this is the album to me it's like Mindful and it's like peaceful and it's heavy in all the right places but it's like water it's like pure water flowing thank you that's a great compliment hi by the way hi great to see [Music] you I think we've spoken on every project multiple times now um I'm so happy not only that we're both still here and everyone's here we're all alive
let's not take that for granted y but but that you're just making your purest work and clearly in the best head space making it it's just effortless Vibes effortless right tasteful just there were some songs like there's a song on here uh red flags which is just you and an up and it's so captivating and it needs nothing else I mean Tom York does that yeah you do that but I know a lot
of artists that do that yeah I mean I love being able to take I mean the different elements that you can take away also add so much reduction is important it is so was there was there a version where it had stuff on it and then you just systematically took stuff off it well really when we wrote it it it was that only and the producer was in the room like okay I'm going to add the
drums like I'm going to work on I was like I don't think I don't think we need to like I think this is perfect as it he was like really I'm like yeah for real like there's something about this silence in the space and especially because of what you're talking about it's got that kind of melancholy you know feeling to it so to have the space it kind of represents that kind of like
that loneliness that space that you know message it's thoughtful and it's powerful and also there's a big difference between reduction and standing on on Simplicity um it's one thing to kind of build something up and slowly take things away it's a beautiful process and often reveals the most magical things that you couldn't have seen at the start absolutely it's
another thing to stand on on Simplicity to realize that just with two elements with a voice and just a beautiful accompaniment which is allowing the you know your message to resonate is enough and I'm just going to take a stab here and just say look I I just don't think you really make that decision unless you know yourself yeah yeah I mean it just feels like an instinct thing especially
with this entire project I feel I was really tapped into just kind of following my instincts and just finding the path that was kind of I guess like the world the universe was cultivating for me because even with the beginning of this project I made a intentionally to put it out in three parts and BB Angel was like a little bit more up and a little bit more bright and I felt like
with this project it naturally kind of evolved into like a little bit more of a deeper darker place a little bit more nuanced like a lot of even I think you know the minor chords and the way that the the songs feel they feel very classic but they also feel like it's moving in a New Direction which is always totally my goal totally totally totally totally look you're leaning into
ambient space and and I love ambient space I mean when I'm at home a lot of the time in fact before we we got this conversation going when I was in my office taking a meeting I was listening to Wing victory of the Sol who make the most beautiful ambient music wonderful strings just heavy beautiful immersive stuff so I'm really into that and I'm and I it's not lost on me the artist
like yourself the courageous Innovative the artists who are really truly following their own Vision are finding a way to incorporate their their music more and more right now absolutely CU I think subconsciously don't you think we're searching for space absolutely I feel like I was listening to a lot of that when I was creating this project too because you know we we're in a world
where we're inundated with so much noise so much Sation so much just stimulation at all the time at all times and it's so important sometimes to just like quiet down slow down and still find your voice in that I think that there's just like a really cool balance between like ambient and also like one of the people that I've been working with really heavily on
this whole roll out machine drum he put out an ambient album and like I think so did no such thing like a lot of my like favorite collaborators have been kind of leaning into that space as well and I think it's just so interesting to play with yeah just and the just positions between like ambient records and then records that also like have like all the drums in it you know like all the high
hats all the bass you know and and I think that that kind of creates a really amazing balance you know that's that's another great word to describe this album as balance um and it doesn't it just no Noe and no second is wasted like you didn't extend I know it's three parts so you could put it all together and say hey look this is a three- part exercise but this particular element
here I feel like to get to to put nasty on the end which is a gift M and not just to us but to yourself to say yeah man it need it needs its place on this record um but you didn't you didn't carry on after that you like no it's course it's cap it's done yeah I think it's succinct I think that that's important as well I think the intention with this project to
kind of do something that felt very intentional every step of the way is important just because you know I think the world again that we live in so inundated with so much content there's so many releases and really people's attention spans are crazy and we dropped these projects and within 3 months we're on to the next and we've moved on and I really wanted every
single part of it to feel so purposeful and succinct and like meaningful so we could really like sink our teeth into every every element so let me make this statement that I've made to a few of my other friends who are artists at this point in their in their Journey um and I and I and I'm going to share it with you cuz I consider are you the same we've known each other a long time I think
