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You can only attract to you what vibrates in harmony with you.
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So, if we see things coming into our life that we don't like, let's understand what we don't like is in harmony with something inside.
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How do we keep positive and motivated in the journey of cleansing our paradigms towards our soul?
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How do you keep a sustained level of enthusiasm in this journey that actually requires quite a lot of profound internal work?
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I think you said the right word there in enthusiasm.
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I think people are looking for excitement. Yeah, very well said.
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And there's quite a big difference. Absolutely.
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I've always pointed out when you see a person that gets excited when something good happens, you're going to see somebody gets depressed when something bad happens.
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And there's a great lesson in that.
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But rather than than getting a excited, we should get enthused.
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We want to look where enthusiasm come from, is it comes from in theos, which is in spirit. And everything just is.
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And if we can look at it, it just is.
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It's neither good nor bad. It just is.
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We're not going to get excited, we'll get enthused.
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And if we look at the negative, it just is.
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It's not going to depress us cuz it just is.
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So, I think the trick there is to understand the difference between enthusiasm and excitement.
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And how do you maintain the enthusiasm?
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I think the only way to maintain it is to continually study who you are. Mhm. Never stop studying.
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And now I don't think you just sit and study and do nothing else.
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You have to study, you have to study, understand, and you have to apply it.
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So, it all comes out in results.
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Now, I have found a great way to measure results is in money.
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You can measure it to the penny.
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People say happiness or health.
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You can't measure a person's happiness.
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And you cannot measure their health.
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You can go and you can have a checkup and they'll say, "Guys in perfect health."
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He walks out of the doctor's office and bang, he drops dead.
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He wasn't in perfect health at all. It appeared he was.
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And but in earning money, you provide service.
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But you got to control the money.
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You don't let the money control you.
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And then if you fall in love with the idea of providing service and it's in a profit-making way, you can earn a lot of money.
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Well, then you can put that money to work to do great things with.
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And that's sort of the path I'm on.
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And like my partner and I, we build schools over in Africa.
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And we do them through Cynthia Kersey out there in Los Angeles.
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She is the Unstoppable Foundation.
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And um we take a lot of joy in that.
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We have people in the company go over and see the work that we're doing, you know, that they're contributing to.
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So, I think you um you've got to keep checking your results and you have to keep raising your own level of awareness.
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And the only way to do that is to continually study.
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And but control your life.
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Don't let life control you.
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So, you're living from the inside out, which sounds very esoteric or philosophical.
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But it's the only way I can explain it cuz that's really what you're doing.
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See, when you talk about money, Bob, uh you know, I I feel aligned with that, too.
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The idea of I I grew up in a mindset of where I often thought that, you know, money was the root of all evil or that money meant someone had to do something negative to get it, or you always had just enough to survive.
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And I I find that we still see that paradigm existing in society.
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But see, when you talk about money, and even when I learned with the monks, where we really understood the value of money, you see it as a as an energy source of service. You see it as it is. Yeah, exactly.
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You see it as an energy source of service, of helping, of giving, of providing.
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Tell us about that mental shift that's made, because I feel that you're obviously a teacher in the law of attraction, and and you know, popularized and shared that concept.
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How about when What are some of the myths with the law of attraction when it comes to money?
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Because I find that there are a lot of misuses or misapplications of the law of attraction when when it comes to money. Oh, listen.
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When it comes to the law of attraction, it's almost synonymous with the ignorance.
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Hardly Hardly anybody understands the law of attraction.
4:52
The The secret, of course, you know, really blew up the law of attraction in a big way.
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Caused a lot of people to think about it, but we didn't explain it properly on that movie.
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Didn't get into it in depth.
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And most people don't know how to get into it in depth.
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Attraction um is not a It's a secondary law. It isn't a primary law.
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The primary law is the law of vibration.
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And the law of vibration decrees that everything moves. Nothing rests.
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We live in an ocean of motion.
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Circulation being one of the first laws in the universe.
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When stuff When circulation stops, death sets in.
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Well, we operate on a frequency. You do. I do.
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And what we're really attempting to do with it is raise the frequency that we're operating on.
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We want to operate on a higher frequency all the time, cuz that's where the real beauty of life is.
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Well, this thing we're living in is a molecular structure in a very high speed of vibration.
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And the brain is an electronic switching station that alters the vibration we're in.
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Well, we operate on a frequency and the only thing we can attract to us is that which is in resonance with us.
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So, the reaction is actually attraction.
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It's like Emerson said the law of cause and effect was the law of laws. Action, reaction.
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It's the law of cause and effect.
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Well, our thoughts, feelings, and actions we send off into the universe. It's a vibration.
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The universe sends it back.
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It responds in like manner.
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Well, the response of the universe is the attraction.
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You can only attract to you what vibrates in harmony with you.
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So, if we see things coming into our life that we don't like, let's understand what we don't like is in harmony with something inside.
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So, we better try and understand what it was or what it is and then get rid of it.
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Attraction's a secondary law and we've got to understand it is very real and you only attract to you what you're in harmony with.
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When you want something that's on a higher frequency, you've got to operate on that higher frequency, cuz all the thoughts and things that you require are on that higher frequency.
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Most people I say are living on an AM frequency trying to listen to FM music. It doesn't work.
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How how do you know what vibrational frequency level you're operating at?
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Uh because people often judge their people judge their performance by their productivity, by their efficiency.
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We're not trained, as you said with your paradigm, again going back to that, we're not trained to observe our frequency and vibration, and people are not sure.
7:57
So, if someone's listening and watching us today, how do they know what their vibrational or their frequency is?
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How do they diagnose that?
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Well, I think the only way to do it is by the results you're getting. Mhm. Mhm. It'll tell you. Right. Makes sense.
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uh you're See, the results do tell the truth. They don't lie.
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Spirit manifests through its polar opposite, always. We're spiritual beings.
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Spirit flows to and through us.
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And will do anything for us, whatever we ask, it'll give us.
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And we're asking in thought.
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So, what we want to do is take a look, what have I been thinking?
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Take a look at your results, you'll know what you're thinking.
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That's how you can tell the frequency you're on.
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You want to start frequency is vibration, vibration is feeling.
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When you say I feel bad, what you're really saying is, I'm not in a very good vibration.
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You say I feel particularly good, you're saying I'm in a pretty good vibration.
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Conscious awareness of vibration is referred to as feeling. Mhm.
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So, I think the way to really understand the frequency and the vibrations you're operating on is by the results you're getting. Yeah.
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If you're continually having problems in all areas of your life, you're on the wrong you're on the wrong vibration.
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You know, very low level of vibration. And we can change it.
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Now, I teach that in the seminars, I have ways of illustrating and everything, and um it's important and and as people get into it, they really like it.
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See, I think when you hear the truth, you'll know it.
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And I came across, I don't know, it came to me, I guess.
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I was searching for a way how to explain that.
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When you hear the truth, you'll know it.
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Well, there's music in this room right now.
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There's music in your room.
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You may not hear it, but we know it's here. It's being broadcast. It's in the room.
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And we don't hear it because our ears are not operating on the frequency the music is being broadcast on.
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But if we turned on a radio, the radio picks up on that frequency, speeds it up to zip up way up on a higher frequency, and we can hear it.
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Well, it's the receiver in the radio that picks it up, sends it up on a higher level where you hear it.
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When you hear the truth, the truth resonates with the essence of who you are.
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And when it resonates, it sets up that vibration.
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It comes out on the conscious level as knowing. You just know.
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You just know that's right. Yeah.
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When you hear the truth, you'll know I know it. That's true. Mhm.
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Well, that's true when you're reading something.
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When a person says something to you, you hear it and you just I know that's not true. I know that is true.
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It resonates with the essence of we there is perfection.
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Our spiritual DNA is perfect.
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And when we hear the truth, it's like that's the receiver.
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And it clicks in, you know. Yeah.
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We're pretty fascinating expressions of life, you and I and everybody else.
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I mean, the beautiful part is like I've studied this like a scientist, probably more serious as the time goes on.
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But for 60 years starting on the 21st of this past October, this is my 60th year and I study this every day.
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I mean, this is I'm obsessed with this.
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And at one time that bothered me.
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Uh but it doesn't anymore.
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And so I I just don't stop studying it and it's so beautiful. Mhm.
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Bring that that other thing up because it had bothered me.
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I used to think You hear things and you think they're positive or negative.
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I hear obsession, I thought that was negative.
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Somebody told me I was obsessed with something or I thought I was obsessed.
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But then I got a hold of Lloyd C.
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Douglas's book, The Magnificent Obsession.
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And I I thought, "How could it be negative if it's magnificent, you know?" Yeah.
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So I got the dictionary out and I looked the word up.
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I don't know why I hadn't done it before then.
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And it says an obsession is the persistent, disturbing preoccupation with an often unreasonable idea.
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It's a magnificent definition.
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And I'm obsessed with a beautiful concept. Mhm. Who am I?
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That's the obsession, you know.
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Yeah, it's a great obsession.
