
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I've never met a woman who likes his comedy.
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Whenever whenever I go to the Mothership and see him with girls, they universally cannot stand him.
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And then the guys are divided about 70% of which I I think he is one of the funniest comics I've ever seen.
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Makes you so uncomfortable, but then like heavy death metal, you kind of like open up to it.
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Yeah, he also does that thing, too, where he he's using how he knows people feel about a topic to his advantage.
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You know, he's like, "I know that this is an unsavory thing to say as a statement."
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So, like the statement comes first and you go like That can't be your statement. Right?
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And then you follow it up with jokes.
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So, it's like it's it's like I way I always thought it was so like it's so lame to be like, "You can't say anything."
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You know, when people are like, "You can't say anything."
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And you're like, "What you talking about?"
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And if you feel like Yeah, but people are upset when I say that. You're like, "Right." That's an advantage.
23:00
You know that they don't like that.
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So, you can say it, know that they don't like it, and then follow it up with your jokes to support it.
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Like to support your what is even if it's not really your opinion.
23:13
You're designing your crafting this thing based on the fact that you know that's not a likable thing to say, right?
23:20
He that's like he has mastered that.
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He's mastered that I know you're not going to like when I say this.
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I know you're going to react this way, but then I'm going to hit you with jokes that follow up on it to the point where you're just going to either give in or be like, I'm leaving the room. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
23:38
Where do you think you stand on this spectrum of like, I'm a comic because I like making people laugh and I'm just all about that and I would assume this other comics who are like, I need to say what needs to be said, you know what I'm definitely not that. Definitely not that. No. No. No.
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I'm not that smart and I don't have like this man, I need to get this out of me into the world. No.
23:59
I like I like performing. I like doing stand-up.
24:02
I like making people laugh. I like to laugh.
24:03
So, to me the whole thing is like I just I like doing stand I like it's it's fun.
24:10
It's it's fun to do stand-up and I you feel like this has been like the biggest thrill.
24:14
There's no thrill like getting on stage with an idea you have and getting people to laugh. Like that's the drug. That's the addiction.
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That's why you see comics performing to their 90s is cuz like it's a it's a thrill.
24:30
You want to just keep doing it.
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But I don't have like I need the world to hear this. Like I'm not that guy.
24:38
Who do you think crushes stage presence? I saw Joey Diaz. Yeah. Oh my gosh. >> Just gets up. >> Tornado. He's a tornado. Unbelievable. Who have you looked at? Oh my god.
24:48
Like the perfect, if you want to call it, stand-up is somebody who has the combination of stage presence and the writing, right? So, they Yeah.
24:58
that that's like that's what makes a great stand-up.
25:01
But, sometimes you watch somebody you're like, this person's a great writer.
25:08
Their presence is not as much.
25:09
Sometimes you are more presence heavy and the writing's okay and then sometimes it's like a combination of the two.
25:16
Um Yeah, I mean, he takes over a stage and you're just like oh my god, it's just undeniable, you know?
25:21
Sometimes the presence is also what um what is exciting to you or what actually you realize you're responding to is how comfortable they are.
25:30
Like sometimes their presence is like power.
25:35
That's like its own thing where you're like, oh my god.
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And there's there's a number of people who come out like that, like they come out hot, you know?
25:41
Like you're like with energy.
25:43
I'm trying to think like Leslie Jones kind of comes out like, okay, like you're you're paying attention, you know?
25:49
Dave, for instance, Chappelle, you're like, yes, he's very famous, obviously, but you realize even before he was super famous, it's this putting you at ease >> Totally.
25:59
thing where you're like, oh, like you don't feel like jumpy, you know?
26:03
You're just like, oh, this person knows what they're doing.
26:05
Which is like a huge advantage for that comedian, ultimately, is to put people at ease with like either your charisma or how comfortable you are on stage, you know?
26:17
Like I remember years ago, I don't know why this just popped in my head, but like I saw Jerrod Carmichael, he was like 21.
26:25
And he's black, so I was like, are you 40 or 12? I didn't know.
26:30
But, when he came on stage, I afterwards I was like, I didn't know I didn't really know him.
26:35
I was just talking to him.
26:36
I was like, how old are you? He was like, 21. I was like, you're 21?
26:38
Because the way he walked on stage and the way he handled himself during the set, I was like, I would guess that you've been doing this for like 15 years.
26:52
You know, and it was actually like four or something, right?
26:54
And I was like, that's crazy to have that level of comfort, you know, like that's I think ultimately I think the goal is you want to be on stage and you want to be a presence that makes people feel kind of like at ease.
27:12
Unless your thing is to be a tornado. Yeah.
27:14
But like for me, it's like I want people to feel like, oh, he knows what he's doing.
27:18
Cuz one of the things you notice about stage presence and the performing aspect over time is that good seasoned performers on stage are not scared of silence.
27:32
They use silence to their advantage.
27:36
New comedians scared or terrified of silence.
27:39
Like you they're terrified, literally terrified.
27:41
Like a few seconds have gone by and people aren't laughing and they are literally like jittery, right?
27:49
And they and you'll start to see these different ways that they deal with that.
27:53
Sometimes they get really loud.
27:55
Sometimes they get frantic. They're screaming.
27:57
They're just trying to like get through the fact that this moment isn't getting laughs.
28:03
The super seasoned people use like silence and they realize that if they're if they're not frantic and they're going they're actually going somewhere with what they're saying that the audience is slowly like leaning in Yeah, they're leaning in.
28:18
And then at all sudden you realize, oh, look at everybody.
28:21
Everybody is like watching this person like this.
28:23
They're not the audience is not going, where's the laughs?
