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First of all, hi Olivia Dean.
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Everybody, Olivia Dean's here.
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>> Trying to get better at formal introductions. I'm super at them.
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>> No, we doesn't need to be formal.
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>> Doesn't need to be formal. I feel like I know you.
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>> Yeah, >> I feel like I know you through your music.
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I feel like I know you through mutuals.
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And now I do know you, which is beautiful. >> Yes, I'm here. I can't believe it. >> Okay, cool. We've done that.
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Now, let's get back to the song.
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So that song right is um first of all you know it's going to be real by the song title because the kind of thing that people say at some of the darkest moments in their life or when someone else is in one of the darkest moments of their life and you're trying to give them support.
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So you're qualifying that they should feel upset about something.
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>> So that title is just everything.
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And then it's like all right you are you going to write the song that owns that sentence?
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I've never seen in a song title before >> and you did.
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I really enjoy um song titles that haven't been done before. >> That's a real one.
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>> It's so fun for me when I write a song and then I'll check and I'll be like, >> "That's new."
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And also the way you sing it, like it rolls off the tongue so good in song, let alone the one you love.
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It's like they literally tumble over each other into a beautiful mess at the end. It's wonderful.
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>> It's interesting you say that because when the song was written, it was in 44 and the rhythm of that line was different. >> Yeah. How does that go?
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Let alone the one you love.
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Yeah, it was a lot more boxy and um I just was like I mean thinking of D'Angelo today and Untitled and the feeling of that and I was just like it needs to be in 68 and then that line just clicked and came so good.
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>> Congratulations on everything. >> Thank you. >> Hard earned too. >> It's been a minute. Yeah.
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I feel like >> but not even just time just life like to get from messy to this. >> A lot of living. Yes. You can hear it. I feel >> Yeah, you can. Yeah, you can. You can.
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And every record should reflect that time in your life, as should interviews.
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Let's talk about all the bad stuff. No, I'm joking. Uh, >> no, please.
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>> No, let's talk a little bit about like um where this album began for you and and when you realized that you were ready to take that life lived to turn it into music, >> you know, I Messi was amazing.
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I was able to go to a lot of places in the world and get all this experience and really get to know myself better.
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And then last year was just very intense.
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a lot of heartbreak, a lot of intense kind of romantic feelings >> to put it lightly.
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And um I went to an exhibition here in LA that was called All About Love in response to Bel Hooks is all about love.
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>> And I was looking at one of the paintings and in the description it said, you know, something about the art of loving.
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And it was like that's what I need to do.
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I need to explore my understanding of love to close this chapter of my life.
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And I want to talk about love and not talk about it as just this fantasy thing and talk about it as like a skill and a craft and understand my understanding of that skill and help people to think about theirs more. It felt like a calling.
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It was like, okay, I'm doing a case study right now. >> Yeah. And you know what?
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But you turned it into something that retains all the feeling as well.
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Earl Swiss said something interesting to me the other week.
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He said, "Feelings are fleeting."
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And and so what you've taken is the fleeting feeling of something and given it an actual context and and given it a foundation to to try to understand and try to kind of use in your life.
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I feel by listening to this record >> feels like a toolkit to me. >> Yeah, for sure.
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>> This album >> for sure >> and hopefully something that people can return to.
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Like I was thinking about that a lot in the studio like The Way I Return to Mahogany Soul Andy Stone or The Way I Return to Miseducation.
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No way comparing the standard of those to this, but I mean like >> those kind of albums that are like just food, like a good just like you need them, you know? >> It's in the family.
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I can say that now as as someone who listens to those records and those kind of artists that really to your point, they become a part of your uh the steps of life.
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They move with you, right? They travel with you.
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And this is definitely a traveler, right?
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It's a sticker on the flight case of life.
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And uh you know, you've definitely made one of those.
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And um I can tell you're really proud of it, too, which I love.
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Sometimes artists come in here and they're not quite sure how to respond to the response, >> but I feel like you're really open and embracing it.
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>> I'm really proud of it.
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I worked really hard on it and it's so honest and real and honestly quite fresh.
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Like half of this album was written in March, April of this year. >> So, it's new to you. >> So new.
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And like I'm singing these songs like starting to sing them live now.
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And it's like the first time I've sung it since I recorded it in the studio and it's like, wo, it's still giving me goosebumps.