that you and your generation of artists are the most important generation to the Arts in my lifetime and I'll tell you why yeah why because and I was literally saying this to AG cook before you left when we're chatting about this and um because I think that before before the marriage of of the democratic distribution of Music the streaming era the internet when it
really took hold and the way that people were getting their information which is obviously through timelines and feeds and everything else and that becomes algorithmic and then we're just being told what to watch and what to think right we were building on something totally we were building on a previous model trying to make it a bit better a bit fairer a bit this a bit that it
became the wild waste real quick real quick and you all had to figure out how to navigate through a world while the people who are supposed to have answers lost their everything changed they didn't know they didn't have any answers no no one had I don't anyone was expecting it to be the way it is now no one was but but but but but the reason why you're so important is because
10 years on you've made your best record you are you love what you've made and you're supporting it you're working it you're making sure people know it exists and you're going to keep it alive yeah absolutely Billy on album number three could have sat on her hands and sold out stadiums she's promoting that thing like it's 1995 there you go Charlie X it's a brat summer cuz every day she's doing
something else to keep a brat summer going and so it's like you figured it out like we can't work for the feed no it doesn't work for us no my my my my motto and I'll leave it here for the algorithms and the feeds and all that stuff is if you're lucky and I think like Nast is always a smash but you got but you got lucky with that and you know what to do with that I felt like again
it was like that preparation meeting the opportunity of having the laid the groundwork of creating of project and and also focusing on the importance of a roll out of a project of being able to give people the opportunity to see it Discover it really sink their teeth into it feel an era like feel like they got a well-rounded you know like something that just doesn't feel so fleeting like
so many things in in our universe and I feel like yeah like being an artist who like has been in the industry since before streaming was what it is now and to now you you have to adapt you absolutely have to like you have to learn how you're going to navigate that space and how you're going to be a part of pushing it forward and still also keeping the elements that feel really
important like I feel like bodies of work are still so important so important so it's not like striking those no everyone's like do albums matter and I'm like you're asking the wrong person ask Tas ask the artist that are making them whether they matter they absolutely matter they matter mhm why because you get to say something yes and with one song you don't get the
same you just don't get the same experience of being able to tell tell your story and being able to like really make a mark and make a universe and make some a world that people can like dive into I think that's so important it's so much more visceral than just hearing a song on a playlist which is cool too it's cool and I make a ton of playlists but I treat them like albums like I'll
bring up thousands oh my gosh kids everything I'll spend more time putting them in order then I will selecting the songs that's so funny I get a real kick out of playlists you know I really do I have a good time I've got some good I'm like a big fan of playlist but I feel like after you've had like the label I not the label the album experience like
after you've listened to it after you've really had your moment with it then you can like piece it together part listen out of order I agree with that I also like discovering something on a playist and then being like oh man I need to find out more of that I've discovered so much music that way and gone into like decades and genres and geographical boundaries like have you ever heard any
of the funk that came out of ker in 1973 holy I bet it was bad it is bad man is so funky is crazy so I don't know I'm I'm having a really wonderful time with music right now it's taking me places and allowing me to feel things that I haven't felt in a long long time yeah I think it's something to do with to your point what's going on outside my inside's craving space really affording
that AB an expression right so let's talk about your safe space the place you like to go to what do you listen to what are those albums that don't even have to be the ones now cuz I go blank when people ask me that question but like historically you've gone to that allow you to feel something on purpose yeah well I mean my number one reference is always Velvet Rope because I feel like
that that album encompasses so much of what I try to embody which is having the genre range it doesn't ever feel like it fits in one box it's constantly evolving I think it's so ahead of its time um there's so many elements that like feel one song to the next song they feel totally different but they all make sense in the everybody had to go with her there too cuz you I know you've been
mentioning empty yeah empty is the most un Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis song I've ever heard them make I love that song same but you know like this they have their sound so beautiful sound the cause and the feel and everything else and they're adaptable but man did she drag them somewhere very unique there so great it's so inspiring and I always use that song as a reference like that's
such a great reference point because even like the mix of that song I think is so interesting like a lot of the like um like call and response kind there's this like vocal in the background that kind of is jumping from left ear to right ear and it's really hot in the mix it's not like tucked in there like a part of the beat it's like really really I just love like all you did that on