28:27
They're like, I'm following what you're doing because I mean, Dave's like the extreme example where he's like an orator.
28:33
He's a comedian, but he's a master at speaking to people.
28:35
And he uses that skill set in his comedy.
28:39
Like he he knows what he's got there.
28:42
And he does that thing where I've been in in arenas with him where there's 18,000 people in this arena and you can hear somebody's shoe move.
28:54
I mean, that's incredible to watch. Incredible.
28:56
Craig Ferguson, the late night host who retired, he would get on and he just say, "Want to have an awkward silence?" Be totally silent.
29:06
And he's like, "Oh, it's fine."
29:08
And my sense is he probably did 20, 30, 40 of those. Got comfortable with it.
29:13
Leans into the bit and it always ends up being funny. He's so good. >> He's so good.
29:19
>> He's so good at navigating like like a moment where it's not working and making it work.
29:25
Because he's I it really feels like he's just not scared, you know?
29:32
Some of that, too, like what I learned for myself about like getting on stage is cuz there's there's you you feel all the different emotions night to night.
29:42
It's not like you're the same guy walking out every night, right?
29:46
Sometimes you're confident, sometimes you're overly confident, sometimes you're scared, sometimes you're nervous, sometimes you're angry like you feel all these things.
29:54
And I found that like the best mindset for me to go on stage with is silly. Yeah.
29:59
When you feel when you're backstage and you're goo- like literally goofing off, like like really [ __ ] around with your friends, saying dumb like dumb actual dumb jokes and you guys are laughing and like really having genuine silly fun and you take that energy on stage, to me, for what I do, that's the best way I can go on stage.
30:23
And you you can kind of manufacture you try to manufacture it, you know, like like let's be silly.
30:28
Like like let's like let's not, you know, but when it's really happening, those are the best sets. >> Totally. The best sets.
30:34
Well, do you find that people can help you get into that?
30:37
Like for me, I can't be like if you were like you're like, "Okay, Tom, David, be silly." Like >> I I >> No. >> I just can't do that.
30:47
My sister walks in the room right now. Yeah.
30:49
You will see a silly come out of me that I just cannot create and it'll happen in 5 seconds.
30:55
>> And like if you were a touring comedian, what I would tell you is like bring your sister on tour. Yeah, no, for real.
31:01
Because you end up constructing these like Like when I go on tour, I have a tour manager, tour coordinator, uh production manager, security, merch person, photographer, opening acts, like all these people and they go city to city city with you.
31:16
It's so It's so important that you have You don't have to be like especially silly with them, but you go like You want to feel comfortable with your crew.
31:25
And like I feel like when we are in a good place, we are kind of laughing, joking about, like, "Look at this [ __ ] guy working here, this lunatic."
31:36
Who is like >> [laughter] >> You know, we start having those conversations.
31:38
And you you take that your backstage doing that and then they announce you and you're taking that energy on stage.
31:44
It's much better energy to hit the stage with than like down or like super serious.
31:54
>> Need to nail it tonight.
31:55
>> Yeah, and now, you don't want to like You don't want to hit the stage like I don't think like that. No. Yeah.
32:01
You don't really strike me as a one weird trick kind of guy, but are there things that you go for like this thing tends to be pretty funny, that thing tends to be pretty funny.
32:09
For example, I don't know, mall cops.
32:10
Five out of 10 authority, but they treat it like they have 10 out of 10 authority. >> Oh, yeah, yeah.
32:17
Like they work for the IDF or something. Always funny.
32:20
>> [laughter] >> Yeah, I mean, it is always funny, you're right.
32:24
Like the um the people who want to exercise like the little bit of power they have.
32:31
But you you see it and you're like, "I see what's going on here."
32:33
Even TSA, you realize that like that this guy this TSA person who is like, "Give me your ID. Stand here."
32:42
Sometimes they are really flexing on like, "Are you like a corrections officer?"
32:47
Like, [laughter] "What do you Who do you think you're talking to?"
32:50
Like, I had one one time that straight up like tried to embarrass me in in security. Like at the line.
32:59
She's like, "You got in the wrong [ __ ] line." And I'm like, "Okay."
33:05
She's like, "Do you Do you Does this Do you not read your pass?"
33:07
And I'm like, "What do you think you're doing right now?"
33:11
>> [laughter] >> And she You could tell this guy was like he was like, "Hey, hey, hey."
33:14
A guy I don't know was like, "Chill.
33:19
Like you don't want to get in trouble."
33:20
I'm like, "I'm not worried about this person.
33:21
Like this is a TSA agent."
33:21
She's a glorified mall cop.
33:24
If you're going to flex on me like you're a special agent, you [laughter] know?
33:32
Like I'm I'm not like I mean I I called over this person's supervisor. Yeah.
33:34
I was like, "You got to [ __ ] retrain this woman."
33:38
>> Same thing with bouncers at a middling bar.
33:40
>> It's exactly the same thing.
33:40
It's exactly the same thing.
33:42
Where they're just like what happens is somebody who has no power in the world and then you go like, "This is the one These These three square meters are yours to be the most powerful person."
33:56
And then who that person is comes out, you know? In their dominion. Yeah.
34:01
That's exactly what it is, man.
34:01
It's just like you know, it's like crossing the street slowly when cars are coming.
34:06
You're like, "I'm going to show everybody that I can like Yeah, you can get hit by a [ __ ] car, too, man. But yeah.
34:13
Like these people like it's crazy The TSA ones of all are like I mean, I'm sure it's not the most thrilling thing to do all day, but when they when when they flex on you, it's it's definitely some it spins me out, dude.
34:29
>> [clears throat] >> It's It's mall It's mall cop energy. It's cop >> Yeah.