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Like I listen to the album on the plane on the way here and I cried. >> I love that.
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I just, you know, it's so funny.
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So much of my life has been spent talking to artists and a common question I would ask them is, "Do you listen to your own music?"
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You already know the answer.
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>> Eight or nine times out of 10, the artist will tell me that they don't. They don't. And they don't, right?
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They're like, "No, I don't. I don't."
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Whether they're telling the truth or not.
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>> It always left me with a little bit of sadness cuz I'm like, "I guess that's the trade.
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I guess you get the creation and we get the creating and we get the creation.
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>> I think with this album for me specifically, I still need it.
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Like I need >> those feelings still.
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It feels very like I'm still living in the world of it all.
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And I'm able to like not listen to like the mix, you know, and actually listen to the feeling cuz there's so much in it.
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It feels so >> I mean the mix is flawless.
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The mix is >> Charlie Holmes amazing mixer. Yeah.
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>> The drums just in the pocket, huh?
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nestled guiding everything without trying to steal anyone's attention.
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>> I think everything's where it needs to be and we worked really hard on that.
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I don't think it's shouting any of it.
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I feel it's such an intimate listen and yeah, I love it. I love this album.
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>> You've just, you know, you've created something that knows itself so well.
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Like >> for you to finish the song like this >> and not like, you know, I can just knock this out of the park with one more chorus, you know?
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You just were like, "No, I've said everything I need to say.
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Let me just let me just >> let me enjoy it." >> Yeah. I love the bars. >> Love the bars.
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>> I actually wrote like a whole other bridge.
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>> And it was like all these examples like more kind of specific life examples of how and I was just like, "Nah, let's just bar guys."
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>> You got a little list in there. Where is it?
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Water, sunlight, >> talking all night stuff to grow it. Yeah. >> Yeah. And that's just enough. That's what you need.
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It's a little shopping list there. I know what I'm cooking.
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It's also like we could be nice to each other, but you know, just a suggestion.
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>> I love the line, I don't want a boyfriend.
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You're such a liar in that song. It's so cheeky. >> Well, maybe not. Maybe you are.
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But I love the fact that it's just so knowing.
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It's just like it feels a little bit if when I'm listening to it, like uh I'm serious, but I'm also a bit defensive and not quite sure.
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And I don't know, it just feels unknowing. >> Of course.
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I think that's kind of like my whole energy and I guess approach to love.
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Sometimes it's like intensely romantic, but also no worries if not. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
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Well, there's an interesting lyric on the album which is like I'm afraid to change, right?
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I'm afraid of changing of changing myself, of being changed and this idea.
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And so, let's talk a little bit about um you know where your sense of self-awareness when it comes to writing those kind of lines and and what you learn about yourself when you acknowledge something like that that you probably wouldn't acknowledge in everyday conversation.
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You're not going to sit down, have a coffee with your friend, and just outright say, "I'm just afraid of being changed." >> Yeah.
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I'm too scared to belong to anyone. >> Right. Right.
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That's a big thing to say.
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Um, you know, I think that my understanding of love, especially in the process of making this, has changed so much.
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And I think that you can be really deeply in love with someone and have a really healthy relationship, but remain your own person.
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>> Me personally, I need that.
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Like my life is so full and I have so many things I want to do and so many places in my life I want to pour love into and I don't feel like it needs to be everything.
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Love is everything, but I think it needs to be spread throughout your life rather than in one place.
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>> Friendship and companionship, where would you like it to to be most present for you so it's not distracting or taking away from the other things that you're focused on in life?
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How do you want it to work for you?
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>> Well, I think that Bel Hooks put it beautifully where it's like, I suppose love is just wanting to nurture somebody else's growth and let them shine.
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And so, you're just shining on your paths and the paths are going the same way, but we're on our own paths.
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We're watering our own gardens, you know, >> and we're visiting each others and we're spending time, but we're in our own gardens, you know.
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>> There's lots of kind of love, you know, and I think as an artist, you experience another intense kind of love, which is the sort of adoration from those who don't know but know you.
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>> You haven't met everybody in your crowd yet, but we feel like we know you pretty well.
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Uh, it's probably not something to analyze, but does it give you a feeling?
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>> Sometimes it can be quite strange.
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You know, I think that the nature of the music I make, I really imagine the listener listening on headphones.