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Um it's it's the beginning of all knowledge, right?
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It's the seed of all knowledge.
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Like everything starts from that.
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Uh everything starts from that question. Yeah.
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Uh and and it's it's yeah, it's the beginning of all knowledge and and seeking of of true knowledge.
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I loved what you said about the truth always resonating.
13:09
Tell us a bit about Bob around the applying the law of attraction to to love in our lives because I find that one of the biggest paradigm blocks that a lot of us have and I know a lot of my listeners feel challenged with is the finding of love, the keeping of love, the uh growing of love in a relationship with another person.
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Uh it can be one of the biggest challenges as you said, our spiritual DNA is perfect, but our material experiences and DNA comes with baggage and pain and stress, and we end up attracting or vibrating at a level where we attract something that that actually is what we need at the time, but isn't what we really truly want.
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Tell me a bit about your experience in that area and your field or study in that area.
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I think that love is resonance.
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When two people are in love, they're on the same frequency intellectually, emotionally, and physically. Mhm.
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Most people that get married are not in love. They're in habit.
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Or that stay married are not in love.
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When two people are in love, they enjoy thinking about the same ideas.
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Conscious mind deals with ideas.
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They get emotionally involved with the same ideas, so they're setting up the same vibrations.
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Their heart is on the same frequency.
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And physically, they enjoy doing the same things.
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They have a great physical connection.
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That's when two people are in love.
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They're in harmony intellectually, emotionally, and physically.
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You can fall in love with your business.
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I'm in love with the business that I'm in.
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Intellectually, emotionally, and physically, I'm in it right up to here, you know?
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So, that's where I see love comes in.
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I think I don't think most people are that are married are in love.
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I think they see each other, and he thinks, "God, she looks pretty good."
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And she thinks, "He looks pretty good."
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And they go to the and they go to heaven for 15 minutes, and they say, "We're in love."
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Well, they were actually having some fun, but they weren't in love.
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Uh but they thought they were and so they get married and they have nothing in common really.
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And um some of them will give the marriage a quiet funeral and get on with life and others will just stay there and live like that, but there isn't any love.
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There may be respect and things like that.
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But I see love as when it's harmony, it's resonance.
15:53
Um you can love a person, you can love an idea, you can love a vocation, you can love a place, you know?
16:04
It's like Paul the Apostle, he said the greatest thing is love and he's so right.
16:08
Well, that's when everything you're in harmony with everything in all aspects of your life. Mhm.
16:15
It's I'm pretty well the way I'm living.
16:18
Now, it's taken me 87 years to get here, but you know, but life's pretty good. Yeah, I can tell.
16:27
I I I feel it from the way you speak.
16:29
It's it's definitely there, which is beautiful.
16:33
Where where does anyone who's listening to us today, Bob, will definitely feel inspired and moved?
16:40
What what would you want someone to do straight after they stop listening to this episode?
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As they go back into their own life after listening to you today, what do you want them to do?
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What do you Who do you Who do you want them to be?
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What Where would you like them to start?
16:51
I'd like to ask them to ask themselves, "What do I really want in this life?" "What do I really want?"
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And take a pen and write it down.
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"What do I really want in this life?"
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They might start out, what do I love doing?
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I think that's where you start your purpose in life is what you love. I'm living my purpose.
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See, your purpose is why you're alive, why you get out of bed in the morning.
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And some people never figure that out.
17:34
They never even give it any thought.
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When it's probably the most important question a person can ask themselves.
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If you start out what do I really love doing, that's a good place to start.
17:45
Do you know I had a a doctor here, oh, probably a couple of years ago now in Phoenix.
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He was in a seminar and he said, um, he was telling me he was thinking of quitting the medical profession.
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I said, why are you going to quit?
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Well, he said, you got to put in a lot more time to earn less money today.
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And I said, well, I've heard that.
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He said, the medical profession's all messed up.
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And I said, well, I've heard that, too.
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I said, why did you become a doctor?
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Well, he said, I loved it.
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I said, why would you want to quit?
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Well, he said, because you can't earn I said, wait a minute.
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I said, if you're doing what you love, if you never earned a dime, you're spending your days doing what you love to do.
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That's the trick of life.
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I said, your problem is you think you earn money by going to work. You work to earn money.
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You don't work to earn money.
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People who earn the most money don't work at all.
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You earn money by providing service, but you gain satisfaction from doing what you love.
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And there's two forms of income.
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One's satisfaction, the other's money. It's a material thing.
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But I said, if you're not getting satisfaction from what you do, you should quit it.
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Because I said, that's where it comes in.
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That's why we should figure out what we love to do, and And dedicate our life to it.
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I got into this business, I'd been studying it for quite a while, and I had the opportunity, I already mentioned, of visiting Earl Nightingale in 1966.
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And I was leaving his office right at the end, and I said, "Earl, what is the big deal in life?"
19:27
Well, he said, "There isn't any big deal, Bob."
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He said, "It's simply a matter of sitting and figuring what you love to do, and then dedicate your life to it."
19:34
He said, "The problem with most people is they never figure out what they love to do."
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Well, I'm telling I could feel the hair going up in the back of my neck.
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I knew exactly what I loved to do.
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I would love to do what he was doing.
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I was and I wanted to do it with him.
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I had a very busy company at the time.
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We're operating in Canada, the US, and England.
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But I knew that I was finished doing that.
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I was going to come back.
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I was going to work with him.
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Two years later, I was his vice president sales.
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I wanted to do in the what he was doing, being the business he was in.
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And that's where I made the decision, and I love it. I love what I do.
20:11
Now, that's what people should be doing. What do I love to do?
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Then dedicate your life to it.
20:17
Now, you earn money by providing service.
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You can earn money while you're sleeping.
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Just figure out how to serve people.
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You don't have to be there.
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You don't have to physically be there and do it.
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You can serve people while you're sleeping and get paid.
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And that's how you earn money.
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So, you got to learn how to earn money.
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But that has got nothing to do with a life of living what you love. That's the first place.
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So, if I was telling anybody, sit down, figure out what you love to do, and then make it make up your mind you're going to dedicate your life to it.
20:47
What stops most people what they love to do, they think you can't earn any money at it. That doesn't matter. Forget about the money. That's another subject.
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Figure out how to earn it.
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Go and talk to people who know how to earn money.
21:01
I know how to earn money.
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I can teach people how to earn money.
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But that is not the thing. It's to provide service.
21:07
So, the most important thing, what do I love to do? Sit down.
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What would I really love to do?
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How would I love to spend my life?
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That's what we should do.
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And unfortunately, most people never get involved in that exercise.
21:21
What is the first thing you do in the morning to start your day?
21:25
What is it that you do that you feel starts your day?
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Because I feel that a lot of the times what I'm noticing, especially now in the culture we live in, whether it's reaching for our phone, whether it's looking at the news, we're starting our day with energy that's already putting us in the wrong direction or pushing us in the wrong direction. What What are you doing?
21:51
What are you encouraging people to do first thing in the morning to start with this understanding that we are awareness, to start with this understanding that negative feelings need to be embraced?
22:02
It's so amazing cuz the first thing I do now is I lay in bed and as awareness. So, I be awareness.
22:09
And I just lay there for a particular amount of time just feeling the joy and the freedom of the eternal being that we are.
22:22
And and just lay in awareness.
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And so, that's what I do absolutely every single morning.
22:28
And what's extraordinary now, I mean, at the beginning, it was like I felt like I had to remember to do remember to do that, but that doesn't even kind of make sense.
22:37
But I That's what I felt.
22:40
I felt like I had to remember to do it.
22:41
And now, the moment I open my eyes is just awareness just fills the room and the joy just fills the room.
22:51
And so, I lay I lay in that.
22:54
Prior to that, I would wake up every day in gratitude. Yeah. Yeah.
22:59
Prior to that was gratitude was And you know, Jay, even now if life gets a bit um bumpy or or something happens, just something not really negative, but just something where everything isn't flowing, then I will just look at gratitude and and through awareness just be so grateful for the fact that we are this infinite being and that no one dies.
23:30
I'm so grateful to be aware of this and to know this.
23:36
It's quite you know, it's that's also quite humbling.
23:40
That somehow or another in this lifetime is that I had this awakening and realization of this and um because as you say, I agree with you 100%.
23:53
I there is nothing greater than knowing who you are. There's nothing.
23:59
There will never be anything greater than that.
24:01
A thousand years from now, 10,000 years from now, nothing will be greater than knowing who you are and being who you are.
24:07
And it's just step by step, little step by step.
24:10
And now's a really good time because the ego is being challenged, the mind is being challenged, is being hit on all sides with with the disharmony and the and the and the disruption on the planet.
24:25
And so now is the best time ever to really like welcome those emotions and and to look toward to look in the direction of who who you are instead of who you are not. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.
24:43
And and I just want to address because I feel like someone may be listening to us and thinking, well, well, Rhonda Jay, how does this help me be successful, be happy, live the life I want?
24:56
How does you know, how does this create it?