34:34
I mean, the other thing too is like as the longer you do this, you know, it's like you start you start like going like, "Oh, I have a take on whatever, like AI, right?"
34:49
And then you go to the club that night and you see like 15 people doing AI bits.
34:54
And you go, "Okay, I'm going to do mine if I feel like it is like the I think the rule is like if you feel like your your bit is far superior to these other ones, then you do it.
35:04
Otherwise, it's what led me to doing so much storytelling about life cuz you go, "It's my own you know, it's my life."
35:12
So, that's why it's like stuff with my kids, stuff with my mom, stuff with friend like you start telling these stories cuz you realize no one else has that story.
35:21
No one else has that perspective.
35:25
It It really comes from the fact that like I've always loved storytelling, but I also know this is not happening to anybody else right in my way.
35:31
Or it is and you're just seeing it like the In-N-Out Burger bit where they humiliate you with eating in the car. Yeah.
35:39
They're like, "Are you fat?
35:41
>> [laughter] >> Do you want to eat in your car like a fat boy?" And you're like, "Yes."
35:45
And they give you an open pig trough and you eat out of that.
35:47
Yeah, and you're like, "Okay."
35:52
Cuz I almost feel like when they go, "Are you going to eat in the car?"
35:54
You're like, "Hell, I'm not a [ __ ] loser. Never do that."
35:55
And then they go, "You know you want to eat in the car."
35:58
And you're like, "Yeah, I kind of do."
36:00
Yeah, it is one of those things where I feel like when you have observations like that, like the In-N-Out one to be specific, you're like, "I got to get this out there because someone else is going to You know what I mean?
36:09
That's one of those you're like, someone's going to say this.
36:11
Someone's going to say this.
36:12
So, I got to I got to do it." Yeah.
36:15
Cuz you know that like other people have to be are clearly experiencing this too.
36:22
I remember too, sometimes you're on tour and like even with that bit, I would be doing it and like it would be clicking with audiences, right?
36:29
And you're like man, I got to get this special out cuz like that someone's going to do that bit, you know?
36:37
Like you feel this like almost relief that you got it out because some of those things feel like someone has to be making this observation, too. Mhm.
36:46
>> You feel like this almost like urgency to get it out.
36:48
Yeah, you got me thinking a lot about the connection between I'm frustrated with this thing that a lot of people get frustrated with and then what's the joke here? >> Yeah.
36:56
The thing that has frustrated me to no end is how every opener at a concert just sucks. Do they all suck?
37:06
>> There I I I mean, in my experience, they're just Maybe that's too harsh.
37:10
Concert openers are just terrible.
37:13
>> It's one of those things where like we were saying complaining is is part of what's funny, you know?
37:17
So like you making that observation to me is like yeah, stick in that like keep talking about how bad it usually is.
37:30
That That's where the joke li- In other words, the joke is you're on the path to what you're whatever the joke is there, right? You're on the path.
37:36
And it's like, you know, there's the Sometimes the thing that's too obvious isn't the joke because you're like it's too obvious. >> Mhm.
37:44
You digging in on the feeling of what's bothering you is where the joke lies as long as you keep expanding on it.
37:52
The joke is in expanding on wha- you know, why it upsets you.
37:56
So it's like is is what upsets you that you're wasting time?
38:00
Does it upset you that you showed up early?
38:03
Like what is it that upsets you? The joke is in there.
38:07
You have to like keep digging in. Yeah.
38:09
Didn't you think just show up later?
38:12
But then you if you miss the main thing whole night's ruined.
38:15
But if the if the show starts at 8:00 and you know the The act's not going on until 9:00. No, till 11.
38:23
I'm not showing up till 10:30. Oh, okay.
38:25
And even that 30 minutes bothers >> me.
38:28
[ __ ] Yeah, of course it bothers me.
38:29
See, there's the joke is almost in there that you're bothered by hardly any time.
38:36
>> [laughter] >> That's what's funny is that you're not spending 3 hours watching some [ __ ] You're spending like 15 minutes.
38:42
>> [laughter] >> And you're [ __ ] annoyed.
38:42
That's what's funny to me.
38:44
Like, dude, what are you talking about?
38:45
You can't sit through 15 minutes of some [ __ ] >> [laughter] >> It's like somebody yelling at the trailer before the movie.
38:51
You're like, bro, just [ __ ] eat some popcorn. What is your problem?
38:56
Uh how do you feel like Okay, let's take this joke.
38:59
So, how do you feel like you're able to tell a joke in Bad Thoughts Mhm.
39:07
TV show versus uh stand-up?
39:09
Like, what do the different mediums afford you?
39:13
>> Oh my god, it's so dramatically different and so fun. Yeah.
39:15
It's so fun because like in in stand-up, you know, it's like here's a thought, here's an observation, or here's something that happened.
39:29
And you paint your picture with words. You tell it.
39:31
And like I said, there's there's no thrill like the live audience reaction to it.
39:37
But in Bad Thoughts, when the writers' room starts, I'll come in with like a few drafts, and we'll read it in the room.
39:46
But you're there with other comedy writers.
39:48
So, it's so exciting cuz this is something you don't do In stand-up, you don't go like here's my stuff I'm saying.
39:53
I'm going to sit with like six comedians and go like, what does everybody Like, you know, sometimes they'll tell you like, I think this, or they'll give you a tag, like you should say that at the end.
40:03
You're like, oh, that's a good idea.
40:04
But it's not a fully collaborative process. >> Yeah.
40:10
But a writers' room, it's so much fun because you're sitting with like these other comedy minds, and you're hearing things from all different angles and you're like it just becomes like oh my god, yeah.