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I really am trying to create an intimate experience.
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So, I think that does lend to like that feeling of like a friendship or feeling like someone knows you and like when I have when we do shows, it's like, wow, we're all kind of friends, but we've never met.
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And you must be reminded that you led everybody into this beautiful vicarious experience and now there's 20,000 people who know exactly what you were thinking on that day. >> Yeah, it's powerful. >> Crazy. >> It's powerful.
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Sometimes I'm like, why am I drawn to that feeling, you know, of being intensely vulnerable with people, but it's like it's the best thing in the world.
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Makes me feel like a human. >> Okay. All right. All right. >> All right. All right. All right.
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You know, >> truth truth truth bombs. >> Truth bombs. >> Truth bombs.
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Um, we only drop them for the truth.
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How did you translate that as a kid?
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That that that gravity toward that that gravitational pull to vulnerability when probably a lot of your peers or friends or even the adults in your life were just trying to keep you safe and tell you to be a kid, but you're an empath, right? >> Yeah. Intensely.
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So, sometimes too empathetic can get you into trouble.
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>> Um, >> boundaries, baby. >> Yeah. >> Need them. Yeah. Need them.
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Um, you know, I think I first sort of like fell in love with like storytelling through song through musical theater, which a lot of people have a chip on their shoulder about, and like that's fine.
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But >> which side though, the musical theater side or the people who don't want to hear you con like acknowledge musical theater?
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>> I think a bit of both.
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I think people love to say that it's cringe.
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And it's like, okay, but maybe release yourself from the idea of cringe and free yourself from that and then like enjoy just like the feeling.
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>> Plus, what 5-year-old thinks linear?
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what 5-year-old's going, I only want to focus on the songwriting craft.
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You're thinking, I want to dance, sing, perform. I want to do it all.
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>> Like the first time I saw Westside Story, I was just like, oh my god, wo and um >> sensory overload. >> Sensory overload. I love the drama.
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And I feel like sometimes in music at the moment, we were just saying like people can be so nonchalant and I love intense emotion.
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>> It's cool to show that you care.
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I mean, at least I think so. >> I love it as well.
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I know my friends don't always love it.
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>> Sometimes they're like, >> "Slow down." >> No, I can't.
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>> You need to know how I feel.
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>> Whether that be good or bad, like some moments on this album are like, >> "Wow, did I need to share that?"
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And it's like, "Yeah, >> I did."
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>> Finding people you can do that around is really important.
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Finding people you can sit in a room with and share these things so that they become real enough to put into the creative process is not often not talked about enough. >> It isn't.
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And you know I work with some amazing songwriters and people that I've been working with for a really long time. >> They know you. >> Yeah.
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Like songs like loud could not pos have possibly been written on the first day of a session in a studio.
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That is a song that's built on >> 9 10 years of being in the studio with Maxim and Bastion and a comfortability and a vulnerability that is is priceless.
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>> Really vulnerable arrangement as well for a powerful message.
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>> What were you feeling the day you wrote that >> complete devastation and heartbreak?
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Um, and I wasn't even going to go to the studio cuz sometimes it's like if you're in if you're in a certain headsp space, it's like, is it kind of torturous for me to go and talk about this all day and write a song or is it going to be healing? Can go one of two ways.
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And that song kind of just fell out in a day.
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And um, then we yeah chose the Spanish guitar.
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This guy Ollie Clark played beautifully on it.
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And >> originally I was like, maybe we'll change that.
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Like this is like a ballad and so it should be piano.
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And I was like, no, the Spanish guitar's cool. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
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Because the thing about the piano, right, and this is just me being super nerdy, it requires intention.
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Like, I'm going to go sit behind the piano, which means I'm going to play these notes, which means I'm going to go digging.
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But sometimes you just pick up a Spanish guitar and you just cause.
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>> So, what I love about the arrangement of this song as a listener and a fan of the album is it feels like I just drop into it.
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>> Whereas a ballad is like, "And we begin with the heartbreak." >> Yes.
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And this is kind of more Yeah.
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like a nuanced heartbreak.
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And gosh, I'm so proud of that song.
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I love the string arrangement on it.
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the vocals, one take front to back. >> Wow. Wow.
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How did you get through that?
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>> So, the story goes is that I wrote it on that day with Max and Bastian.