24:58
And I just want to and I want to dive into what Rhonda's going to have to say about this, but I just want to address it from from how I see it.
25:03
The understanding is very simple that as Rhonda's saying, we're not our body.
25:10
And if we think we're our body, we will surround ourselves with things that are good for the body.
25:16
But if we're not the body, then none of those things can actually satisfy us.
25:19
An an example that we'd always learn from the Vedic tradition was a fish out of water.
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That if you took a fish out of water, you could give it a mansion, you could give it a car, you could give it jewelry, you could give it money, but that fish will die because it's not in water.
25:35
It's not where it belongs and it isn't in its natural habitat.
25:40
And and so similarly, understanding that we are awareness gives us the opportunity to do what is right for us as awareness, to truly feed that awareness because I think the challenge that we think about when we think about success or happiness, we think of success and happiness on the basis of the body and the mind.
26:03
And that's why even after accumulating everything, we still feel dissatisfied because those things only touch the body and mind. Correct, Rhonda? Correct. Correct.
26:12
And and and really, the best thing that could happen to everybody is that their greatest dream comes true.
26:20
Because when your greatest dream comes true, the dream that where you are absolutely convinced that when this dream comes true, that is when I will really be happy.
26:30
The best thing that could happen is that dream comes true.
26:31
Because when it does, you will realize that there is something missing.
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And that happiness that you thought you would have doesn't last.
26:39
And so, it's you know, it's it's such a beautiful thing.
26:45
And for people who have been successful, then they get to that point and they're like, they're not happy.
26:52
And they're not happy because those things were never going to make you happy in the first place anyway.
26:57
And so, um but in terms of success I would say this, that when you are who you really are, when you're living from the place more of who you are than who you are not, everything that you need and want will fall into your hands effortlessly.
27:20
And you are actually the infinite being is effortless.
27:24
And the way to kind of tell who's in charge is whether it's the ego or the mind that's in charge or or who you really are that is in charge in any moment is effort.
27:35
And if you're efforting, if you can feel this efforting, then it's the ego and the mind.
27:42
And if you're coming from a place of effortlessness, where athletes call it being in the flow, and everybody has these kind of descriptions.
27:49
It's where the mind has stopped and just everything is flowing.
27:54
You just feel like everything in the universe is just dancing your dance and singing to your song.
28:00
And so, in terms of success, when you are being more of who you are, that idea that was going to make you successful is what will come to you. That original idea.
28:12
Because the mind just recycles. That's all it can do.
28:18
It's a program and recycles.
28:18
And the ideas that business kind of business ideas that have never been on Earth, they are coming from awareness.
28:30
They are coming from above the mind.
28:30
So, when you are awareness, that is when everything will fall into your hands.
28:37
Everything that you need.
28:37
And it just your whole life flows and you're just happy all of the time.
28:42
Like there is it's just like the universe is just saying and I even wrote in the secret, you know, the shortcut to the secret is be happy now. Right? Just be happy.
28:51
Let go of all of the things that that you're saying why you can't be happy, and just be happy now.
28:58
Because when you're happy, everything just everything just falls into place. It's so amazing.
29:04
So, definitely for success, that is the fastest fastest way to success is to be who you are.
29:16
And um it's not you don't we're not talking about going in a cave or you know, or doing anything like that.
29:21
We are talking about living your life in the incredible form and human being that you are and having the experience that you are, but from a place of knowing that you are the infinite being, that you are immortal.
29:35
And we are taught as Jay said, it's got to be through your experience.
29:40
It can't be through Oh, I heard, you know, Rhonda talk about this and whatever.
29:45
No, not interested in you taking on another belief.
29:48
What What it is is for you to experience it.
29:51
And it is not hard for you to experience it because it's who you are already.
29:55
It's not anything that you have to go out and get.
30:00
In some ways, it's almost frustrating, isn't it?
30:02
I remember when I started out, I'm like, it's who I am already, but at the time, you know, I'd be like, I can tell the mind's the mind's taken over at the moment.
30:13
And yeah, it's already who we are.
30:13
And so, we've just What we've done is we've attributed everything that is awareness to the mind.
30:22
We've given the mind the whole thing.
30:24
And it's awareness that is hearing these words right now.
30:31
That is what's hearing these words. Right?
30:33
That is what is seeing uh through these eyes. It's awareness.
30:39
It's If without awareness, we wouldn't even know we're alive. Exactly.
30:42
Well, well, that's that's the thing, Rhonda, that you know, I've I've heard a lot of people say that when they first saw an autopsy or they went to a funeral, that's when they realized they weren't the body.
30:55
Like that was when they've If you've ever If you haven't seen an autopsy, I recommend everyone finds a way to visit the hospital and see to see to see to see that allows us to disconnect from we're not this physical body. We get that.
31:09
But I feel that for a lot of people, like you rightly said, it's difficult to think we're not the mind because, like you said, we have given the mind all of awareness.
31:19
We think that that is us.
31:22
So So I think a lot of people are getting to the understanding that we are not this body.
31:28
I think I think people can get there to some degree at least in their mind, but then a lot of us struggle to get behind Well, if I'm not the mind, then then what else is there?
31:36
Tell us about how you start seeing the the the Tell us about how you start seeing the fallibility of us thinking we're the mind.
31:48
So let's just investigate and look at the look at the mind and what the mind is.
31:52
And so it's really good for you to find out what the mind is, especially considering that most of us have given it total authority over our life.
31:58
And we believe all of the thoughts that it produces, and which is the voice in your head, and the voice in your head is not who you are.
32:08
So that was a really big revelation for me.
32:10
So So all that the mind is made of is thought.
32:15
Beginning to end, full stop. It's thought.
32:17
And so it's memory, which is thought, and it has images, which is just thought in pictures, but it's still thought.
32:23
And the current thoughts that we think, uh, and so all that the mind is is made of thought.
32:31
And so without a single thought, and check for yourself, the mind isn't there.
32:38
If there's no thought, there's no mind.
32:41
And so, when you begin to look at that and investigate that, then it's really quite interesting.
32:46
But then so so now we know that the mind is just thought.
32:52
And therefore, when a thought comes and a thought goes, if we were our mind, then that means that when a thought comes and when a thought goes, a little bit of us would go with it.
33:05
And then when a thought comes and a thought goes, a little bit more of us would go with a thought if we were our mind.
33:11
A bit of us would be disappearing with every single thought.
33:14
But if you look at it, guess what?
33:18
You are there, aware, before a thought comes and you're there after it leaves.
33:25
So, how can you be the mind?
33:25
And the other thing is, what is aware of the thoughts in your head?
33:35
Awareness is aware of the thoughts in your head because a thought is not aware.
33:41
A thought has no awareness whatsoever.
33:44
And so, the one that is aware of the thoughts is who you really are.
33:46
And so, when you start to and just sort of sit with this a little bit, I'm not suggesting that oh, in this moment you're like, oh, I know I'm not the mind.
33:57
But if you just kind of sit with this and next time when you've got a whole lot of thoughts coming through your head, that you remember this.
34:05
And and and think about it.
34:09
Oh, I was here before all of these thoughts and I am here still here after they go, fully intact.
34:17
None of me has disappeared.
34:17
And what was it that was aware?
34:20
Because you could you could even ask this question, am I the thoughts that I think or am I the one that is aware of those thoughts?
34:30
We never say I mind, we say my mind or my body or we say my car because we realize that we are not it, right?
34:42
You don't say I mind, you you you know, so it's it's so clear to us in our even our language that it's my mind.
34:49
That means my mind belongs to something that is me and hence the question is who am I because it's my body and my mind and I think what you just shared so beautifully is exactly that is that it is something that is existing beyond the purview of the mind and thoughts simply.
35:11
And for anyone who's wondering and trying to intellectually wrap their head around this, the reason why it's so powerful to understand this is because then the negativities of the mind and the body start to affect you less because you realize that they are not you and that they are not your life.
35:35
Uh and and that's the key that, you know, if anyone's wondering, "Well, how does this help me?"
35:39
That's how it helps you is because you start to recognize that what happens to the body, just like if your car has an accident you may feel a little bit of pain, but you don't feel the same pain as when something affects your body directly.
35:53
And that the car is a shell and so similarly you start realizing that I'm a driver inside my body and my mind and so even though my body's hurt, yes, obviously I need to go to the hospital and take care of it, of course, but that still isn't me.
36:05
No, and um and you know, Lester Levenson who is in the um who's no longer in physical form, but who's quoted in The Greatest Secret and he would say that uh that our mind is was is just been created for one reason and one reason only.
36:26
And that is to create what we want. That's it. Full stop. That's its job.
36:30
That's its tool to create what we want in this life and what we want to experience in in this life.
36:35
And that it's not our psychiatrist, psychologist, psychotherapist and tells us what to do and and believing our thoughts and Jay, I believed my thoughts for decades.
36:51
I just I just It's just amazing that you would believe these thoughts in your head.
36:55
And and if if people just notice the next time, and I hope there's no next time, but that you feel agitated or negative emotional feel stressed, it's because you were believing a whole lot of negative thoughts. That's it.