your Rob I just love all those elements I love how you did that on your album bit there's definitely moments in there where I feel like there's conversations going on in the background I mean literally on no broke boys but I mean like there are other bits where you definitely playing around with it and we and we talked last time we spoke about nasty and how wasn't lost on me the way
you position that so dry and up front I think the mix is something that we you know don't talk about a lot but it's something that I put a lot of effort and time and like focus into because itang ches so much of like how we experience a record and you know these are just again the things that you can really experience when you listen to like a full body of work you're that's cuz
you're a producer yeah that's cuz you're a producer and and I think you've become such an effective um uh representative of your abilities as a performer as a singer as a dancer as a choreographer that I think it's really important we just take a second to acknowledge the fact that you know you put this together and yeah you work with people but man it's your vision and and um and
so I just want to talk a little bit about that and and can we just divide the disciplines up just talk a littleit about the love of production the love of the Nery of it CU you're in the right room that's my jam yeah no I love it I think you know being able to find all of the the feeling within a a track there's so many different ways that you can
evoke it whether it be through like you said the minimalism the lack of the space whether it be through you know I I love like a ba a Bas like always does something to me there's something about like a rumbling grumbling like a 808 and then there's something also about like I've been trying to avoid like too much highend A lot of the times on these records so because I feel like my voice
kind of floats in kind of that area and just kind of I don't know there's just so many ways that you know you're super frequency in touch like you definitely figured out where you sit in the realm of warmth and space cuz I hear that on thirsty right like I love the way that the bass subtly changes key in the chorus just once and then comes back up and it's so subtle you almost think it
kit the key it's such a subtle shift and you recognize it you can't shake it so you get the same emotion every time it goes there when I I hear that song and it goes down I'm I go the same place but it took me two listens to figure out it had done that totally also I think it's like crazy as a vocalist you think a lot about how you're going to like play with
your vocal performance and that's something that I really love to do as well like use my vocal obviously as an instrument having these like really softer higher you know floaty almost like whispery elements as well as being able to do full voice things which you know creates I feel like an entire irely different impact on the audience when they hear how you know I'm singing on a
track so being able to play with those elements and jux depose that with the music I think is that's where the sweet spot that's the chef's kiss right there is that I mean like I I know you love to perform I know that you love to create art around your art yeah but I mean is the studio that that's the happy place the studio is just the most raw place I
feel like once once I'm filming a video Once I'm you know doing a photo shoot once I'm on stage that's that's kind of like the result right you know that's that's where I get to celebrate you know what I've done in that moment in the studio where you're kind of just like laying it all on the line and that's why I think I'm such a huge fan of like home studio spaces or places that feel really
really organic like I don't like the big like dark produced like heavy Hollywood I one yesterday and I and I and it was I was I was really so dry I was really I was really torn up and I'll tell you why because on the one hand I want these places to stay alive yeah they're they're you know history not just not just Legacy but yes Legacy but you know real people are drawn to them and and
they are places dedicated to the to the creation of art yeah and and they are by their very nature closed off from the world that's why there's never any windows it's like you're safe in here but I I get it like I need to see life oh yeah and there's something inspiring about those places too so like don't get me wrong especially when I was like first in the game going into a place
like that you know you're like wow there's something that kind of like makes you want to be on your when you're everybody was just smoking mad weed in those places that's oh my God absolutely I mean there's the other reason why there's no Windows just goes get fing hot boxing the studio but yeah like you know it's INSP it also forces you to be on your because
you're spending so much money to be there so that's the other things you're like locked in but I do think that that raw energy which for me is so important to creating like my best work my best art like I have to be not worried about what I look like what I sound like I can't be self-conscious I have to be fully kind of in my element and that's why you know a lot of my best stuff is
always kind of created like at my home or a place where I just feel the most raw the most real clearly cuz I mean some of the writing on this record is like very is wonderfully unfiltered but that's kind of like the best part is that you know the way that we get personal is through like is through the music like that to me is there's no like thing that feels uncomfortable about
that cuz once it's like in a piece of art it's it's be do with it what you will you know and that's why it art is so um like what's the word uh like magic magic but like it it it makes you feel so much lighter it makes you feel so much like like therapy you know like you're able to get so much off your chest so not everyone can do that though my friend not everyone can do that and and and and