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I sung it once and then I never sung it again.
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And then towards the end of the process, we came to record all the strings and it was the day of the strings.
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I went to the studio and it been my dream to have, you know, people arrange strings to songs that I've written. >> Oh my god. >> Of course.
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Seriously, bring the tissues by the way cuz I'm was talking about this the other day.
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You're never going to get through that without the emotions. Oh, such a privilege.
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And I sat in the room with the orchestra just in the corner of the room crying while they recorded it.
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And we had 5 minutes at the end of the day and I just said, "Guys, just for the shits and gigs, can I sing it once through with you just for my own enjoyment?"
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>> You have a take with the strings? >> Yeah. Yeah, that's the take.
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>> That's the take you did. >> Yeah.
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And so we had 5 minutes left of their time cuz the string people >> were just doing that for you and you kept the original, but you did that.
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That was the take >> front to back the whole take.
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And I was just like that was it.
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And that was the second time I'd ever sung it.
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You know, >> it's a good day at the office, huh? >> I was like, "Wow."
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>> How was the feeling different when you sang it the second time versus the first time?
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When you wrote it on the day of heartbreak and that Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry.
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Let me I'm trying to order my questions in some kind of like semblance of how it makes sense on my brain. Okay.
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Cuz this is really important to me.
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>> How did it feel to sing it on the first day?
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>> On the first day, I was a little bit ill.
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So, there was a real tiredness in the voice.
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say there was an exhaustion in the vocal >> that I felt couldn't be recreated.
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So I was happy to keep that as the demo.
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>> How did it feel the second time you recorded it?
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>> By that time a couple months had passed and I had able I was able to heal from the situation a bit more and I sung it with a bit more conviction. >> Interesting.
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So >> I owned the sadness a bit more.
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That's such a good way to describe it because on paper you would think that that sad and desperate experience the first time around was the most honest reflection, but you're saying actually with time you discovered a new honesty in the in the song.
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Is that what you're saying? >> Yeah.
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I think there's a difference in saying in a real sad and tired voice like you weren't allowed to come around and throw my heart about and then saying you were not allowed to come around and throw my heart about. You were not allowed.
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You know, >> Olivia, it doesn't get better than that. Oh, >> it just doesn't.
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I mean, as far as songwriting goes and and just you really listen to what the song was asking you to do. >> Yeah. I love the way it moves.
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I love the melody from the pre into the chorus.
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Like, it's like >> I love how you go back to no reverb anywhere at the end. >> Dry.
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>> Just me and the piano playing this piano.
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>> The one I let you play.
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>> The one I let you play. Right.
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It's literally like all of the support you've had through the whole song from the strings to the mixing to the sound and the EQ and everyone is like supporting you through this performance and then it's just you >> at the end of the day. Yeah.
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Eddie, we got a real one.
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Olivia Dean's a real one. This is serious. Oh my god.
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The albums you're going to make. >> I'm excited. Yeah.
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I love I love making music.
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It's just it's the best thing in the world.
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I can't wait to think about all the albums I'm going to make in my life.
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>> The most fun time ever going through some of the hard times and the best times ever. >> Mhm.
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>> And turning it into a document.
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Like this album feels like such a time capsule.
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Like I can't wait to listen to it in like 10 years and be like, "Damn, sis."
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>> You were complaining then. >> Yeah.
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Like wow, you were in your feels, huh?
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>> Oh, you're in your feels, man. That's so funny. >> I can't wait. Can't wait. >> For sure. I love the artwork, too.
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I know people are obsessed with the artwork, but it it I mean it doesn't look there's no and I'm not I'm not disrespecting anyone who worked on this you or anybody else who came up with this idea.
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It's actually the highest compliment I can give it is it doesn't feel like there's any art there's any art direction to it at all.
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It feels completely just caught. >> Yeah.
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I mean there was >> I know that's what I'm saying.
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I want to preface this by saying obviously that takes time but you captured something very very present.
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>> I think it feels so at peace this photo.
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I think it feels like a sister photo to the Messi cover. >> I love the blur.
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I love just it feels in motion and reflective and yeah, I think as soon as I saw it, I was like, that's it. There was no question. I delivered it.
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I was like, that's the album cover.
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>> So, you're a first rate empath right here turned artist, which is Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Oh my god.