37:09
You were just believing thoughts.
37:12
And and then that sends you, you know, into into negativity.
37:15
And so our freedom is the mind is wonderful, fantastic tool.
37:22
Nothing wrong with the mind.
37:22
The only problem comes with the mind is when we think it is who we are. Mhm. That's the only problem.
37:28
And and you give this analogy, which I loved.
37:32
You talk about how we're in this dream state.
37:36
Uh and and there's a need for awakening from that because when you're asleep, right?
37:45
When you're asleep, and I think a lot of people feel that I I think people right now feel an awakening in their life that's coming.
37:53
Tell us about the awakening you're speaking about.
37:54
I just think you know when you've woken up.
37:56
I just think you know when when you've woken up because uh like if you're wondering, oh, am I asleep now or have I woken up?
38:06
I just when you wake up you feel incredible.
38:10
You feel so much lighter than you've ever felt.
38:13
You feel so much freer, happier.
38:17
Uh life just becomes miraculous. Everything is a miracle.
38:20
The little things that that you just kind of ignored before now are just things that will bring you to your knees because the sheer beauty and love of those things like sunsets.
38:30
And I remember in my life I would hear people speak of these things and I remember I used to think, oh, you know, I just need to be able to pay my bills, you know, forget about sunsets and all that kind of thing, you know.
38:42
But but as you as you awaken, it's it's uh it frees it just frees you from all of the all of the limitations and all of the conditioning that we've all had in our lives.
39:01
No one's to blame for that.
39:02
It's just kind of part of the journey.
39:05
And you you just you just become free.
39:08
The feeling is incredible and you and people can have lots of little awakenings, can't they, you know, along the way like a little and it's usually when you've seen through some belief that you're like, oh my gosh, I used to believe that and that isn't true.
39:25
And then you just suddenly feel lighter and freer.
39:29
And so awakening is just a big one of those.
39:32
It's just a a huge sort of realization.
39:35
It's it's like a wow moment but instead it's a wow wow wow wow wow wow wow wow and everyone can have it.
39:43
There isn't anybody that is that that can't have it.
39:48
Everybody can have it because it's who you are already.
39:50
What are some of the daily rituals that people can do to experience what you're speaking about because as we both know it's not a it's it isn't a life hack or it isn't an app download or it isn't a you know, it it isn't it isn't a mechanical operational logistical read this three pages you know, it's not that. So what is it?
40:16
Like, how do we make it more tangible for our tangible minds?
40:20
Because our minds are wanting to do something daily and repetitively, because it is repetition.
40:25
There's There is repetition.
40:27
What would you say we can do daily?
40:28
Well, one of the things that that you can do, which which really helps disidentify with the body and the mind, is to is to take uh So, let me see.
40:43
So, first of all, take your body and um and just put your body aside over there, cuz you are not the body.
40:51
So, just like put that aside for the moment. That is not who you are.
40:56
You You can pick up the body in in a minute or two, but just put the body aside.
41:00
And then put aside your name and the age and the description of you.
41:08
And also put it put it aside the story of who you think you are. Put all of that aside.
41:13
So, now the body's aside, the story's aside, um all of those other things are aside.
41:18
Now, what you're going to do is you're going to take the mind.
41:23
And just for a moment, you're going to put the mind aside.
41:24
And that includes all the memory and all thoughts and all feelings.
41:30
And you're just going to put that aside as well. Just pop that aside.
41:35
And then very quickly notice what is left.
41:40
Because what is left is awareness.
41:43
And so, that is one way that's a really good way in the beginning to come back to awareness.
41:48
And it's like, I think in ancient traditions, some of them spoke about it's like peeling the onion. Right?
41:54
So, instead of us accruing, we all we think we have to pile on all this knowledge and everything.
42:01
We go go through life and you know, I need to learn more and I need to accrue more and I need to get all of these degrees.
42:08
And all of that has its place.
42:10
But it's never going to set you free.
42:13
And so, peeling away what we are not and seeing awareness is what will set you free.
42:21
And once you can get to the place, I mean, honestly, the way that I did it was, and I I put it in the book, and it was three and it's three steps.
42:29
I would ask myself multiple multiple multiple times in the day, "Am I aware?"
42:39
And the moment I would ask, "Am I aware?"
42:40
awareness would be there.
42:40
There would be this awareness.
42:42
And then I would go about my day, and then I would ask again, "Am I aware?"
42:46
So, I did that constantly.
42:49
That's a practice to do constantly.
42:51
After a while, actually really short amount of time, um days, really, uh or a week or 2 weeks, when you go to ask, "Am I aware?"
43:01
you can't even ask the question.
43:06
Because awareness is just completely there immediately, like immediately.
43:08
And so, the second step is the first step transforms into the second step.
43:14
So, you go from asking the question, "Am I aware?"
43:18
to automatically noticing awareness.
43:22
So, then lots of times in the day, notice awareness.
43:25
And then the third step is stay as awareness.
43:31
And the second step merges into the first step because when you notice awareness enough, then you're going to find that you are staying as awareness more.
43:46
And so, what happens is, just so people understand, what happens is, the mind is kind of in the foreground at the moment and sort of running your life.
43:59
And um and awareness is so quietly, beautifully, magnificently quietly sitting in the background.
44:05
But when you ask the question, when you notice awareness, stay as awareness, what happens is there's a total shift and awareness comes to the foreground and the mind goes to the background.
44:16
And that way, you can use the mind whenever you need to use the mind.
44:20
It's great to make a date, like for us doing this podcast.
44:25
It's really great for things like that.
44:27
But, then you can stay as awareness and then your life is just absolutely effortless and you're just having incredible happiness and uh that's that's where it all is.
44:38
There's a beautiful Picasso quote that literally sums up everything we're saying and he said that the uh the meaning of life is to find your gift Yeah.
44:46
and the purpose of life is to give it away. Yeah, and I love it.
44:48
It's just it's so poetically beautiful, but it's it also makes so much sense Right.
44:54
that when you use your passion Yeah.
44:57
in the service of others, it becomes a purpose. Right. Absolutely.
44:58
And I feel Yeah, I wish that for everyone listening, watching right now and for anyone else as well that just you find your passion and then you use it for everyone else.
45:07
And that's my like ClassPass why.
45:10
Like at the end of the day, I think once I felt that, I was like how do I have the whole world feel this? As much as possible.
45:19
Because it's it's like you said, it's just it's the only thing that matters and it's it's a gift to each person and I think if you're if every person's able to find that, they're going to be, you know, 10 times a better person to everyone else, right?
45:32
Because of knowing that this this exact feeling can exist for them.
45:37
Totally, totally and that's Yeah, I'm so Yeah, I've got some exciting stuff coming out next year that's kind of giving everyone, in my opinion, the fundamentals of being able to find that first step. I love that.
45:49
Because finding out how to use it for other people can become a scale question.
45:53
Because you can always use it for just your friends and then you can scale it like you have to the whole world and millions of users, etc.
46:00
But But most people struggle at the first step of just like, what am I passionate about? What do I love? Like that.
46:05
And that's what I want to help.
46:05
I want to help codify that for people.
46:06
Do you have any tips or steps that you recommend to people cuz you found yours so young and early in Yeah.
46:12
you know, but have you ever thought about that?
46:15
I mean, I think, you know, part of and it's sort of built into ClassPass a bit of like this idea of discovery, like try new things because you don't know until you've kind of gotten to that phase.
46:24
And we've talked about this a lot, which is people are you have to go through you go through different phases, right?
46:30
So, you're you're maybe in an explore phase and then you might be in a build phase, you might be in a scale phase.
46:34
Um and I think it's a like being able to go through it, but make sure making sure that you keep things really um you keep you keep it fresh, right? And you try new things.
46:44
I was actually just saying this uh just the other day, but like when we're younger, we're told to do so many different activities.
46:51
And as adults, we somehow stop, you know, and you know, I don't and I just don't believe in that because I think you have to keep your mind and you know, body all refreshed.
47:02
And I think when you when you're when we talk about like me being able to take a lot of decisions in my life to keep dreaming and to keep kind of shifting into different places is because I I kind of force myself to do that.
47:12
I never want to kind of get stuck in being like, this is how my life is defined and especially defined by other people.
47:19
And so, I think you have to just keep it fresh, but I think the number one thing is like get out of your comfort zone. Yeah.
47:24
You know, cuz I think you just don't realize it and then and then if you find something, you know, it's it's so a lot of it is also reflective time.
47:32
It's taking time by yourself, which I think people sometimes struggle with as well is have you like sat in a room with yourself for a while and spent a day with just yourself?
47:40
What do you what would you really want to do? Yeah.
47:44
And I think a lot of the answers lie there right there, but it's hard for people to do.
47:47
Yeah, I saw that post on Instagram that you did about play. Right.
47:50
I was reading an article where you said that.
47:53
And that actually really inspired me because I started looking back and I was like, oh, where do I still play Yeah.
47:58
like a child and in fact, I have to admit this because one of the places that I remember playing a lot was actually video games. Funny. I love video games.
