all right everybody Welcome to the world's greatest podcast with me again today the world's number one podcast yes the world's number one podcast we we came in eth last week I think for those of you looking at the iTunes rankings which is absurd we've only got to beat number eight across all of Apple something like that yeah whatever their
top episodes are on the weekends well that means we crushed on Spotify then probably yeah I would guess um I don't I don't know all the rankings but and and I guess on YouTube we got labeled with some Co thing I mean what is going on at YouTube a joke like literally you're labeling Co at this point I mean what a joke oh my
Lord so I guess we have to at the top of the show talk about the uh fundraiser and I guess this like Veno Costa came in hot this week and attacked the besties let's play the clip what is your sense of the shifting winds in the valley around politics I think for a very long time the valley was seen as sort of a liberal
Bastion uh but you know if you listen to Elon Musk or you listen to uh all-in podcast and and and that gang and others it seems to be shifting potentially towards former president Trump is that just a small pocket or do you think that that's a a real shift in terms of the way uh the valley is thinking politically the first thing I would say
is all in podcast and some of the supporters there are not based in the valley I I would say there's a bunch of MAA extremists in every part of society and uh I hope we can prevent them from destroying democracy which is probably the most important issue we face all right so um why are you destroying democracy now that's a good bit J that's
good let your winners ride Rainman David and instead we open source it to the fans and they've just gone crazy with it love Queen all right David fno was at the conference he got a little chippy here maybe he got a little bit out of line who's a little bit out of line what's your take a little bit a little bit a
little bit well first of all venod should realize we're not magga extremist or extremist of any sort because he's at all in Summit last year he was great yeah we liked what he to say and I certainly don't dispute his expertise and and track record in Tech but in addition to that then he's saying that we're not based in Silicon
Valley we're not from Silicon Valley we've all been here for decades and then he doubled down on that in a tweet so that's a bizarre statement maybe he thinks he gets to Define people in or out of Silicon Valley I don't really understand it but to be Frank this is one of a series of statements that he's made recently that I can only call
insulting and childish first he had this tweet that he said that Trump supporters were lacking in empathy and caring then he had another tweet where he said that Trump supporters weren't teaching good values to their kids this caused Shawn McGuire who's a partner of seoa to quote tweet him saying that I think that I'd
rather raise my kids to grow up to take after aanka Trump than Hunter Biden yeah and that got like something like 20,000 likes and it was one of those br ratios I've ever seen on a tweet so in any event I mean this is just one in a series of of pars and tweets and look I think you can take whatever position you want on a political candidate I can
understand if he doesn't like Trump a lot of people don't he's raising money for Biden that's fine doesn't bother me at all he just had a fundraiser like two weeks ago or something right exactly that's not an issue at all but what I do take offense at is labeling millions and millions of ordinary Americans as
somehow lacking in empathy lacking in caring not being good parents because you don't like their support for Trump yeah and I think that that that is a statement that frankly reeks of being cocooned in an elite bubble for way too long and let me just explain if you look at where Trump's support is strongest it's really in Middle America and sort
of the heartland of America of what in between the elite States basically the part America that Coastal at least dismissively refer to as flyover country sure and it's a lot of the industrial Midwest and frankly that part of the country has had not had the same type of economic experience that we've had in silen valley of course they have not
been beneficiaries of globalization or equities you know and they're they're in the working class and the working class in the factories got gutted yeah that's well yeah look if you're in one of the handful of export Industries in America and I'm talking about if you're in Hollywood or you're in big Finance or
you're in software then globalization has been great for you because it has created huge Global markets for our products however if you're in an industry that has to compete with global exports then it's been very bad with you and blueco collar workers have been hurt Labor's been hurt people who work with
their hands have been hurt they have not benefited in the same way from the system we've had in this country for the last 30 years so you can understand why they would not be so enchanted with Elite thinking of course and I think to to then label those people as lacking in caring or empathy or not being good parents because they haven't had they