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>> What's your star sign? >> I'm a Leo. >> Okay. Yeah. >> Yeah.
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It's all about you unless it's all about me, which it is.
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>> But I want it to be about you, too.
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I'm super generous with my time. >> Yes, absolutely.
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>> But I want you to acknowledge that I'm being super generous with my time. >> Absolutely. >> Okay. Is that cool? Is that cool?
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Just acknowledge that I'm acknowledging.
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>> So interesting as you kind of get older and realize that those things are super true.
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It's all magic and math and it's all it's all completely out of our concept, out of our concept of of realization or what's true that we we can't control any of it. No, we can't. I own the Pisces thing.
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I think I feel that deeply emotional, very empathetic, and yeah, quite aloof, maybe. >> Oh, yeah. There you go. Right.
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Like I'm cool being I'm down.
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We can be friends or whatever, but a little bit on my terms. Let me figure it out. Give me some space. >> Yes. Very independent.
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>> Sometimes too independent. I don't know.
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>> So, where does the spirit of collaboration fit into that experience?
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Because obviously you're a good collaborator.
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You could have made a record with people and give them the space to be themselves in your in your room.
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So is that a practice for you to sort of let go of the independence sometimes and allow people to sort of lovingly take part in your life?
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>> Yeah, I love I have a real appreciation for songwriting and I love writing songs with people.
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Um I need to be across all of it obviously >> and it needs to be my stories and you know all of that.
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But like I love the process of making a song with someone and finding that common ground and sitting at the piano and you know deliberating over a verse for an afternoon.
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Like that's just such a lovely thing to do and find the right words in the pocket and go craziest job ever. Best job ever. >> And I'm very lucky.
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I work with amazing people and as I said, yeah, it's friendship that's been built over a long time.
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Like I started, you know, I put my first song on when I was like 17, 18 and I'm still working with those people.
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And my band that I play with now, like I met at Brit when I was 17.
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Like we've been playing together for 10 years.
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Like me and Dan used to busk on the South Bank.
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>> Do you talk about that?
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Do you laugh about those times?
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>> We do laugh about those times.
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And sometimes they pull up videos and I'm like, please.
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>> What's the maddest thing that happened to you while you were busking?
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I mean, you just you've got frontline to the layway people.
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>> Listen, busking builds your character, man. >> Sure.
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>> Builds your character.
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But I just remember feeling like, oh my god, you can make money on the side of the street like singing covers. And I would just Yeah.
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Yeah. like open up the case and just I remember like one day we made like £30 and then we went to call my burger kitchen and I was like this is the life man dinner is paid for >> amazing >> yeah so it's been such a journey and
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it's like to go from that to think about now we're going to do 60 O2s it's hilarious >> last time I checked it was four how many now >> it's going to be six yeah it's too many >> we only reserved a polite round of applause for a real real moment. >> Yeah. Cuz it's like there's an element >> Yeah.
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Cuz it's like there's an element of shock to that.
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Not because you don't deserve to, but because who sells out six in 2025 like that?
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Like how long since the album came out? >> Minutes. >> Two weeks. Three weeks. >> Crazy. >> Six. >> Yeah. >> With a day off.
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>> Yeah, they're a little spread out.
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Two of them are a bit later.
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>> That's called a residency.
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>> That's not called six.
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That's called a residency. >> Congratulations. I can't wait to do it.
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I feel so ready to elaborate on our show in that setting and to be able to have like the budget and the means to just still create a very intimate experience.
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I'm not going to be flying in the sky.
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There's not going to be pyro >> yet. >> Watch this space.
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But to try and create an intimate experience in that size of a venue, I I'm excited about that challenge.
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>> Yeah, but the songs are the key.
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It's they were already there.
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Here's the re in my opinion and I say this as a fan who's going to do everything I can to come to an O2 show. >> Oh, you must. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, check this out.
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I I'm coming in there and I'm already in an intimate experience >> because because I'm I'm I'm coming to hear these songs.
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So, I'm already in my own space, >> you know?
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I'm not coming for the for the light show.
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>> You're not coming to see me. >> No, no, no.
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And so, all that's left for you to do, right, is just >> sing pure taste as well.
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Just the most tasteful experience. >> It will be.
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We're going to work really hard on it. >> Amazing.
21:26
Um, you're a professional musician making money on the street, 30 off to Gourmet Burger Kitchen. It's a good day.