48:05
And well, actually I just like playing football on video games like FIFA.
48:09
It's a huge soccer game all over the world and it's I've recently with my business partner who was he loves it, too.
48:15
We literally have all of our business meetings playing FIFA. That's so great.
48:20
And and it's just because he's one person I can get away with that with. Yeah.
48:23
It's just so fun and we do it for an hour a week. It's great play. It's like mindless.
48:26
But I you you reinspired that in me because I was like, "Oh, where do I play?"
48:30
And I love playing sports as well.
48:31
So, it's making more time to actually play sports and play football. Right.
48:36
And and I just feel like, yeah, you're so right.
48:38
And the funny thing is that when adults start taking dance classes or start taking start learning an instrument again, both two things which I would love to do, a lot of people are like, "Oh my god, you're going through a midlife crisis."
48:48
You know, it's it's seen I feel like there's a bit of a not taboo, but there is a bit of a like "Oh, yeah, what are you going through?
48:54
Like, is everything okay at home?"
48:55
People like also just don't think it's a priority.
48:58
Like, you know, and it's like even for Saw, like I think people will be like, "Oh, you're like you dance on the side. It's a hobby."
49:05
We were talking about this.
49:05
Some of the the girls came over last night and one of the girls, she has two kids, okay, and her her husband of all people, cuz we were talking about like what to do with the show, and she was like, "Oh, we might tour it, etc."
49:17
And she was like, you know, she was so surprised cuz the person who was like, "You should do it" was her husband of all people, right?
49:23
Cuz she was expecting him to be like, "Why aren't you home?
49:25
Like, you need to take" And it was amazing because I think like what he realized was like, "This isn't just a hobby.
49:31
Like, this was something great."
49:33
And I think that's kind of what I think people should do is like And look, at the end of the day, if you don't prioritize it, no one else around you is going to prioritize it.
49:41
And this goes back to the goal setting and why I do it is it's if it's a priority to me, it becomes a priority to everyone else in my life.
49:47
And if I'm not willing to stand up for it, no one else is going to.
49:50
So, I do not let anyone make me feel bad for dancing, right?
49:52
And when people are like, I mean, it's crazy to put on a show and the hours I mean, we dance from like 8:00 to 11:00 p. m.
49:58
at night, you know, and everyone has other lives and other things going on. volunteers?
50:04
They all volunteer and you do it because you're, you know, like you it's a priority at the end of the day.
50:11
And I think like that to me in a way like even when we design ClassPass like I think about all the behavioral mechanisms that are required to get somebody to say yes.
50:20
Cuz by the way, there are a lot of things in our lives that make it very easy to say no, right?
50:27
From being busy to where all these things and and my whole thing is if I make it to serve it to you so easy, maybe you'll actually try and say yes.
50:37
And I just feel like the more we can do that in our lives and for for our friends, for you know, people in our lives is help them fight through those challenges because we need to keep these passions in our lives.
50:47
Like I don't like when people are like, I used to be an athlete or I used to be an Olympian.
50:52
Like I meet people and I'm like, what?
50:54
Like this Like cuz there were That means you would you built something for 20 years of your life like some work ethic, some sense of purpose and you wanted to let go of it and it's okay if you want to change for a little bit, but there is something in there.
51:07
There's a reason you worked hard every day to get to such an like a great level and it had to be driven by something deeper.
51:13
So, what is that and how do we make sure we replicate that purpose in your life again even though you might have kids and have a job and everything else going on in your life, you still need to keep that in your life. Absolutely.
51:24
By the way, just for anyone listening, I don't make big business decisions while playing FIFA.
51:29
Just Just putting it out there like in case anyone was wondering.
51:33
like I don't know, like being creative is sometimes one of the best times you can think, you know?
51:40
I get what you're saying, but like sometimes people like things connect in your mind when you let your brain have those moments, you know, whether it's in class or doing something creative.
51:48
Like, you'd be surprised at how much, you know, the rest of your rest of your mind is working and how much more you're efficient your brain can actually become. Yeah, yeah.
51:57
Well, especially you were just saying that you take a lot of you called walking. Absolutely. That reason.
52:02
down right now, but Yeah, yeah, yeah.
52:03
We should have done this We should have done a walking podcast.
52:05
Audio would have struggled as well. Yeah, exactly.
52:07
Um but I I don't know, I just think better.
52:10
Like, I I run on the treadmill close to every day and people are like, "Why do you" And I also obviously go to class, but like my treadmill time is like meditation thinking time.
52:18
Like, I solve problem And you know what?
52:20
Like, I'm off my phone, but I like I'm working through stuff in my head.
52:24
I don't I don't just I can't run I'd be get I would be like completely bored.
52:27
So, I would you know, it's all about thinking through really, you know, things I have to get through in my head and I I'm like you like I don't know, everything has to be thoughtful.
52:37
So, it's like even if I'm thinking through like getting a gift for somebody.
52:40
Like, I have to like I'm not okay with like just being like, "Oh, here."
52:44
It's like I need to spend like even if it's like 2 minutes, like it needs a 2 minutes to think about it. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
52:49
But, I love what you did because obviously you built a huge company and got married, too.
52:57
But, you never left dance. Yeah.
52:59
Like, it because I I feel like when you were building ClassPass, it must have been so easy to make dance not a priority. Yeah.
53:08
Like, it must have been so easy, especially at the scale and acceleration, the focus.
53:10
It must be so easy and so many entrepreneurs say that that they lost their health when they were scaling a business or they lost their passion and now they're using the money they've got now to go back to their passion, etc.
53:22
But, you just never let go.
53:24
There, you know, and I'm not going to say it was perfect.
53:25
Like, there was definitely times I struggled and it was That being said, I always remember being like, "Well, I'm going to forget why I built this company if I stopped dancing, right?"
53:37
And I that's like part of why like I always fought to keep keep it in my life.
53:41
And even actually like till this day, and I always love this like my board members have all come and watched me dance.
53:46
Like they will when they even introduce me to someone, like of course they're always like meet like our founder, like you know, it's really it's exciting, but they'll always be like, "Wait, here's a dance video of her."
53:55
You know, like they're proud of it, too, in a in a in a really special way, which makes me feel cuz that's how people should be celebrating these things, right?
54:04
The These are different types of achievements and accomplishments that human beings have.
54:10
But at the end of the day, like I would lose my why.
54:12
And it would And I I do remember there were times where I stopped, and it obviously my team would be like, "When was the last time you danced?"
54:19
Like they would know because my fire and every like everything that got me to, like I said, fight through the problems I needed to fight through came from always reminding myself of why I started the company, which for me lied in dance. Yeah, I love it. It's That's the best.
54:37
When you've done it through that Yeah.
54:38
And I will keep, you know, like I think about, you know, like having kids or what all the all the things in my life, and I just always remember like, you know, every By the way, every show I have after I'm always like, "Is that going to be my last performance?"
54:52
Like you always just kind of, you know, it's this It is really hard sometimes to work through it, you know?
54:57
But I'm like, "No, I'm going to always do it."
54:59
And every time I do it, I'm like, "Like this is the greatest feeling on earth."
55:05
Like going back to that feeling of euphoria.
55:07
And I think a lot of people have that in their life.
55:10
And even when people like ask I'm sure people ask you this all the time, they ask me this, like, "How do I find my passion?" Whatever.
55:16
It's like, "When was the last time you felt anything close to that?"
55:20
It's probably somewhere in there, you know?
55:22
And And it's it's happened in your life, right?
55:24
It's like whether And it might have been when you were six, but like when can you go back to that feeling?
55:29
Cuz it's probably tied to that emotion. Yeah, 100%.
55:32
Anyone who's listening, don't stop playing.
55:35
Like find your play, like make time to play.
55:37
It's a beautiful lesson from pile.
55:39
It just it's I I think it's huge.
55:41
I I genuinely think it's huge.
55:44
And I I remember for me actually before I started making content and I've I've been making content since I was 18, which was never video based.
55:52
It was just spoken, it was written, it was speeches etc.
55:55
And I would just do it because I loved it.
55:58
I didn't get paid for it. Yeah.
56:00
It didn't It didn't go anywhere.
56:02
It didn't I didn't have any followers. I didn't have any views.
56:03
I was just doing it because I loved it.
56:04
I did it for at least 3 hours a day since I was 18.
56:06
And so when I actually started making videos which was the first time I started putting into digital form, the reason I did that is because I was working a job Yeah.
56:16
and I asked myself two questions and I don't even know where these came from, but they came from I think I used to listen to and and this is real.
56:21
I used to listen to the Steve Jobs Stanford commencement speech over and over again every single day.
56:27
And it's literally only like 15 minutes or whatever it is, but I would listen to it again and again and again.
56:33
And there's so many parts in it where he talks about don't be trapped by dogma. Right.
56:37
Don't be defined by other people's opinions and those started becoming my voice.
56:41
And then I remember asking myself these two questions.
56:44
One was what advice would I give to my younger self? Mhm.