haven't had the same economic ride that you've had for the last 30 years and then you it's a blind spot you are the one who is fighting a legal battle to kick some of those people the public the surf be kick the public off of the public beach in front of your beach house and then you're saying they're the
ones lacking in empathy dude look in the mirror yeah I mean listen the great irony of this is as you know the Democrats were supposed to be the the party of the working people and Biden was supposed to be the Pinnacle of that like fighting for unions Fighting For the Working person and and so they've just lost that whole thing and I'll say
like I it feels like a lot of people are tilted because they defeated Trump and now he's back and so that tilts a lot of people like there was a lot of effort a lot of energy and a a feeling of success that Trump was ousted and the fact that the guy is now the front runner to be president again can be very tilting after feeling like you've already won
the battle and guess what it's back I will also defend venod real quick I I'll say having known venod for a long time he's an investor with me he's a guy I've come to appreciate and and think highly of we had him at the summit he was great at the summit he was great the awesome if you listen to his thing he said the
listeners of the Pod and then he said Maga extremist so they're not based in Silicon Valley I think he was referencing that the listeners of the Pod are not based in Silicon Valley and they are mag didn't yeah I couldn't hear I think what he meant to say was and some of the supporters there are not based in Silicon Valley meaning like the
supporters chth your thoughts on vote's comments yeah I think vote's comments are a microcosm of something that's a little bit bigger than just him and I think is roughly emblematic of the mainstream media which is I think the four of us have found over the course of these last four years doing the podcast a rhythm where there's
a whole diversity of views we've always respected each other we've learned from each other and each of us have taken turns expressing something that the others have ended up converging on that's not a holistic statement on every issue but it has it has happened and that's a an incredible example of how you should figure things out from first
principles especially things that matter and I think this is the first time and you know look David said this a few years ago he said sax did that the course of Elections will be driven by podcasts and I didn't give that a full enough waiting at the moment when he said it but I think what I'm realizing is it's
not necessarily just that podcast will frame elections but it's the counterfactual which is that it fills a vacuum and I think what you're seeing right now are the reactions of people that have thrived in what used to work which was a traditional media infrastructure that would shape how people were supposed to think but then
all of a sudden if you can have a platform like this where people just talk from first principles respectfully and then the chips are going to be what it is and you know people will come to their own conclusions I think that that's what people are reacting to so I think what venot is reacting to is this sort of discomfort where you see four reasonable
intelligent people all of a sudden talk open-mindedly about what's happening in the presidential election and what you leave out is the planted Orthodoxy of what you're supposed to think and that's disconcerting to him it's dis disconcerting and confusing maybe to sorin who I think is a wonderful reporter and a thinker it's
disconcerting Jason to every single media Outlet over the last week that's breathlessly been trying to get me or saxs to have an opinion on this and the reason I've deleted all of these emails is they don't get a chance to frame what we think you can listen to the podcast and know what we think this is the future of
how smart reasonable moderate people should make decisions it is an example talking to somebody you disagree with does not make your opinion bastardized it actually makes your opinion valuable there are these simple truths to living a productive life that if you want to embrace you need to find friends that you can trust even on
issues when you disagree you can hear them out so that's what's happening right now and I think that that's why we all need to sort of stand together and lock in arms and just keep moving forward this is something really important here that's happening and I think that's why the media and these opinion makers are losing their minds
freeberg your thoughts on this you're friends with venod as you mentioned and you've always said to me and in our personal discussions that the reason you do this PO is because you really want to set an example of how to have great conversations and learn from each other and and the tone of what we do here so your thoughts on this the unfortunate
reality in a voting system an election cycle like we're in venod went and did a fundraiser it's public that he did a fundraiser for Biden a few weeks ago and he wants to win the election he wants to make his horse win there's a lot reasons why I'm sure venod has chosen that person to be his horse and so when you