a lot of people I think struggle with the execution because they take everything to the point of release and then they and then they're just worried about the perception right that terrible thing about how will I be perceived how will I be taken how will it happen and I think there's ways through that you've obviously found your ways through that yeah were there times before this where
it was harder for you to let some of those more personal songs go and how did you figure it out I think well I think there's also like something to be said for you always want to put on a Persona of of like confidence and like badassness and you never want to have like too vulnerable of a sideshow because you know obviously vulnerability and weakness are something that you know
there's a lot of you know trepidation well it refle it reflects on our own feelings that way and so what we do is we often reject other people's vulnerability because we don't want to go there ourselves but it's so amazing when we hear it coming from someone else cuz you're like oh my gosh I've experienced that too that's so great you're never like judging someone else
when they're vulnerable but for some reason we judge ourselves so much so I think it's yeah it's taken a a process over the years but I think I've really found so much strength and so much value in expressing myself through the art and also just like release and just like so much yeah like catharsis it's it's that's really ex exciting for me to be able to like go through something and be
like I'm going to write a song you know yeah yeah yeah makes the magic happen do you need a break from creating do you need moments where you need to refill and and find something new yeah I think so but I don't like um feel like I ever have to take like huge breaks I just kind of have to focus on other things like whether it be like the creation of
like my stage show or you know like Touring that obviously takes a lot of energy and a lot of focus so a lot of times that like kind of refills me in terms of like wanting to go back into the studio wanting to make more things but I think it's like a day-to-day process when it comes to being creative like if you're feeling inspired or if you're not like I don't judge myself if
I'm not coming up with a good idea on any given day which I also think is a skill that you learn after being in the game a while is trying not to like force yourself to make art because you're just going to waste everyone's time so what do you do when you don't so let's let's let's talk a little bit about the life balance right because you've obviously you know found a really great place in
your life that's why the music is reflecting that yeah I do want to know sort of how you've created a flow for yourself in terms of just living life I don't know I think maybe it's just a lot of the um acceptance of a lot of just not trying to push so hard against like what my path is a lot of just kind of being in the moment Letting Go Letting Go letting go of like the own
my own expectations for myself letting go of like what the arbitrary markers of success are I think that's once you are able to like work on that within yourself and it's like something I still have to practice all the time of course of course but I think that that leads to such a a place of freedom and that gives you so much space to like not judge yourself and just within that you unlock
like so many benefits I'm right there with you so many benefit yeah it's so funny you know I um the things that I used to look left and right at just don't matter to me anymore it's such a simple it's such a simple thing but it changes everything because it changes the core of like what your intention is behind like why you work what you know I feel like you never feel the that
feeling of like uh I don't want to do something I don't want to do because you have the privilege of like knowing that you know I don't know like that the path is going to lead you in the right direction there isn't that kind of like push and pull of things anymore I guess you also get to appreciate success the right way too because you're not looking to double up on it or triple up on it or
what's that going to afford me next time and I don't want to let it go it's like no you can just have that moment appreciate it for what it is yeah so hard to do that though sometimes right and I think that's it's such a key though to creating like your most authentic work it's so so so important to keep in mind because as soon as you start chasing once you get into that
energy of chasing it's like that's when it all starts to go a ey it's so true man like someone very close my wife said to me when I was kind of in getting frustrated with that just was completely out of my control she's like it's so much better when you just drive your drive like why are you veering all over everyone else's Lane trying to figure out what where the other
opportunities are like you've got your lane like stay true to yourself it works for you I'm like all right that's the best advice I got I think yeah the album is cool Quantum baby why well because I think I wanted to kind of get down to like a core level of you know who I am and and I find that there's a lot of paradoxes there and so I was kind of inspired by like the quantum Paradox and
and the fact that you know once you look at everything at like the closest level that we possibly can there's so many things that like don't make sense or things that contradict themselves and I feel like that's I I don't know I just kind of relate to that concept as like a human being like there's so many ways that even with this project you know there's a lot of
songs that feel kind of strong and they feel like in your face and they feel like confident but then there's also on the flip side those songs that feel so vulnerable and kind of having that justos between those two things that like make me human I think that's just a really interesting place to you know focus on so where's your curiosity right now because because I'm you're very