40:21
I didn't I didn't think of it like that.
40:26
And you sometimes I'll go and I want to tell this story and I think this is how to do it.
40:33
And one of these people will like either find a hole in the story aspect or they'll they'll bring up something else that makes your mind like that's the biggest thing about a writer's room that people I don't know people know is that yes, sometimes I can go here's an idea and somebody goes I have a take on it.
40:53
And they'll take it somewhere else.
40:54
But sometimes it's that I have I say something the other writer has something that they say and it sparks your own idea which feels so exciting.
41:06
You realize without them having said something, your mind would not have gone to this other place, right?
41:11
And that's like this really exciting thing.
41:15
It's like you get to do specifically with Bad Dudes, we get to do like mini movies.
41:19
Like they're like little crazy short films.
41:24
And the fact that you get to like come up with this concept, paint a real picture have it shot like cinema.
41:31
Like we have like really cinematic look and then you get to bring in other actors that just elevate the whole thing. It is so so fun.
41:42
It's like one of the most fun experiences that I've ever had.
41:44
What kind of TV did you look at in the same way that you looked at Chris Rock and you're like, I like that. I like that.
41:50
I want to incorporate this.
41:51
Wow, they're really inspiring me.
41:53
From the early onset, I would say, you know, I grew up in the era of like a lot of sitcoms.
41:57
So I did watch like Seinfeld and Cheers and Roseanne and just like so many of those shows.
42:09
Then I got into more dramas like, you know, they kind of got so much better I feel like as I was getting all the Sopranos and your Breaking Bad and and and these types of shows where you're like, oh my god, this is like so great.
42:24
When we were like taking bad thoughts out um Like pitching it. Yeah.
42:31
Um I actually funded a I made the pilot.
42:34
So I didn't have to like pitch the idea. I was like, here it is.
42:38
One of the lines we would say was like, oh this is like um Black Mirror but [ __ ] up comedy version.
42:42
What I loved about that show is they take these ideas and they obviously they they twist and turn, but they also make you fall into this world and they they make it very cinematic.
42:55
Like to me like the way it looks is a huge factor in the show.
43:00
You know, it's like you you really want to have that.
43:04
Um but the fun thing about Bad Thoughts is like they also Netflix just goes like, yeah.
43:10
Dude, make what you want to make. Like do your thing.
43:13
And they give us thoughts, you know, like they go they what if you did this or what if you you know, you lean more on this, but they don't go like, you can't do that.
43:24
Well, I was thinking as as I was asking that question about what you can get out in stand-up versus a sitcom, I think that the ability to kind of act something out and then take something small and make it a little bit more ridiculous >> Yes.
43:37
will just My favorite one from this season is that. Tell me that. of the new season.
43:41
It's It came from um it's one of my favorites I should say.
43:46
It came from an idea where I was sitting I was sitting after a show in the van.
43:52
Like they were driving us from the venue to like the hotel.
43:56
And I had Kirk Fox, who's a comedian and actor.
43:59
We were like, wouldn't it be really funny if a comedian for merch had something unconventional and ridiculous to sell that was like that was like uh inconvenient to sell for both the seller and the buyer.
44:12
And we were in the van laughing so hard like little tears like doubled over and we just kept kept riffing on it.
44:22
And I laughed so hard that I was like I'm I'm I'm writing this.
44:25
Like I'm writing I'm going to take our make-believe hypothetical thing and write a draft of it.
44:31
So I wrote a draft and I brought it to the writer's room and people were like this [ __ ] this is insane.
44:38
You know like this is >> Good insane or >> Like no like they were like this is funny but like I go no no no we play it like this is the most sincere thing which is the most fun thing to do is to take an absurd idea and really play it seriously.
44:55
And there's moments like that in the writer's room where you're like are we doing this one or are we not?
44:59
You know because you end up having more ideas than you can shoot. Hm.
45:03
And I kept putting it on the side of the board that was like we're doing this.
45:07
Sometimes people would move it over here and we'd bring it back.
45:11
And we ended up doing it and it's it it still makes me laugh almost like at like it did that first day that like it's so fun to be able to take this thing that you said like hypothetical and actually put it on screen as like this is a real thing.
45:28
That's like to me the equivalent in stand-up of like here's an idea I'm taking it on stage and you're like oh my god what a thrill that I got to say it on stage.
45:37
In Bad Thoughts you can have these like silly ideas and actually shoot the scene with the dialogue and the setting and like make it a thing and that one really makes me [ __ ] laugh so hard.
45:51
>> I love when a bit gets in your head and then you start seeing it all over the place cuz then that bit kind of lives with you. >> Yeah.
45:58
That's what's so fun about a skit yeah or sketch.
46:00
You can just bring it to life. Yeah.
46:04
>> And it it's like the perfect amount of exaggeration where how do you exaggerate enough where it's, you know, funny and sort of absurd while also retaining the reality of the situation of like this is a thing that could happen in your life and probably has. Yeah.
46:16
Well, um to me like the formula for like taking those ideas and putting it on screen like that is like the the the emphasis of this is grounded in real.
46:31
And like one of the things we would do like in casting is sometimes you'd look at the list of potential actors and you have these great comedy actors and then you have the dramatic actors and you go get the dramatic person.
46:48
Get the dramatic person to to deliver this thing because it gives it weight, it grounds it, it makes it real.
46:59
And the more ridiculous it is the less I would want the comedy person. Right.
47:04
>> I want the drama person.
47:06
And that is like the the most fun is taking the craziest idea and making it like seem like you're doing Shakespeare or something. You know what I mean?
47:18
But yeah, that's the most fun.
47:20
It's like funnier if it's not if they're not trying to be funny.