get on the playing field you got two teams and only one team wins so you know everyone pulls out all the stops to win one of the things that is done is unfortunate and it over time causes an erosion and a hardening into a kind of polarity between all people which is that you call the other side wrong or bad or extreme the term that he used
which really I think personifies the problem is he said they're listeners are they're Maga extremists extremist being the word right mag means make America great again which I think everybody wants to make America great again right whatever the the the extremism phrase is used by both parties to describe the points of view
of the other side and what I think is lacking is a reshi of the perspective to say their views are valid I acknowledge their views I hear them I know why they feel that way I'm understanding where that group of people are coming from and to have that acknowledgement unfortunately softens and weakens your position and ability to go out and win
an election and so both sides Harden themselves and use terms like this to try and discredit the other side so it's unfortunate to see I think we all understand where someone who's trying to win a battle on the field is coming from when they're trying to do this but I do think that what is deeply lacking in the
erosion that's Arisen is because we can't say I hear you I see the problems I I recognize you as people just like us you have kids you have families and you have a different point of view on the policies that will work and the individual that will realize those policies I also think it's important to make sure that we reiterate again at the
sake of being pedantic the facts which is this is a nonpartisan show and it is a platform that has showcased and given time to Democrats and Republicans and independents yeah and they've all taken us up on it so that thought by venod is at incomplete and more appropriately just stupid and factually wrong that's a good
point Larry summer spoke at the same conference that the not Larry Summers Dean Phillips Bobby Kennedy Chris Christie I mean this is a spectrum of people that we are bringing on again Cheryl s you can hear from them Jared Kushner you can hear from them in an unfiltered way and come to your own conclusion that's why we were number
eight last week that's the exact reason reason why and I think that that's very scary because instead of power Brokers being able to filter an opinion you now have an opportunity to just hear it for yourself discuss it amongst your friends and come to your own conclusion so we have always been bipartisan here and we
will continue to be bipartisan the second thing is and I just want to say this again I have asked the White House for President Biden to come on the show oh come on the show please yeah yeah we've offered the exact same thing we are just we are just waiting people really want me to be friends with you guys they want me to end my friendship
with youat they want me to end my friendship with you saak like like and these are people who are are mutuals I just want to say and I want to just tell them all equally to go [ __ ] themselves here you can bleep out the f word like I I'm not picking my friends based on their political parties or their leanings or who they're supporting for
president the way I look at this saxs is at this point we're all Americans we're in this together America survive survived Trump's presidency America's going to survive Biden's presidency the Democratic process it is very messy everybody gets to have a voice and let's just pause for a second here and open up the aperture let's be thankful that
everybody gets to have a say let's keep it from getting personal half the humans on this planet Earth do not have a voice the one thing that's trending in the wrong direction globally is people living in a democracy it's the one thing not getting better we have a lot of work to do in this country we have to respect
each other like we try to do here on this podcast and we have to talk about the important issues we all agree the budget's out of control we all agree the education system sucks we live in a multi-polar world we have to figure that out when we should go to war when we shouldn't when we need to stay out of things these are complicated issues and
name calling and this presidency is not as important as tackling these issues Together As Americans I hope everybody can keep that in mind so let's debate this may the best candidate win and then let's move on and let's solve some problems here okay and it it's getting very personal yeah well said really well
said I know I'm really hurt by this because I tell you personally it's very hurtful to me because I value our friendships and they're picking on the wrong guy cuz you're the most loyal guy and so it's kind of like it's going to be the least effective because well you still care what they think Jal that's the problem so they can get to you no
you can ask me if I do that don't tell me what I think sax you can ask me okay I actually care about the two of you bicker like brothers it's no we do but I know I just have to retrain Sachs that he can't tell me what I think okay yeah no because you do that you put words in my mouth for all listeners they just