curious person I can tell I I imagine that you're looking for rationale even if it's it only justifies that the whole thing's irrational yeah abolutely so whatever the result is almost irrelevant right you seek the knowledge so so where has that led you where do you stand now what are you trying to discover about this experience now yeah I guess I'm I'm I I don't have a clear understanding of
like where I'm going to go with the third part of this project that's for sure I think um I kind of started this whole project with an intention of like okay I'm going to make first one sound like this the second one sound like this the third one sound like this and it's changed it's evolved and that was also very exciting for me to think about being able to kind of
create projects in real time and evolve them in real time but now that I've I made the first two I really feel like I have like another question mark of like where I'm going to take the third because I'm I'm like more inspired to like go even further you know like I don't who knows I don't know I don't know so cool and I mean guys but like further it's so it's so hard for me not
to just like start to ideate with you because because this album has such the so much wide open space when you finish it of where you can take it yeah and that's the thing as a fan of your music that I feel so grateful for is that I just don't feel like you're trying to Riggle out of anything anymore you know what I mean when we first met you were like oh no it's cool I'll wear it and
then it was like the next time I metet you were like I don't know if I like it but I can't get it entirely off me and now I feel like you're just like man I can kind of go anywhere with this yeah I'm just sitting in it it's fun I'm having fun too like I think that that's another thing is never like put too much on on any project like yeah this could
be like my magnum opus but like so could the next one like it's so fun to just kind of be like okay this is the stepping stone that's going to take me to the I don't know maybe I'm just obsessed with like creating more work but I love like what I love the idea of like oh no for sure I have a clean slate now the world's my oyster you won't even know when that project and what it means
to you shows up in that moment in time and to us fans it could be Quantum baby radio whatever I have I'm going to feel about any of their records or his records or any of the Bands he's in half the time until like a year after it comes out yeah isn't that fun it's so good that's so fun and it's just like and I go back I'm like oh my God why did I sleep on this this is like the
best one yeah and I might just do something like totally different next time like I might just flip the script because I love those I love the records that people are like hm I feel like even I don't know like one of my like fan favorite records like night ride that's like definitely something that maybe like on paper would have been like H I don't know if this really makes sense
but it's like I look back on that record I'm like yeah that one was so good no I love that record I love that record because it was born it was like it was like there there was this kind of like really Justified frustration that bore this really strong Creative Energy totally so so it's like it's almost Punk and it's like and that's what I love about that and and it also it really
that album is very important I think for fans and for you is because it showed that you were just like hey like it was when you kicked everything over it's kind of a tantrum that record in way absolutely no totally and that's yeah why it didn't get promoted but that's why I love that project you know I think I just want to have that energy even if I'm not in the same kind of creative
place even if now I'm inspired just to be able to have that fearlessness is something that's like really exciting moving forward what else do you do that that that outside of making music that keeps you creatively or spiritually connected like um what you know what other things do you do with your time like go outside like be in nature I think that's something that's so
important be with my family I think that's so important to ground me you have a strong family relation strong strong strong family unit like I'm seeing them talking to them constantly all the time I think that that's just having your chosen or a family something that feels reliable stable in the whole world which is really you know I've got to I've got to I've got to pay respect
to you and your family for that because you know youve shown interest in this at a young age and your family rightfully supported your passion and your dream that doesn't always end well absolutely you know a lot of times people come out of that experience and there's there's some kind of resentment that kicks in you know because you don't know what you
want at that age and then you're like why did you encourage me it's like cuz you wanted to do it you know this book has been written aund thousand 100 times um so what's been the most important elements that that you think makes your family so strong what are the things that that you that you and your mom and your dad and you and your family really ultimately what are the what are the
polls what are the T poles you revolve around um I think it's just it's that it's that safe space where like no matter what you don't ever have to like mold yourself or change yourself and there's not many relationships that you can be so raw and so real with like even when it comes to like dating and romance I feel like a lot of times especially in the early stages there's so much like
trepidation to like get to that point and and new friendships new relationships business relationships you know you're always kind of keeping you know your distance a little bit from who you really are at a core level or you're always kind of micromanaging yourself in front of other people just you know maybe even subconsciously and I think that that's you never have to do that um