47:24
>> That's the key to it all.
47:24
The key to that all is like that's funny if both of them are playing it super real.
47:32
And the the big thing that you that makes it funnier is that the longer you hold on the real amount of time, it's funnier.
47:44
There's a the same way that like comedians get nervous.
47:45
I said like with silence.
47:48
There's a lot of things about like television and film today where people have like these they're like You'll know fast fast fast.
47:53
Edits just happen so much. Right?
47:55
Like even if you watch like European films versus like let's say most American studio films, American studio films have an edit like every 3 seconds.
48:03
And then sometimes you'll watch a European film where the guy making coffee, it'll be like a one shot and he'll it'll show him like putting the water into the thing and like you're watching the whole thing fill up and then he, you know, presses the button and you watch.
48:22
But what you realize is you're like "Oh, I'm not anxious watching this.
48:25
I'm watching somebody make coffee."
48:28
Like that's how it's like it's real.
48:32
The comedy of that moment relies on you actually having the time where the guy's like waiting.
48:41
The waiting is like makes it feel like it's real and then you're like, "God, that's so that's so [ __ ] long."
48:46
You just got to hold that thing, but you want to sit in that the real tension of a 25-second door hold, you know?
48:55
[laughter] Which is like so long to watch, but you're like, "That's why that's why it's funny."
48:59
It's like it's if she doesn't you know, like try to make it funny or, you know, if he doesn't do this, it becomes funnier cuz it's real.
49:07
The realness of it is what's funny.
49:11
When you're telling stories on stage and whatnot, what have you learned about setting the premise?
49:18
I mean, one of the big things about the people always talk about for when you're doing stand-up is like sometimes you have a story you go, "But what's my way in?"
49:26
Because almost like your reason for telling the story Uh-huh.
49:32
is as important if not more so than the story itself.
49:40
Because it gives it weight.
49:41
It gives it like people go, "Oh, this is a story Yeah, it's funny, but the reason for telling it is just as important.
49:49
That's where a lot of That's where like when you talk about like the work of I think doing stand-up, part of it is like I got to figure out things like that. That becomes the puzzle.
50:03
Why am Why am I telling this story?
50:03
Am I just saying like this thing happened?
50:07
You can and maybe it's funny.
50:10
Like for instance, I told the story on my last special of when I almost when I booked the to be the spokesman for Subway like years ago, all right?
50:24
I booked and I'm and I was doing it with Jared from Subway.
50:30
And I tell the whole story.
50:30
Now, you can just go one time I was almost a spokesman for Subway.
50:38
Here's what like tell the story, right? You can tell that story.
50:42
But on stage, what I did was I would start by saying I'm so grateful to be performing here, like doing this show.
50:54
I never thought this was in the cards for me, like being able to do arenas and amphitheaters and like huge theaters.
51:05
Like I thought the highlight of my career was when I booked the spokes the the campaign to be the spokesman for Subway.
51:16
So right there, you're you're having you you gave yourself a reason to tell the story.
51:21
It's different than just saying I was almost the spokesman for Subway one time.
51:27
And I know because then they go, oh like that's cool.
51:28
But it if you're connecting it to like this is I can't believe I'm on this stage.
51:36
Um I'm super thankful for being here.
51:36
I never thought this would happen.
51:38
I really thought the highlight of my career was many years ago when I booked this.
51:44
Now you have like a reason for telling the story.
51:47
They're they're engaged before you start it, you know?
51:52
And I feel like that is like a lot of the work, especially for storytelling.
51:57
It's like yeah, you have a story, but like figure out your way in.
52:02
Figure out a reason for saying it, even if it's something like like that.
52:06
But you you want to dig and not get lazy about those moments.
52:12
You want to figure out why.
52:14
>> Well, I'll talk to a lot of storytellers on how I write, and they'll say something similar, which is you want to set the stakes to show people why what you're doing is important.
52:26
But a lot of the art to the more baseline stories is making those stakes clear.
52:31
So for example, if I were to say to you, "Man, my apartment was a mess. My apartment was a mess. It smelled like weed." Yeah.
52:40
You'd be like, "Okay, that's fine.
52:41
Like, you know, that happens to a bunch of, you know, single guys or whatever."
52:45
Now, if you were to say, "I just moved to New York.
52:47
My parents are a little worried about me.
52:50
We fought a lot about the move to New York.
52:52
This was their first time visiting, and I wanted to show them that I'm a real adult now.
52:56
This was the right decision." Yeah. "Now they're visiting.
53:01
They just text me, 'Hey, we're here to surprise you.
53:03
We've just landed at Newark.
53:04
We'll be there in 2 hours.' My place is a mess. It smells like weed. It smells like weed." Yeah.
53:11
Whole different scenario. >> That's exactly right.
53:12
Yeah, you've you've created stakes, um the pressure.
53:15
Now the audience listening knows like, "Oh, there there's you could really disappoint them."
53:21
Those story the stage version of that is like, "What's your way in?" Right?
53:26
That's what that's how we would describe it.
53:28
It's like, "You could say, 'My place is dirty. It smells like weed.
53:34
My parents aren't going to like it.'
53:34
And people would be like, 'Yeah, I could I get that.'
53:36
But if you tell them the backstory part, and then you get to that, it becomes a lot more. you have your reason.
53:42
Like you What's the reason for the story?
53:46
So, that's what I spend I try to spend time figuring out sometimes like, what is the re- And then you know when you get it wrong.
53:51
You're like, "Oh, I just I didn't I just told that story.
53:55
I just said like, "Blah, blah, blah."
53:59
And it may it it gets laughs, but you realize that if you had done the work to setting it up, people would be more into the story. >> Mhm.