56:46
And the answer to that question was my younger self would have never stopped creating because as a young person I was making I was writing music, I was writing songs, I was doing a lot of spoken word and rap and I was sad that I gave that up. that up.
57:00
up those words as a way of expressing or not that I gave up right actually I never gave up writing, but I gave up sharing myself in a bigger way Yeah. Right.
57:10
expression Yeah, totally.
57:10
And the second thing I asked myself was like what will I regret on my deathbed?
57:13
Like what will I regret when I'm 80 or 90, whatever age I live till.
57:17
And I was like I would have regret that I just accepted that to have a good life I had to continue having a corporate job and that was it.
57:24
And so that was like those two questions just forced me out of that Yeah.
57:29
safety net that I was in. Yep.
57:30
And and that really like pushed me forward.
57:33
So anyone who's listening, just know that I mean Piles a huge inspiration.
57:36
I'm just sharing my own little in my own little way, but you know, it's it's not that it was easy for you.
57:41
And I think I think a lot lot of people may may hear and just be like, oh but you're really smart and you've always been smart and you found your passion.
57:49
It sounds like, you know, you're superwoman.
57:52
Well, I think that's like another important important thing.
57:55
talk about that for a minute. that's funny.
57:56
My husband always like brings this up, you know, he's always like I don't know, I've worked hard my entire life.
58:01
Like I spend my I spend I'm always working. I'm always thinking.
58:04
I'm always trying to learn and I think in in a and I think of play like I mean I it kind of I was just talking about this like I tried to get my work done as quickly as possible and like do it well and I would at even at MIT I'd be like, Pile, you have to get straight A's if you want to continue dancing.
58:20
I put that on myself, okay?
58:22
And I say that in the sense of I felt like I kept having to earn the right to play because look, I also believe like look, like you need to have a good head on your shoulders like to have to do a lot of the stuff I even do now with the art and stuff and not be able to, you know, look, you need to know how to like you have responsibilities, pay your bills, all those things.
58:42
Like if you can't do those things, like you your life might end up going in the wrong direction for other reasons and you might not be able, you know, I love being able to say like, pursue your passion, but I can say that because I took care of a lot of other things.
58:53
And no, none of this was given to me.
58:55
My parents didn't come here with anything.
58:58
I had to, you know, go through and do all my college applications, apply to all the jobs.
59:02
There was nothing ever handed to me.
59:04
I worked for everything in my life and I will continue to even till this day, right? Every opportunity.
59:11
But I I think that's an important thing for people to to know is that and it is possible.
59:15
Like anyone, no matter where you start and come from, can get there, but you have to work hard.
59:19
You need to like continue to learn, you know, be respectful and at the same time play, right?
59:26
But like I said, it's like I got my stuff done and then I was like I'm allowed to play.
59:30
And that's sort of how I kept living my life is like little by little I kept giving myself more of play time cuz I felt like I earned it if that makes sense.
59:38
And honestly like I feel as an artist and even doing saw and all that right now like it's an absolute privilege for me and I I say that cuz I'm like I feel like I've earned this ability to do it but it was through hard work.
59:50
A lot of hard work and that's you know and still like to do anything in your life for quite And if I even want to do something newer or try to I know I'm going to have to do the same exact I know the formula and the and the process to go through but it always starts with hard work.
1:00:02
And I'm so glad you raised that point because I think it's so easy and right now the rhetoric is very much follow your passion and be an entrepreneur and break out and that is all good advice and it's sound but the realistic pragmatic sense Right.
1:00:17
Just Hey, if you don't understand how to run your business then you can chase your passion as much as you want but Right.
1:00:22
you're not going to be able to do it long term.
1:00:24
If you don't figure out the strategic element no matter how sincere you are and how incredible your work is absolutely and I feel like I'm really glad you raised that.
1:00:33
It's like having the tool kit a little of like you know and I I think you know I always think about like what did I learn in my life that got me here?
1:00:40
life that got me here? They're like actual tangible things Yeah, I mean and I've been like just like thinking a little bit about it and I think it does come from like surrounding yourself with great people you know like getting a
1:00:52
good education respecting others like I think it's like putting yourself like good work out there all those things are all a part of it and then like this idea of passion leading a passionate life like like I said I think I had to keep chipping at it like it right? Like I
1:01:06
Like I started in kind of the opposite side very similar to you did and we just kind of had to keep chipping Yeah.
1:01:13
to make it a bigger part of our life and at the same time like I don't know if it was ever like I don't know if you know people always like are like well do you feel like you should have started your company right after college?
1:01:21
Like, no, I don't regret any of my time in corporate America or doing you know, working at in consulting. Yeah.
1:01:28
It's because I think it taught me a lot, too.
1:01:30
And I was while I was there, I would did a good job.
1:01:33
And I learned a lot while I was there.
1:01:34
Like, take every opportunity that comes in front of you.
1:01:38
You know, that you're doing for a reason and do it well at least, right? Or don't do it at all.
1:01:43
And and learn the fact that I mean, I know that the time I spent at Accenture, I learned so much. Right.
1:01:50
And I look back and I'm like, I learned so many things about the future of AI and VR and AR.
1:01:55
And then I focused so much on business and sales and negotiation.
1:01:58
And just just even basic things like turning up on time to meetings. Right.
1:02:03
And and and coming prepared. Right.
1:02:06
And being ready to having to work till midnight if you had to.
1:02:08
All those sorts of things which I think are undervalued because it doesn't feel what you're passionate about.
1:02:14
And even though I wasn't waking up doing what I was passionate about every day, it was exactly what I needed to be able to do what I do now. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah.
1:02:21
No, that's a really powerful message.
1:02:23
I'm glad that I'm glad that you shared that because it's it's often missed.
1:02:26
Okay, I want to talk about one more thing before we end with our final five questions. Okay.
1:02:30
It was you've talked about your passion for art, but you're also very passionate about women and women in business.
1:02:34
And that's something you're a big advocate and ambassador for. Yeah.
1:02:37
Yeah, let's open that up.
1:02:39
Well, I you know, I think so much of the world's spend is by women, right?
1:02:45
Like women are like the largest purchasers.
1:02:46
And and I say that in the sense of I think of the potential of the solutions we still need for things that women, you know, problems that women have in the world and there's a lot.
1:02:58
And I say that in the sense of you can really only really solve problems and going back to what I think entrepreneurship is is stuff you've faced and are really passionate about.
1:03:07
are creating the products that women end up buying.
1:03:09
Sometimes that happens and I think that has been a problem.
1:03:12
And I think like that to me is a huge opportunity, right?
1:03:15
Of like what women can build out there.
1:03:18
And I I see that and I think that's why there's so much potential of what we can all do.
1:03:24
Um you know, the other thing I would say is I think everything in in our lives that makes us unique, whether it is our gender, whether it's our height, um being 4'11, um you know, it's Tiny but mighty. I love it.
1:03:40
Um you know, or you know, I don't know.
1:03:43
I just feel like in every situation you can walk in and people will there's this idea of either people are looking at me with doubts or they're looking at me thinking I'm incredible.
1:03:50
And it's up to you to walk into the room and believe whichever one.
1:03:54
And by the way, like the more you walk in being like I'm incredible, right?
1:03:57
And whatever however you have to set yourself up to walk in the room and believe you're on that that side of it, I just believe it's you're going to be able to accomplish more, you're going to just be more confident, you know, it's it's one of those it's like actually a self-belief thing.
1:04:11
And I I really want women to know like they're not at a disadvantage.
1:04:17
Like I really don't believe I've never felt like I was at a disadvantage.
1:04:20
And I say that in the sense of from a I you know, once again, my mom taught me like if you want to accomplish something in your life, you go and do it.
1:04:28
And of course like there's some stats like we still need to fix like we need we need more women giving money.
1:04:34
Like there is these things that we definitely need to shift in the world, absolutely.
1:04:36
But at the end of the day, I want like I want women to know that they're incredibly exceptional and they're going to build the next like billion-dollar companies because there's billion-dollar problems that we need to solve for women. Yeah, absolutely.
1:04:49
Self-belief is not that everyone would like me, but self-belief is I'll be okay if they don't.
1:04:53
Because I've I've learned to walk in with that presence myself.
1:04:57
It's a great way to put it.
1:04:58
Yeah, I feel like that with if I ever had a daughter, like I think about it through that.
1:05:01
That's the closest I can connect with the challenge on the other side.
1:05:05
And I'm like, if I ever had a daughter, I'd want her to be able to dream of being a founder if that's what she wanted to do. Right.
1:05:12
Because she sees role models in that sense. Right.
1:05:15
And I wanted to dream of being an athlete or whatever she wants to be. Yeah.
1:05:18
Because she sees female role models.
1:05:20
Seeing other people who've done it. Who look like her. Yeah.
1:05:24
Who who act like her, who think like her, who came from the same sorts of backgrounds that she did.
1:05:27
I think and I think what's great right now and I see it all the time is women sharing how they got there and like their entire life.