with my family like we're just so I just feel so much myself I love that and I never feel like I'm judged for anything I do or like I have to mold myself into any particular direction and so that's so special I feel like I always for when I was younger I used to realize that too late like I I would be really trusting and then it would be like oh man yeah oh
man like you know now I've got like now I've had that experience how's it going to affect the way I move forward with it and and now I just like I have this whole different I loved your take on this like I have this whole different feeling about it like trust don't trust it's kind of relevant to me yeah I just want to be present and give you my best and if you're not ready to give me your
best or you think there's something you can take from me that's going to help you in a way that doesn't help me it's kind of on you like I'll just move on I'm cool that's always the goal is to just be your you know your most most authentic self I think that that's always my goal at least I think well you've had to probably figur that out and we've talked about this before but
in I want to know how how your sort of um judgment has been refined and sharpened in the Years where you've been able to take control of your own destiny it remains one of music's most inspiring stories in fact more so than when we started to celebrate it and I feel we were all just kind of go go go you know when you did it and now it's like oh I've gone like it's a thing and I'm a
real business I'm a businesswoman I'm an artist I run my so let's talk about what you've learned from that experience if you wouldn't mind and then just kind of help us better understand how you've sharpened and refined that those tools yeah I think um betting on yourself trusting in yourself taking those risks is so empowering and I think that it's really important it it also was kind of
very cyclical to how I kind of started my music career because I started creating my own music in my bedroom and like taking it upon myself to learn how to produce and learn how to record vocal record myself and do all the things my myself and I think that now I have the benefit of you know not having to do everything myself but having the confidence to know that if I need to I
have the skills I have the ability it's not relying on anyone else to be able to kind of create your art it's knowing that it's having an inner knowing and inner trust in yourself that like your ideas are the best ideas or like your your stuff is the stuff so how do you delegate then if you don't have to rely on anybody else how challenging or not how how do you define the idea of
delegating responsibility when you ultimately have done that before and it's failed for you it's I mean it's it's just again like instinct like you know when you meet someone and you just kind of get to know them and you know that like the people in your corner are really in your corner for the right reasons and obviously like there's a process that you go through
when you're getting to know someone where you kind of like vet them out and it hasn't been easy but I think that all the people that are on my team are people that I really trust that do have my best interest in mind you just like always constantly have to to know I think that's also with keeping your circle small being really purposeful about you know what you delegate to who
and um and just knowing that yeah you got to you got to know who to trust you got know who to trust and you got to keep it small I think I think keeping it small is a good place to start you can go as big as you want but you should be TR but you should intend to keep it small yeah because you have to have that small energy I think so when it comes to making decisions I think so every artist
I've known that is that is really continuing to achieve at the highest level and the success continues to ACR move real Nimble they don't move on a mass they move small yeah and I you know I love I love to see it to me it's it's kind of common and it's working I mean you just got a number one on us rhythmic radio so I mean congratulations for that yeah and the charts matter they do
because it's a it's a window into what's moving the needle and how people feel about the music the trends will come and go but the charts are like no no no this is broken through it's exciting what what does it mean to you though when you get a result like that now it's very affirming for me just cuz you know obviously I've been in this journey for like 10 years and just achieving those
accolades isn't something that I've put the pressure on myself to achieve that hasn't been a focus of mine so it feels so like just kind of like a bonus like a win like something genuinely that you know I don't need but now that I've achieved it this is amazing I think um it feels like I'm in the right place at the right time that I'm doing the right
things that were I'm where I'm meant to be you know that all the decisions I've made have led me up to this point do you appreciate your the impact that you're having on the Arts and and can you recognize it to you know what I think I just really enjoy being a part of the conversation I think that that's um what all artists should aspire to do I think it's our responsibility is to you know
add our input and to also receive input from those around us and just be part of that banter and part of that creative conversation I definitely think that you know I have an impact on the conversation of what music is and where it's going and I also you know love just kind of like I said just receiving it also from like my peers and everyone around me I'd like to give you a few
more flowers than that if I may you know I liked what the cut said I I thought that was a cool article and I thought it represented you know very flattering it was flattering and and it made some really Sage observations in terms of the way that that music has shifted since you came out 10 years ago you know and not just you I mean I really want to take the time and I don't know I'm sure