54:07
When I think of jokes, I think of punchlines.
54:09
But do you think of punchlines a lot?
54:11
I think the the way you do like uh like storytelling is the first time you do it, you go just tell the super long version of it. Okay.
54:19
>> Like don't don't go into it with like, "It's got to be like this."
54:21
And you realize the story is fat, right?
54:23
Let's say it's like a 7-minute story or something. 7, 10, whatever it is.
54:31
Then you begin the edit process of like, you don't need this information.
54:34
You don't need this in it.
54:36
Now you have it tighter, and then you go in and go, "I need something here. I need something here. I need something here."
54:42
Which is like kind of putting in jokes and punchlines throughout.
54:46
Ultimately, you love to end one of those on a big punchline.
54:52
And that in a way it's more rewarding when you solve it, cuz sometimes you go, "I know there's something there.
54:56
I know there's something there."
54:57
And and then you one day you get it.
55:00
But there's also like something that's like soothing and pleasing about the ones that you're like, "Yeah, I just went on stage the next day and just said the stuff." And it all worked.
55:09
It all worked with like tension, rhythm, punchlines.
55:12
Like it just all came together.
55:14
So, what does a setlist look like?
55:18
It's just word like one word for each thing.
55:22
Augusta, mans out, blackout, drunk, Hitler. Yeah. >> [laughter] >> Duck. Yeah.
55:29
Um Yeah, the Hitler thing I was just fascinated like I was fascinated cuz I watched a documentary and when I watched the documentary I this there was like all these details about like his drug use and like everybody feels like they who has any knowledge of World War II understands that like the Germans had like methamphetamines.
55:57
But in the documentary they're like, "Yeah, a lot of people don't know that he was on coke he was doing cocaine.
56:05
Also, it was given to him in the mornings by his personal doctor.
56:09
So I was like, you know, I would I just went on about like how like that things make more sense.
56:15
Like, you know, like you know, he'd wake up in the morning and then his doctor was just like, "Yeah, like good morning, my Führer."
56:23
and just gave it to him and that he would just [ __ ] do a rail and be like, "Juice!"
56:28
and be like, "Jesus Christ!"
56:30
and like >> [laughter] >> like you know I mean, like if you have a heartful of hatred and cocaine like it's not a good foreman, right?
56:40
Like that I was I was like talk about >> [laughter] >> that and like how his coke out behavior makes sense.
56:45
Like how he'd be like, you know, like you guys like my new [ __ ] I shaved the sides off my like the beat out showing his stash like you guys want to see my art, you know?
56:57
Like [ __ ] just ranting and raving.
57:01
But that's one of those things where like that's one of those jokes where you feel like um you literally watch a thing, talk about it on stage and you're like, "Oh, there's a bit."
57:09
You know, like that that whole idea of like are you turning it on or off?
57:13
It's like you just talk about things that enter your mind, right?
57:17
And then I also talk about like my kids.
57:22
So those are just like I'm going to talk about literally what happened.
57:29
And the kid you know, audiences will tell you what is what's the bit and what isn't, but it's just I report.
57:37
Sometimes people go like Oh, I know I know you made that [ __ ] about your kids.
57:43
I'm like, I don't make up a single thing about those guys.
57:46
Like I don't make up There's no invented thing about You're literally If you have kids, you'll be like you know.
57:54
You're like, yeah, dude, this is This is really what happens.
57:58
Like My kid yanked a [ __ ] duck out of a pond >> [laughter] >> by its neck.
58:03
And he was like, can we take this home?
58:05
And I was like, are you out of your mind?
58:06
Like I just told that like the whole story of it and people People with kids go like, yeah, dude, especially with boys.
58:14
They're like, yeah, I get it.
58:15
>> How would you think about word choice?
58:16
Like yanked is a way funnier way to say that than my kid pulled. A thousand percent.
58:21
You Sometimes you're It's one of those things you're heavily conscious of.
58:26
Um when you're in the mindset of like what when you're thinking like what is funnier.
58:32
Because you're at the There's words and sounds that are Yeah. funnier.
58:37
It's just Yiddish things are just universally hilarious.
58:39
Dude, it's like when somebody goes Like somebody got hit by a car or somebody got like clipped by a Like it's like the The clip is a funnier word >> [laughter] >> than hit, you know?
58:52
There's all these like little little things that yeah, you start thinking about.
58:56
And when you when you're really like dialed in on the version that is the funniest.
59:03
You That's That's also part of the word.
59:04
Sometimes you're like also sitting around talking with people and like especially offstage conversations where you you There's just funny people who describe things in a funny way.
59:14
You're like, oh that's how to say that, you know?
59:15
Like the guy didn't get a [ __ ] He got a He got tugged.
59:22
It's like [laughter] Like that's funnier, you know?
59:23
Like they all these that your ears just kind of pick up on you like that's definitely funnier to say that. Yeah.
59:29
How did you realize that accents and sort of merging into other languages real quick was so funny?
59:39
Cuz like you do that with Spanish. Oh, it's all the time.
59:41
Yeah, I mean from when you're a kid you realize that an accent is it's hilarious. Accents are hilarious. >> Hilarious.
59:50
>> So I've always loved languages, like love languages.
59:54
I love um learning about languages.
59:57
I I'm on my phone doing like >> You're a Duolingo guy.
1:00:01
Uh language like I do like three of the apps. Really? Yeah. I do them all the time.
1:00:05
I just I'm always liked languages.
1:00:09
And there's something about people pronouncing things that's just funny.
1:00:12
It also paints a picture.
1:00:14
If you're like I was I was in the I don't know.
1:00:17
I was in the store and the first one was like, "Are you looking for something?"