1:05:35
Like when I started consulting and I would meet some female partners, I didn't know anything about their life.
1:05:40
Like I'm like you know, are you married? Are you not?
1:05:43
Not saying everyone wants to wants that but I'm like are you going to like is that the life I want? Are you happy?
1:05:48
Like any of those things?
1:05:48
Like do you have anything else going on in your life? How do you play?
1:05:51
Any and I couldn't see that and I think what's really amazing and I think like Instagram's been great for this or and even I do this like at work it's like sharing more of my life, you know, with people is important so they realize like yeah, like be you know, be kickass in all that you do but you can also be like a human being and have a family and all those things which I think wasn't always something that we saw. Yeah. Absolutely awesome. So my final five Okay.
1:06:17
The final five minutes, five questions, quick quick questions that I love asking.
1:06:21
So your number one a number one entrepreneur dance collaboration.
1:06:26
Like if you could do it if you could do a dance collaboration with any other entrepreneur, what would it be? Who would it be?
1:06:31
Um well, I want to dance Beyonce and J-Lo.
1:06:33
I I'm like I'm just going to say they're entrepreneurs.
1:06:36
They're both entrepreneurs.
1:06:37
For the sake of this, yeah, exactly.
1:06:39
Yeah, they're both Yeah, they are totally. There we go.
1:06:40
We're putting it out to the universe.
1:06:42
Beyonce and J-Lo, I love it.
1:06:43
There's going to be a collaboration one day. Exactly. I love it.
1:06:48
Uh how do you play apart from dance?
1:06:50
How do I play apart from dance? Oh.
1:06:52
does there need to be another one? Is dance enough for you?
1:06:54
No, I mean I think you know, for me going to classes a huge thing.
1:06:56
I also would like I I love movies.
1:06:58
Like I love going to see movies.
1:07:02
I know, we've gone to see movies together all the time.
1:07:05
Like I don't know, I love seeing like other people's creativity.
1:07:07
Like, that's a great way I play is like, you know, whether it's going to see shows or whatever.
1:07:12
I love being inspired by other people. That's a great answer.
1:07:14
We saw A Star Is Born recently. It was good. Yes, so good. So good.
1:07:17
You shared this beautiful thought around how you know, what keeps us from the greatest secret is a belief.
1:07:30
Uh and I really liked how despite the incredible success of The Secret, you've continued on this journey to continually seek for a deeper secret and the greatest secret, as you call it.
1:07:49
And you say that a belief has been blocking us this whole time from this secret.
1:07:54
Tell us about this belief.
1:07:54
Where does this block of a belief come from?
1:08:01
And how is it created such a stronghold on each and every single one of us?
1:08:06
Well, the belief is that we are separate and that we are individual and that all that we consist of, all that makes us up, is just a body and a mind.
1:08:18
mind. And I think the majority of people would consider that they're a body and a mind and the name that they've been given and the story uh of their life and I was born here and parents did this and I do this for a
1:08:34
living and siblings and the story that we then we identify with and carry around with us and and and those stories, the story, it doesn't matter what the story is, it doesn't matter how fabulous your life has been, it does not compare to who we really are. And so, we have this belief that we are
1:08:55
And so, we have this belief that we are limited basically, in a nutshell, that we're a individual that we're born and that we die.
1:09:05
And and that's kind of it.
1:09:05
And the truth is we're we're so much more than that.
1:09:11
We are certainly having the experience of being an individual, and we're certainly having the experience having a human experience, but ultimately it is not who we are, and we were never born, and we never die.
1:09:25
And we are If I were to sum up everything that we are, it's almost the opposite to everything we strive to be.
1:09:33
So, we are all the intelligence that there is, we are all the beauty that there is, we're all the happiness that there is, we are pure love without any judgment whatsoever.
1:09:45
Um we are complete and utter freedom, which is why freedom means so much to us, why we will fight and struggle to be free.
1:09:55
Uh and so we and and we have total knowing of absolutely everything in the moment of knowing it.
1:10:04
We are infinite and we are eternal.
1:10:04
And that is what is actually experiencing this particular form.
1:10:12
And so we have a belief that we are an individual, that we're separate, that we're born, and that we die.
1:10:19
And our mind reaffirms that over and over and over again through all of its thoughts and with everything we say with every thought and every single thing that we say.
1:10:31
And actually doesn't the world affirm that over and over?
1:10:32
That we're that we're separate.
1:10:35
Um but we are unlimited, we are absolute perfection, and and I'm not talking about the name or the ego.
1:10:45
I'm not talking about that cuz we we all can see what egos can get up to.
1:10:50
You know, they can get they can cause a lot of trouble.
1:10:53
Egos Egos want approval, they want attention, they want to be right all the time, they judge all of the time, and so you know, they're they're not they're not something to to attach ourselves to and to identify with when we are this incredible being that is blissful happiness.
1:11:13
And so um And so we can have a life where we are a living as an individual human having a an individual human experience but from the perspective of the infinite being that we are in which case we will never be touched by negativity no matter what happens and we will remain in lasting happiness no matter what.
1:11:45
And it is and this has been my journey really from the secret to to now um and I was searching seven days a week.
1:11:54
I was Jay, I'm just like I was just like one of those crazy people.
1:11:59
I'm like if this there is this law that governs our mind, then there is definitely way way more to discover.
1:12:06
And so I just searched and searched in religions and spiritual traditions and read thousands of books and it wasn't till 2016 that I had this experience where I realized who we are and I was like, why haven't I seen this? Why what is it?
1:12:25
How could I have missed this?
1:12:27
And uh and from that moment of realizing that, there was this happiness that arose inside of me and then with everything that I did from 216 to 220 that happiness just became deeper and deeper and and then I would just notice things like that person, you know, when they would do something or other, they used to bother me a lot.
1:12:51
They don't bother me anymore.
1:12:53
And how was I ever bothered by that?
1:12:55
And that particular subject doesn't bother me anymore.
1:12:58
And so I was just finding that I wasn't reacting to life.
1:13:02
I my the reactions were all dissolving.
1:13:06
I didn't judgment was dissolving.
1:13:09
I was just whatever was happening I'm like it's fine. It'll be okay.
1:13:15
And and so with letting go of all of those things including the belief that we're a limited being. Um we become free. Really truly free.
1:13:27
And then we will live a life that's described as heaven on earth or nirvana.
1:13:32
Um a life where we know we don't die. And the body ends sure.
1:13:35
But but who we are does not. And so yeah.
1:13:42
That's been That's been my journey. That's been my journey.
1:13:46
Well well it's beautiful hearing you because I was very fortunate enough to at least learn about that intellectually when I was 18 and I first met the monks that I lived with.
1:14:01
And then when I went and lived as a monk for 3 years in India and across Europe when I was 22 to 25 the text that we studied uh whether it was the Vedas or the Gita introduced me to that at least intellectually.
1:14:16
And I say at least intellectually because I believe that a lot of these ideas begin at intellect before they truly become realized.
1:14:23
Yeah, you're absolutely right.
1:14:26
And um and I think in 216 you know it was it was and it was a realization of who I am but had was I completely living that? No.
1:14:36
I remember thinking, "Oh my gosh, I've lost it."
1:14:41
Now you know, I I had it and now I've lost it.
1:14:44
And of course you can't lose it because it's who you are.
1:14:47
You know, but you've got to go you've kind of got to go on this a bit of a journey. You don't have to.
1:14:54
There are some people that Oh gosh, they will just hear it and that's it. They will live it.
1:14:58
They will live like that for the rest of their life. Yes.
1:15:02
And they they are just enjoy.
1:15:05
And I've had some letters from from some people that that has happened to.
1:15:11
For me, it was more of a journey and uh uh but uh wow, when you just in it definitely intellectually is the beginning and there's nothing wrong with that at all.
1:15:25
Because that's where the right that's where you start.
1:15:30
And then and then it's sort of the diligence to keep noticing um who you are, noticing awareness, you know, noticing uh asking yourself am I aware is, you know, one one way one way to begin. Am I aware?
1:15:49
And even in the secret I talk about that.
1:15:51
You know, remember to remember that you're aware and to be aware.
1:15:56
And so if you just keep coming back to noticing who you are.
1:15:59
It's so interesting because when you notice who you are, you feel this absolute relief travel all through your body which means prior to that you were tense.
1:16:10
You were holding on to life, you know, the kind of white knuckle and everything.
1:16:16
And so um I mean I just Oh my gosh, it's just like this incredible thing that we have that we have and and and then, you know, and then you look out and you see people suffering and and that part's, you know, really challenging because you you you want to help everybody and so so that they don't suffer anymore.
1:16:38
And I I with my I remember with my teacher really early on and I'd be like, "Oh, I've lost it. I've lost it."
1:16:46
And and and why don't I have it all of the time?
1:16:50
And she said it she would say, "Oh, because you haven't suffered enough."
1:16:54
Is what she would say to me.
1:16:56
You need to suffer some more, you know?
1:16:58
And then and then you really really really it's going to be more to you than anything else in in life.