your relationship's F but I mean I I think kaani changed things as well she came out for sure I think there was a handful of you that sort of came out not even that many totally who were kind of like making modern really interesting I wouldn't even know how to genri it really in a way and and it was R&B but it was pop it was hipop and it was kind of like alternative and there was all
kinds of things floating throughout it and I think all of you have really paved the way for this for a generation I love like seeing how like my peers win like That's so exciting seeing people that have been in the game for a long time like do really cool things and and yeah it just feels you know it feels like you're you're you're just participating and you're you're in it and that's so
fun is it hard to do when you're independent does is it harder to feel like you're part of something when you're out there doing your own thing with your own team like yes on like a surface level on like an Optics level but like no on a core level because I know that I'm like on the mood Boards of like all of like the you know the people that any you know any that's what I
wanted to hear and then by the way I was like I know I know I I'm I'm sure I just had to co it out of you because it's so true yeah like there just wasn't the energy in the way certain artists are moving now singing performing and being unashamedly themselves with with no filter at least no filter that they don't want to put up without you yeah but that's the goal
like you you want to you know change you want to be on the mood boards that's always my goal I'm like whether it be the Sonic mood boards or the visual mood boards like we're always like okay how can we Inspire everyone else and like that's a great bar to have what do you what do you watch do I watch yeah what do you watch like what's your what's your series I don't really watch TV
shows you don't watch TV no like I find the commitment of like series like very overwhelming you have so much to enjoy later in life though totally I'm telling you I'm kind of jealous what's your favorite series well I mean I I'll watch I used to be I used to have a terrible time with anything that was that revolved around anything kind of anxiety which cut me out of about 95% of long
form television it's all just like someone dies or this person goes missing or this thing happens and my wife was like babes you just can't keep watching like Anchor Man Forever you really got to give into this so I started and I got over that home and I mean I'm I mean I'm up to date I'm jealous of you I'm up to date you know what succession all that ozar I mean ozar
is like watching four or five series of people stuck in between drywall that is literally how stressful it is like it is just one show after another of the Ws getting closer and closer on this family you know what I watch I watch a lot of YouTube like h like a podcast about like quantum physics like nerdy things holy relax okay just can you relax I like like learning yeah cool we get it
you're smart okay we understand it all right you're that kid in school yeah I'm dead I'm serious seriously you're dead I'm cooked I just told you I watch anch man you're like I watch YouTube about quantum physics so where are we headed quantum physics where are we going gosh there's just so many in nobody knows that's the thing they haven't solved the riddle yet
hav solved it they haven't solved the riddle that's why so interesting cuz you could see people debate it all day but there's no like there's no answer doesn't it make you feel and it should and it makes me feel completely insignificant yeah I mean it's amazing I think that's that's exciting about it because then you don't get stressed so much about like politics and the world
and like all those things yeah but I still get stressed out about I mean that's definitely stressful that's definitely stressful right I mean come November where are you going to be I'm going to be way over there you going to be way over there holy I mean it's something that definitely affects our Liv so don't get me wrong but I'm saying just like in theory of feeling like you
know we're just kind of like a particle like we're just like a tiny little we're just a spec so what are we supposed to do with that time gosh who knows have fun create things create create things make things yeah there's something about there's something about art that the more I try to understand it the more I love that I have zero idea where it comes from or what motivates it which is
why the whole nature of the kind of thing I do which is s try to sort of have really lovely conversations with the artistic Spirit has become way less about the mechanics of it and the process of it the timelines or that like I don't even have questions maybe you can tell maybe you're going to walk out and be like that was the worst inter but like but that's what it's about it's
a it's about it's a feeling level it's not so analytical and I think that that's why so many interviews actually to me as the in person getting interviewed feel like they fall flat because it feels like there isn't like a real understanding of like how creation works like people are like how did you make the song and you're like well I just thought of it like I just felt it
like it just like there's something to be said for like getting these mysterious downloads from the universe like it just comes out of you and that's how I want to treat it I want to get a mysterious download from your universe and I listen to it and if I feel it we'll be fine exactly I feel like so many people are afraid there's so many talented people in this world that are
afraid to like release their art because they're you know whatever but I think that just being able to be free to not judge yourself for whatever you make is just so important but you're over thinker I don't think I'm of the might want to say I'm surely an overthinker don't get me wrong so how do you okay well that's really interesting because clearly as an overthinker you found a