21:32
Uh, but it had to start somewhere.
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What was the moment when you turned around to your folks or whatever?
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And how supportive was your family environment for you in terms of wanting to pursue this?
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Because it is literally one of the big risks as a young person you can take uh is to step out of the infrastructure and back yourself.
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>> My parents have always been extremely supportive.
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I think they recognized a true passion and like love for music in me from quite a young age and only encouraged it.
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>> What would your mom or your dad say was the moment they realized what were you listening to, singing to?
22:02
What what did you move to respond to as a kid where they were like, "Okay, it's in her."
22:06
>> I remember being like 8 years old and just being sat in front of the TV and Pocahontas would play and then I'd say again again again again.
22:12
And I just the music was just so beautiful to me and I would said to my mom, I want to be a singer.
22:22
>> And she was like, >> "Let's have some singing lessons then."
22:25
So she sent me down on a Saturday school to Woodford County Girls School and they would do Saturday classes and I would just and I just learn and be around other people that wanted to learn to sing.
22:35
And the first time I ever sung in front of an audience, I was so scared I had to have my back to the audience and I was crying and I sang Tomorrow from Annie >> and I came second place. Thank you very much.
22:51
>> Imagine what would have happened if I'd turned around. >> Yeah.
22:53
Listen, >> you know the charismatron is here. I'm ready for you.
22:56
>> The back of the head was enough. Yes. >> Such a good move.
22:58
Didn't even realize it is such a boss move.
23:00
Plus, by the way, what you didn't see was a whole lot of parents who have kids who want their kids to be able to express themselves.
23:07
Hearing you sing that song, which is heartbreaking in itself with your with your back to the audience, >> you couldn't have planned it better. >> It's mental.
23:16
>> It's borderline psycho is what it is without even realizing it. >> It is mental. >> I love it. Back to this album. Okay. Casting my eyes.
23:23
I mean, so easy to fall in love with.
23:25
What a cheeky song that is. >> Yes. No. >> Seriously, I love it.
23:29
Austin Powers but Barakarak >> little Deion Warick thing going on there for sure.
23:33
I love man I need powerful something >> something in between. >> Really >> love that.
23:39
>> Interestingly I felt like that was the one that I was like oo >> it's quite understated. >> Not the words. No, not the words.
23:46
But I there was a time where I felt the production needed to be bigger to kind of match the weight of the words, which I feel are like very direct and >> an outpouring and >> Well, it's your Pisces coming to to full fruition. Right. It's like I'm here. I'm open.
24:02
I'm very vulnerable and I get it.
24:04
But at the same time, I do not want to be owned by a man or woman or anybody. >> Anybody.
24:08
Not his, not hers, not yours. >> That's right.
24:11
>> But I actually think it's perfectly understated in that way.
24:13
And yeah, that one's been surprising for me that people have been feeling that one.
24:17
That was the first song I wrote actually for this album. >> Interesting. You're in a mood, huh? >> Yeah.
24:22
And it sort of just sat there for a while and I was like, I know you'll be on the album, but I need to build the world around you.
24:28
>> What mood were you in when you wrote it?
24:30
>> Just torn, confused, like wanting and not wanting to be in love and yeah, just unsure.
24:37
Also unsure of the direction of what I was making.
24:40
I think outside of love as a concept, I was just like, I don't know what I'm making >> soundwise or anything. Yeah. >> Yeah. Who am I? LOL, you know. >> Wow.
24:51
It's so interesting, right?
24:51
Because that's the thing you have to ask yourself over and over again as you're if you're an artist before you decide to commit anything is to is who am I? >> Who am I today? Who am I today? >> Yeah. And I didn't know.
25:02
>> Well, I think there's a beauty in that.
25:04
>> The song certainly helped. >> Yeah. Amazing.
25:06
Like all sorts of questions going on in here, but some strong defiance as well. I love this. Ah, what an album. Top to bottom, man. Flawless material. Classic material. The art of loving. It's a strong statement.
25:18
And the album backs it up and then some. A beautiful song there. Something in between.
25:22
I love nerding out with you about your music.
25:23
I love that you're unafraid to me for me to talk about how much I love two little solo feedback notes at the end which create tension. It's awesome.
25:30
>> But the feedback is so important on this album.