1:17:03
And uh Yeah, it's it's it's a wonderful thing.
1:17:09
But oh my gosh, in your 20s, Jay, heaven.
1:17:11
I remember learning that definition which you described so beautifully of Satchitananda.
1:17:17
And the idea that we are full of knowledge, eternal, and full of bliss.
1:17:23
And I I remember one of the ways we were trained to understand that is we had no mirrors in the ashram.
1:17:30
And without a mirror, you lost conception of your physical self because you no longer could check how you looked.
1:17:38
And the other one was I remember when I first started I would and I know you used the beautiful word awareness in The Greatest Secret.
1:17:45
I remember I used to write on a little post-it note.
1:17:47
When I'd wake up in the morning, I'd have it next to my bedside table.
1:17:50
And then on the by the place where I brush my teeth that I am awareness. Oh, why did you really?
1:17:58
Oh my gosh, that's beautiful.
1:17:59
Oh my Yeah, to remind myself to remind myself in the morning to wake up with the understanding that I'm not this body. Oh, brilliant. That is brilliant. People should do that. People should do that.
1:18:11
I mean, that is absolutely fantastic. Yeah, I am awareness.
1:18:16
Because the moment that you say it like our mind can't comprehend awareness.
1:18:21
It can't It can't comprehend it.
1:18:23
The mind is sitting in awareness.
1:18:25
And so and so the really beautiful thing is is that saying something like I am awareness or am I aware, the mind just goes quiet.
1:18:33
You know, just really quickly.
1:18:35
And one when the mind's quiet, then all that there is is awareness or consciousness or whatever the word doesn't matter.
1:18:43
You know, I tried to choose the word that I felt was the simplest that people could kind of understand.
1:18:52
But the moment the mind drops there there is awareness.
1:18:56
And so and so I love that I am aware. Love it. Oh, thank you.
1:19:02
Yeah, it was you know, it's that's why when I was reading your book and I hope you can tell like when I was reading your book, I felt so happy uh because when you were sharing this was the greatest secret, I I couldn't agree with you more.
1:19:16
I I I don't think there is is a deeper secret the beginning of knowledge.
1:19:19
And we were always we were always told that this is the first lesson you will learn and and the one that will take you a whole life to live like to actually practice.
1:19:30
Uh and and and and so when I was reading the book, I was just it was so beautiful for me because I I could totally see how much you care for people and and for what journey you want them to take.
1:19:43
But isn't it fascinating that we almost and you said something really beautiful and you talk about in the book about how actually we are free and we have complete freedom. But we limit ourselves.
1:19:56
But isn't it fascinating that we think that the body and mind keep us safe.
1:20:04
So like the very things that are actually keeping us imprisoned, we think that they are our safety. Totally.
1:20:08
And don't you think you know, also with what's happened in the last year that that we had this idea or or most people have this idea that they work really really hard to get safety and security.
1:20:25
You know, to accrue things and to have money in the bank and to have a house and all of those all of those things to have safety and security.
1:20:34
And this world event that came along shook that and actually showed everybody what is the truth.
1:20:43
And that is that we will never find safety and security in the world.
1:20:46
And the reason we won't is it's always changing. Always changing.
1:20:53
But we are the only safety and security in existence. We're it.
1:21:03
We're trying to get on the outside what we are on the inside.
1:21:06
And that is not to say to to enjoy this incredible world.
1:21:09
I mean, this is a miracle.
1:21:13
This is miraculous this this experience of this world.
1:21:18
And it is here for us to enjoy in every way that each person wants to enjoy it.
1:21:25
But to know who we are to to instead of spending a whole life trying to fill ourselves from the outside world, which will never ever work, is to spend just a little bit of time on the inside like waking up to I am awareness and or asking am I aware?
1:21:49
And one of the things that I found that was really fantastic and there are so many incredible practices and I'm sure oh my gosh, you would have done so many fabulous ones.
1:22:03
I would love to hear about them.
1:22:06
Um one of the things that all of the things in The Greatest Secret all of the things that I did and the teachers that are in The Greatest Secret were my journey all of them from The Secret through to now.
1:22:18
Every single one of them changed my life in in one way or another.
1:22:22
Some I followed for a couple of years and um and some for a month and but all of those teachers played a really, really big part in my life.
1:22:33
And so the practice in The Greatest Secret that had the greatest effect on me and that I would say for anybody is the best thing you can ever, ever, ever do.
1:22:46
And that is to never resist negative emotions.
1:22:51
And instead to do the exact opposite, which is what we have not been taught to do, which is the opposite to resistance is to welcome.
1:23:01
So, resist is push away and welcome is to pull in. Embrace, yeah. Embrace. Exactly. Exactly.
1:23:09
And to embrace those negative emotions because the most incredible thing happens when we do embrace them, when we allow them to be there, when we don't try and change them, when we don't try and when we don't want to make them go or or or do anything but just allow them to be there, they just evaporate. They just evaporate.
1:23:32
And the more that you do it, the faster they evaporate cuz when I started, I would feel a strong emotion and it would maybe last 30 seconds, 45 seconds or something like that and then gradually, gradually ebb away.
1:23:45
But the more that I welcome, the weaker they get.
1:23:47
Each time you welcome a negative emotion, it just gets weaker, weaker, weaker, weaker until you don't have a trace of that negative emotion in the body at all anymore.
1:23:57
And when you don't have a trace of it, you're never going to feel it.
1:24:00
Explain to us, as you do in the book, what does it mean to truly embrace and welcome a negative feeling?
1:24:08
What does that mean in practice?
1:24:08
Because I I couldn't agree with you more.
1:24:10
And just to help people as they're listening and watching, they're thinking, "You know what?
1:24:15
I just right now, I'm just there's so much negativity in the world. I'm watching the news.
1:24:18
I'm stressed out about this. My kids are at home.
1:24:20
I'm having to home school.
1:24:22
How do they welcome that?
1:24:24
And and I agree with you, we we resist completely.
1:24:26
We don't want to feel negative.
1:24:28
We don't want to cuz it's it's not pleasant, you know, feeling negative feelings.
1:24:32
So, and so when you when you feel a negative feeling arising you notice the feeling, don't focus into the feeling because if you focus into it, you'll just make it stronger.
1:24:43
The mind is really powerful.
1:24:44
So, don't focus into it, but notice the feeling.
1:24:47
And so and just welcome it.
1:24:50
So, it's almost like you could imagine just putting your arms out like this, arms out to the side of you and just allowing the feeling which is simply energy, that's all it is, that even fear is just energy and just allowing it to pass on through.
1:25:10
One thing that I did was I would imagine putting my arms around and embracing the feeling and and pulling the feeling in close to me.
1:25:21
And I just found that that was amazing for me.
1:25:24
I think people can try all kinds of different things.
1:25:28
Like I just imagine that that feeling was one of my oldest, dearest friends that I love so much that I hadn't seen in decades and they arrived at my door.
1:25:40
And I was just like could not get my arms around them fast enough.
1:25:42
And that is what I imagine with each of the feelings.
1:25:47
And I mean at at one point in my life, I did that with depression.
1:25:53
And so I wrapped and that's really how I learned how powerful this practice is because when I wrapped my arms around the depression, it just dissolved.
1:26:06
And and the relief I mean the relief that you feel when a negative feeling dissolves is so good.
1:26:15
It's worth every It's like a high.
1:26:15
And the And the reason it's like a high is because when you dissolve the feeling, there's you underneath. And who you really are.
1:26:25
And so, you get a flash of who you really are, this kind of joy and happiness.
1:26:32
And so, yeah, that's what I did.
1:26:32
I would embrace the feeling and hold it in without focusing on it.
1:26:38
Notice it, but don't focus into the feeling.
1:26:40
And And just let it dissolve.
1:26:43
And I promise, the next time you feel that feeling, it will never be as strong when you do it.
1:26:49
And so, you do the same thing the next time that feeling arises.
1:26:56
And then the time after that, it's going to be weaker.
1:26:58
It just gets weaker and weaker and weaker until you get to a point where you're like, "I can't remember the last time that I got angry." I just can't remember.
1:27:08
When did I ever get angry?
1:27:12
You know, you're just all agitated or impatient or And so, you do it with every feeling.
1:27:17
So, So, my to give people a really good guide, I would say that unless you're feeling really happy, joyously happy, welling up inside of you, you have a negative feeling. Pretty good.
1:27:33
You don't need to know what the name of it is to welcome it. You just welcome it.
1:27:37
You It doesn't matter about its name.
1:27:39
Doesn't matter what it is.
1:27:41
Just welcome the feeling or embrace the feeling or allow the feeling to be there.
1:27:46
And then you will begin to dissolve dissolve these negative feelings that are actually masking who you are.
1:27:52
The more you dissolve them, the greater the happiness that arises within you.
1:27:57
Thank you so much for watching that video.
1:27:59
If you enjoyed it, here's another one I think you'll love.
1:28:02
You'll get to where you want in life, just not in the way you imagined.
1:28:06
And that's because the path that's paved up and down is far different to the path we paved.