way to get inside your own wiring and be like not there not there not there how I don't know because I think it's just because I I I think because I've recognized that my best stuff is when I'm not overthinking like it just it it that's what the music I like the best self- awareness yeah the the songs that I create that I like the best are the ones that I didn't you know an
overanalyze they were just simple it just happened it just happened and I'm like aware that when I made those songs I was not in that judgmental place in my mind I was free I'm so happy to hear it that's the key word there this this album sounds free free you know when I hear getting no sleep and I hear the way that you just man you dominate that verse and it's just even the structure
of that song interesting yeah it's like it's like the it's so melodic without even trying to be melodic like it's just you just Spin and spin and spin it but I'm like with you every step of the way you know right down to like when I get you Alan which is another amazing example and production wise as well just beautiful the whole thing is so tasteful
so let's talk a little bit about match my freak World Tour yeah that's so way by the way and and that's one of the best tour names ever do you know how hard it is to put things in front of World Tour like honestly if you took a list of every single World Tour ever created I reckon 95% of them are trash just cuz the term World Tour doesn't work well off any right but match my I'm
going all around the world match my freak world to all around the world yeah it's going to be incredible so exciting I love touring so let's talk about pre where you at with it oh gosh in the creative still you know it's like as much as you like plan in advance and you know something's coming it's really really it always comes down to the Wi so you know we're still kind of coming up
with different whether it be stage designs um I literally was in the airport yesterday coming flying back from China we had a 6-hour layover that was fun um wow what do you do for 6 hour airport work on my set list I was sitting there yeah I was sitting there for a it passed the time very quickly cuz you know you're listening to how the songs are transitioning into one another
there's again this is so hyper curated that people don't really I love that's the fun part right how am I going to start where's it going to go going to go what's the story we're telling what's it going to look like like when you when you make a tour there's so many questions that need to be answered and you haven't even got to the point where you're probably thinking about
choreography cuz you're trying to figure out what you're going to be dancing to and that's a whole other world Step One is get the music together I got it I got to say like from my perspective um you know as an artist you uh you know how we feel but but the choreography and your ability to be able to in to be Innovative in that space is it should consistently be recognized and I know
that when you're going to go out on the road you're going to step up and do that again you and your crew well I love innovating in that space as well that's something that again I don't think people talk about enough is like how are we going to make the show feel new and fresh and every year having the opportunity or the privilege of being able to give a new experience to the
fans and also a new experience to myself that's also so important just with you know to combat burnout you want a new show you want new choreography you want new moves yeah but you burn out to do that right I mean it's athletic I mean this is it's like going on tour is like preparing for the Olympics I mean it's going to be crazy you can't go on there and not level up and you've leveled up
every single time every time that's the goal for sure but what's cool about this album is I can imagine it's Conjuring up a different kind of inspiration for you in terms of movement because you a lot of songs that require like a lot of movement and you always step up and give those songs what they ask for but this one is an ethereal nature to this yeah well I think I've also been working with
like for example I've been working a lot with choreographer out of Amsterdam his name is Shay and he's really amazing and his stuff is very um like Storyteller driven very narrative based very um almost theatrical and I think that I've been looking for those theatrical elements you know to kind of pair with the way that the music is evolving because I think it's helping to build
again like build Universe outside of just it feeling like Steps but also like what's the story we're telling what's the narrative building pictures yeah in between the steps the transitions how these all tie in together um the feeling of it um the the literal shape of the movement I think that's something that's so important to how I experience music yeah so like why
not put that same effort into how someone else is going to like visually experience the music you know what I mean yeah I do I can't wait to experience it where you going to gift us this this this show in la O it's going to be at the Greek oh my God that's so exciting that's incredible yeah that's so I'm so excited it's definitely like a bucketless venue for me so it's going to
be amazing oh you'll be yeah the Greek's epic man that's such a beautiful 7,000 SE just perfect but dude like you're already at the bowl you just have't caught up yeah thanks you're already there I I see it going one way I always enjoy talking with you I I want to say thank you for for um honoring our request and coming in and having a conversation absolutely thank you so
much for having me um it's always a pleasure it's a story that just keeps getting better it's people ask me oh man you still get a kick out of doing this stuff I'm like yeah of course I love to talk about music and connect with the people who make it but what I really love to do is see the stories get better so just long may that continue absolutely good to see thank you so much [Music] m