25:32
The day we recorded nice to each other, Dan who who played a lot of guitar on the album and plays in my band, I said when me and Zach said, "Could you just do a whole pass of feedback and he did like three minutes just >> and then throughout the whole process we just pulled bits transitional moments."
25:49
>> I love It's like a conversation you're having as well with something else that's not quite as you know cuz when >> all the instruments are talking to each other to some degree and you are in the conversation but they but they could easily just be playing to each other but the feedback is really to me only talking directly to you in a strange way when I hear it. >> That's interesting.
26:06
Yeah, I think it's a beautiful thread and disrupts it a little bit.
26:11
I'm I'm somebody I like quite like clean and just warm sounding things, but I think that just added an element of like >> uncomfortability at points which I think works.
26:23
>> You talked about Angie Stone, you talked about Lauren Hill, we've talked a bit about D'Angelo.
26:26
We will talk in a few minutes more about D'Angelo with your blessing, but >> you know, who else has has been a defining kind of musical touch point for you?
26:34
And are there anything any any sort of ones in there that would surprise people perhaps?
26:37
I don't know what surprises people anymore, but >> I don't know what surprises people.
26:39
>> I don't know what surprises people. I mean unsurprising I would say I'll give two I guess Carol King for me is just such a touchstone and reference point in terms of songwriting that is just >> clear and beautiful >> so direct and
26:55
>> and just structured like so beautifully and >> and Heartbreak dressed up in a beautiful bright color and sometimes bright you know sometimes like these really demure colors about that that are ultimately about the greatest day she's ever had it's such a crazy paradox with her writing I think sometimes Yeah. I mean,
27:09
I mean, I'm always thinking that You Make Me Feel Like an Natural Woman is the best song ever written.
27:14
The way the chords moved, the way like the the power, the femininity she's talking about.
27:19
Like, I just I love that song. >> Yeah, me too.
27:22
>> It's my favorite song ever. >> Yeah.
27:24
>> Um, what would be an What would be a surprising reference?
27:28
>> Go through an emo phase.
27:28
Everybody goes through an emo phase. >> No, not really. What's an emo phase? Like Jeff Buckley.
27:33
I guess that's kind of emo. >> You like Jeff? >> Love Jeff Buckley. >> Same. The Dark is amazing.
27:37
It's coming out as a new documentary. >> Oh, yeah.
27:40
I've seen It's Never Over, right? Yeah. It's incredible. It's incredible. >> Love Jeff Buckley. >> Yeah.
27:46
Jeff was one of those artists that one of the things I love about Jeff's story is that Jeff was a student before he was a he was a performer >> that he he sat in his room knowing he had this gift, but also knowing that he'd be analyzed for it because of his father and whatnot.
28:00
>> So, he went through and he he just studied his favorites, studied the greats, >> and you can hear it. >> You can hear it. >> Yes.
28:06
you know, vocally >> haunting >> so vulnerable such sad material. >> Dream dream brother. Oh my god. >> Crazy >> crazy music.
28:16
And I love sketches as well.
28:18
I think even though the album was finished posumously, everybody who wants you is one of the great falln unrequited yearning love songs I think ever.
28:27
>> How do you feel about postumous albums?
28:30
That's a big question maybe for the radio today.
28:32
>> No, it's a good question.
28:32
Look, it always comes down to the music and whether I feel that the spirit is in the music.
28:38
>> I I respect the fact that people want to give fans music and if the music was there and there was never a barrier to entry after after tragedy >> that the that people do their best to try to honor that.
28:50
>> But I've got to hear the spirit.
28:50
Like when I heard circles by Mac >> Yeah.
28:55
>> that to me was like all right the spirit is >> I hear it and it's like thank you.
28:58
Like I think they wanted this. >> Yeah.
29:02
I he >> we hear that >> he wanted that album to come out >> and know where he was going >> with his music.
29:08
>> So I feel like he's he's still here when I hear it.
29:11
>> So when it feels like that I embrace all the music, but if I feel like it's a money grab, obviously >> I think we should leave Prince's vault alone.
29:21
>> I believe that is what he would have wanted.
29:23
>> I think he will rain hell on us from what I from what I can tell.
29:26
My thing with Prince was if he wanted you to hear it, >> you heard it. >> You heard it. >> Yeah. And we heard a lot.
29:32
>> We got a lot of music.