1:00:20
It it's different when you're painting a picture of a story versus somebody being like, "Are you looking for something?"
1:00:26
Like you imagine a different person, right?
1:00:30
It adds color to the story.
1:00:30
So uh yeah, I mean doing accents and and voices is like I think a huge part of of making it funny.
1:00:39
It's it's yeah, I mean I talk about my mother all the time who like I mean her accent is strong. She's Peru? She's from Peru, yeah. Yeah.
1:00:52
>> She's still, "How are you?"
1:00:54
And I'm like, "Jesus, I'm Catholic, you know?"
1:00:56
>> [laughter] >> She's uh yeah, she's a very strong accent.
1:00:59
There was that hilarious Hilaria Baldwin thing. Remember it went viral? No, what was this?
1:01:04
She's American, but she I guess spent a lot of time in Spain growing up. >> Okay.
1:01:11
She's American, she's like from Boston or something.
1:01:14
And she was doing some interview where she was like they were like I think it was for like a recipe.
1:01:20
And she was like they were like, "How do you make this thing?
1:01:21
You know, this is like Alec Baldwin's wife, I think, right?"
1:01:27
And she was like, um, you know, you slice the tomatoes and then and then, um, you slice up, how do you What's How do you say in English? Um, cucumber.
1:01:37
>> [laughter] >> I'm like, "How do you say it in English?"
1:01:39
Like That's your first language.
1:01:41
What are you talking about?
1:01:45
You know how to say it in English.
1:01:45
We How you say She didn't say, "How do you say that?"
1:01:49
She goes, "How you say in English?"
1:01:53
Like she transported, teleported to this other Spanish-only speaking It was It was insane.
1:02:00
And I I roasted her so hard.
1:02:00
And then and then this thing happened to me where I was like, there's always just like this karma of how this works because you What I forgot was if you are bilingual or tri- whatever and you start speaking one of those languages a lot, let's say the second one, Spanish and you're immersed for a period of time, you literally do run into going, like "Wait, what's the word again?"
1:02:35
Like of your native language. >> Wow.
1:02:38
>> And it happened to me where I roasted her so hard.
1:02:43
And then I went on a South America tour.
1:02:46
So I was like in Argentina and then I was in Chile and Peru and Mexico City and one of those airports somebody came up to me and was like, "Hey, will you sign this?"
1:02:55
I was like, "Yeah, yeah."
1:02:56
But I've been speaking just Spanish 24 hours a day for like, I don't know, a couple weeks or something.
1:03:03
And they were like They gave me the pen and I was like, um, "Oh, what's What's the name?"
1:03:09
And they were like, "Oh, you have to sign to my son, um, you know, August" or something. And I was like, "Okay."
1:03:13
I was like, "August" and then I put the comma, and I was like, "How you say in English >> [laughter] >> uh like I wish you well I like I couldn't think of the words because my brain was and I was like, "I'm a [ __ ] asshole."
1:03:31
For I was like, "This really does happen."
1:03:32
Like if you are immersed enough, you'll forget basic words, you know.
1:03:37
It was just one of those things where I was like I had to go on like a podcast and be like, "Sorry, Gloria. It happened to me, too." I I sorry.
1:03:46
I guess it it I guess it is a real thing. Yeah.
1:03:50
When you What have you learned about opening bits?
1:03:52
Like walking out, first thing you say.
1:03:56
>> It's a great I have done every version of how you can open.
1:03:59
And what I mean is I've done the slow burn, where you walk out and you're like, "How's it going?"
1:04:09
You know, like I'm going to just very like take my time getting into like the show aspect of this.
1:04:19
I've done hard hardest joke I can think of right out of the gate, and I've done everything in the middle.
1:04:30
I think there's valid points and advantages to doing each one.
1:04:38
Ultimately, I think opening on a strong joke is the best way to go.
1:04:43
Hav- Having done it all and like you could ask me on a different night where I might be like, "No, I I want to do this other way tonight."
1:04:51
I think it's it's all fine.
1:04:53
Like it's all supposed to be experimental and fun and trying things.
1:04:59
But if I had to like go like you can you should do it one way, I think you open on a hard joke, yeah.
1:05:03
I'm amazed watching your sets, thinking about even dinner conversations, how funny callbacks are.
1:05:10
Obviously, you're sharing information, but you're also kind of creating a world. >> Yeah.
1:05:15
And there's something about calling back to something in the world that you've established.
1:05:19
There's it callbacks are fantastic, but you what you get like kind of aware of and don't want to fall into is like the overdoing it. Yeah. You know? Like anything. Like anything. Exactly.
1:05:31
But there's like comics who are just like callback, callback, callback. You know what I mean?
1:05:36
Like where you're like, "No, no, no."
1:05:37
But when you're cleverly placing them and not over like the the fine line of like the perfect amount of them.
1:05:45
Yeah, I mean, you also see how much a live audience like love It's also like in in conversation when you do a callback to like it just shows the person that like you're paying attention, right?
1:05:57
It It becomes like kind of charming and smart.
1:06:01
It's like, "Oh, this person's witty.
1:06:03
They remembered what we said 5 minutes ago."
1:06:05
Like it's it's that kind of thing.
1:06:07
So, I think you do that in the in the presentation of an hour having a few carefully placed ones.
1:06:11
Yeah, it's like it's fun.
1:06:13
It shows like that you're thoughtful and I think audiences when they're dialed in on it, they love it. They love it.
1:06:20
Well, it gets to this deeper point about comedy that the line between extremely funny and extremely annoying is actually pretty thin.
1:06:26
Like we all had that friend growing up who they would make a joke Mhm.
1:06:33
and then they'd be like, "Oh my god, that's funny."