29:33
>> Prince was a big reference for me, I think, on this album. I think >> which era? All of it or which era?
29:36
I mean, it's >> there was a song uh that I heard on the radio during the recording process called Do Yourself a Favor, Frank, from 1999.
29:47
>> And I think that joy and that just power really inspired Man I need.
29:51
I was like, I want a song like this that as soon as I hear it, it makes me want to dance.
29:56
And when I play it live, it's going to be like a tangastic. >> Yeah. Fantastic.
30:01
>> You know, >> I loved how Prince, everyone used to talk about Prince's power, but I loved it that, you know, Prince used to be able to whisper things at you.
30:07
>> Some of his understated performances are some of his most powerful.
30:09
I mean, Son of the Times moments like, you know, Starfish and Coffee.
30:12
He's not bouting it out on that.
30:13
He's just letting you know Battle of the Dorothy Parker.
30:15
I mean, >> doesn't need to. Such range.
30:16
I'll give it to you when it's time. >> When it's time. >> Yeah.
30:21
You'll get what you're given.
30:22
>> So much music from Prince, but not enough. Definitely.
30:26
You know, one of the things I think that we've had to acknowledge now is that we wish that D'Angelo had made more music, but he made the right amount of music for D'Angelo.
30:32
And I said to said on the radio yesterday, we were talking about it.
30:35
Let's not focus on the albums he didn't make.
30:37
Let's focus on the fact that boy do we make the most of the ones he did.
30:40
>> I mean, I'm a strong believer in quality over quantity.
30:44
And is he not the most perfect example of that?
30:46
Like >> everything he's ever made is just such a gift.
30:51
You have spent some time with the wonderful super freak unique like Raphael Sadik uh who is just like talk about walking breathing music. >> I'm a radio DJ.
31:00
I get this is what we do.
31:03
We just uncover this stuff.
31:03
Is there a story you can tell us about that experience? >> There is a story. Wow.
31:07
I didn't think I'd be talking about this today. So, yeah. And how apt.
31:11
Um I obviously am such a fan of Raphael Sadiq.
31:15
I was obsessed with his music and I was just like, "What would it be like if I was able to be in the studio with him?"
31:23
But obviously that will never happen, lol.
31:26
Um, and then they were like, "It's going to happen."
31:29
And we had like not a lot of time together >> and gosh, I haven't thought about this in a while.
31:34
in a while. I turned up to the studio and he hadn't arrived yet and I sat down at the piano in the live room and I was just sort of playing and then I turned around and then he came in and we sat at the piano together and he played and I just listened and I found the whole
31:51
experience so overwhelming that all I could do was listen really like we made a few things but I just I wanted to observe in that moment and I remember he was saying oh yeah he was talking to the engineer and he was like, "Oh, he was in here yesterday like smoking siggies." And I And I said, "Who?" And he said, "D'ngelo."
32:06
And then it was like, "Well, now I can't make music in here.
32:10
What am I supposed to do in here today after D'Angelo was in here yesterday?" You know?
32:14
Um, so that was a surreal life moment for sure.
32:20
>> I love that you just were present enough to let it be inspiring and not necessarily leap head first into the opportunity.
32:30
>> I'm just not that way in the studio.
32:32
like unless I feel compelled or I feel like I have something to say or a melody to sing, I'd rather not.
32:36
Uh I think that the best songs, at least for me, happen naturally. Yeah.
32:44
>> And if I'm in a moment where I'm like, I don't have anything to give to this right now.
32:48
I'm not going to pick up the mic and just who?
32:50
It's like it's not the vibe.
32:52
I'd rather leave with a beautiful instrumental and then come back to it later.
32:57
>> I have just thoroughly enjoyed every second in your company today. It's been fun.
33:01
>> Yeah, it's been really we could talk forever. >> Yeah. Well, let's keep going.
33:03
Whenever the time is right, the doors always open.
33:06
>> I'd love to come back.
33:07
>> You know, we remain such huge fans.
33:08
Everyone here at Apple and myself very much so a fan of what you do as an artist and >> and now as a person like, you know, you really know yourself and I really love that.
33:15
Um, thank you for being so honest.
33:17
Thank you for sharing that cool story about you and Raphael Sadik.
33:18
And, um, can't wait to see you again. >> Yay. Thank you for having me. >> Thank you.