1:06:36
And then they would never stop making the joke. >> Try having kids. Yeah.
1:06:41
>> [laughter] >> That's what kids cuz kids don't realize like the first time they make you really laugh you can see in their eyes.
1:06:48
They're like they're like, "What's going on?"
1:06:50
And you're like, you're telling them like, "What did you say?"
1:06:53
And they say it and you keep laughing.
1:06:56
And they're like, you realize this is exciting to them.
1:06:57
They're like, "Oh, I can I can have this effect on someone?"
1:07:00
It's It's got to be like this It's a new sensation to them.
1:07:07
Like I'm I can say something and somebody doubles over laughing and then they inevitably say it like 3,500 times.
1:07:18
And then you have to be like, "Hey man, that's not funny anymore."
1:07:20
And they're like, "Wait, why?"
1:07:21
Cuz you said it too much.
1:07:24
Like you just you're saying it way too much.
1:07:28
And yet that can happen in with adults and with comedians too of like just the same point over and over and over.
1:07:35
And it's it loses That's why I I think like the key element to all of what is funny is surprise.
1:07:43
Like you want to be surprised.
1:07:45
Ultimately you laugh the hardest when you didn't expect it. I think.
1:07:50
Like it catches you off guard.
1:07:50
Even whether it's a kid at the house or somebody that MSG.
1:07:53
It's like you want unexpected thing to be said. Yeah.
1:07:57
As you were writing your book, what was different about that kind of comedy versus the show and stand-up?
1:08:07
The book was really one of the most rewarding and challenging experiences to me and it's it's not that deep of a book.
1:08:14
But but I wrote like a lot of just stories from from life and what I found was like having a great editor publisher was that like stand-up's all alone.
1:08:33
Television and movies it's like huge collaborative thing.
1:08:38
The book writing is a it's a dance. It's like a marriage.
1:08:42
It's just the two of you.
1:08:45
And that that was like cuz I had I had no idea what I was doing.
1:08:47
So I would just write pages, send them in.
1:08:53
>> [clears throat] >> And I did I wouldn't know sometimes that was the thing is like it was never that same like one chapter I would get back and she would write "This is perfect.
1:09:05
This is what the book should be."
1:09:05
And you're like, "Fuck yeah. Let's go."
1:09:08
You're like you're like feeling yourself and then you like see the next thing she's like crossed out, "What is this? Need humor here.
1:09:15
This doesn't connect to this."
1:09:17
And you're like, "What the fuck?"
1:09:18
And it felt like um a math problem, you know?
1:09:21
Like like a puzzle you had to solve.
1:09:24
But it goes back to like then I wanted to solve. Like I'd be like, "No. I like this story. I like the world." But she's right.
1:09:33
Like she was just brilliant. So, she's right. I got to readdress it.
1:09:36
So, I I liked the challenge of it.
1:09:39
I found it to be really a lot of work, man.
1:09:43
Like even for like it not being this you know, it's not a 400-page book.
1:09:50
I was like, "Man, this is a lot It's It takes a lot.
1:09:53
You really have to love that process to do it."
1:09:56
Um as soon as like it came out and it performed fairly well, they were like, "You want to write another book?" I was like, "Fuck no."
1:10:06
Like [laughter] this is so much goddamn work.
1:10:08
I I It's not that I would never do it again. I would.
1:10:10
But I remember at the time I was like, "You got it I need a break from this."
1:10:14
And I couldn't believe really how much goes in It made me appreciate like the authors that do it for a living all the time so much more having had the experience of doing it. It was a It was a lot. It was a lot.
1:10:30
Yeah, one of the things that I think you said about it was you just didn't have other things to lean on.
1:10:33
Pacing, rhythm, diction, whatever else.
1:10:36
It's It's like all you got is words.
1:10:40
>> It's the most I'll tell you this.
1:10:40
It was the most exposed and vulnerable I've ever felt in in any art form because as a stand-up I know I can say something, but I know I control so much with my delivery, with my cadence, with the way I say it, with my facial expressions.
1:11:02
You have all this power in doing that.
1:11:07
When you are actually like, "Hey, I wrote this."
1:11:08
and handing over the pages, you go through this absolute like crippling anxiety of like, "Does any of that translate the way that I intended it to be?"
1:11:22
Like, I'm not controlling the cadence anymore.
1:11:26
I It's It's the written word.
1:11:29
So, you feel like this like part of you is like, "Is someone going to be like, what the [ __ ] is this?"
1:11:36
Like, that That's how you feel when you hand it over.
1:11:38
And you're just kind of like waiting for them to be like, "Yeah, this is This is fun."
1:11:43
And you're like, "Oh my god, I didn't know."
1:11:48
You think part of it is that you're used to instant feedback? A thousand percent.
1:11:51
And that waiting of like, "Yeah, we'll get back to you in a week."
1:11:54
You're like, "You can't take a week."
1:11:55
You imagine like stay standing on stage and be like, "Let me know how this goes next week."
1:12:00
Like, you don't You have immediate response.
1:12:02
And it was um Yeah, that was some of the most anxious I've ever been.
1:12:06
And and I It It was that part of like, "I don't know if you're reading the words the way I wrote them."
1:12:14
In stand-up, I know that I'm saying it this way and I know I know how it's landing.
1:12:20
And that difference to me between the two was so massive. >> Yeah.
1:12:25
That um yeah, it was like it was terrifying.
1:12:27
It was actually terrifying.
1:12:30
But I ultimately a super rewarding experience.
1:12:32
I'm I'm really glad that I that I did it.
1:12:36
It's great to meet you, man. Yeah, you too, man. It was fun. Thanks so much. >> Yeah.