want you go to know they've been bickering like this for 20 years so it's it happens even worse offline when we're not on the show unb nonstop you're ruining it JC you're just ruining it right now here's the thing I respect you know all of my friends and I I like having a diversity of opinions that makes life more interesting for me and
then to tell me I can't be friends with this person that person the way I grew up my dad had a Bar Hell's Angels cops firefighters just everybody was allowed to come and hang out at the bar like we're here we're having a discourse everybody's welcome for a seat at the table lgbtq were they all of them the
entire rainbow what people haven't figured out yet is that cancel culture is over virtue signaling is over absolutely Dei is over off Trend not on Trend and the people who are still Tweeting these blanket statements and they're trying to demonize the entire other side with unfactual unfounded pot shots are just making fools of
themselves and you can see that in the you can see that in the reaction on X all right let's move on and we have some breaking news year oh no just to put things on a happier note what happened did Uber get BFF by Tesla just launched the Tesla Mescal oh breaking news story hold on it's a breaking news story Tesla has launched mecal in that beautiful
lightning bottle I just ordered my bottle of this like two seconds ago while we were doing the show uh oh and because this sold out in like two hours before and now the B the bottles of the original Tesla tequila go for like $2,000 now on eBay so get yours get yours now if it's still Smokey mcow there you go wait a second
is this going to compete with the all in bit uh well it'll be all sold out by the time we launch our ball we're both gonna be sold out we're both gonna be sold out like everybody can see that everybody can win it's not a zero sum game everybody can secure the bag all right let's get into the docket enough with the self referential we're all
influencers now did you guys see my deck this month we're all influencers we're all influencers absolutely absolutely there's a lot of Federal Regulation going on around AI as we know a regulatory capture shout out to our guy Bill Gurley who did a great talk last year about this on Wednesday the New York Times reported that the doj and the
FTC had struck a deal on how to go after AI incumbents here's the terms of the deal and again this is all Breaking the doj gets to investigate whether Nvidia violated Anti-Trust laws they didn't specify what they're going after here but it could include the Nvidia use of Cuda software to lock customers into
using their gpus or maybe how Nvidia distributes their gpus to customers there's a lot of Regulation around that and the FTC takes the lead on looking into open ai's conduct and Microsoft's AI deals obviously there's been a ton of those including Aqua hires Etc and then just this morning the Wall Street Journal reported that the FTC had opened
a probe into Microsoft's deal with inflection AI That's the one if you're remember where they bought the staff and then did some faka crazy Commerce deal where they gave them a bunch of money I guess to bail out the investors and that one is as conflicted up and down as you could possibly imagine they know
Microsoft structured that deal in a way that could avoid regulatory scy you heard that here first actually we we talked about this concept of a shadow Aqua hire on this very program when we saw it because we'd never seen a deal like that it had includes that $650 million licensing fee all right there's tons of other angles here but let's
start with you chth what are your thoughts on this regulatory capture in nvidia's Ascension for those of you not watching it's almost become the largest market cap company in Tech actually today Nvidia passed Apple for a moment in time so this is pretty crazy what we've seen with Nvidia and here we go regulatory capture coming in hot jamaath
your thoughts I have two thoughts they're sort of mixed emotions the first is I think the doj and the FDC are totally way out of their ski tips on this this is a totally nent industry we don't have any good examples of end user use cases either in the Enterprise or amongst consumers we only have 18 months of spend history it is
true that we've spent probably 750 billion to a trillion dollars collectively now yep on things with the AI label but it is also true that that's probably generated less than 10 billion doar of Revenue so I don't see what they're exactly investigating in an ex ex immature Market where we haven't yet seen one cycle of boom and bust so that we know
what we're actually dealing with so it's way too premature and it's just people afraid and tilting at windmills the second part the part that's mixed though is we are seeing a clever form of deal making that these huge hyperscalers are doing to work around the traditional constraints that you've had on
businesses Jason you and I worked at AOL in a moment where AOL paid a very dear cost for essentially roundt tripping Revenue yep Microsoft had to go through a huge doj inquiry and a settlement decree and they were in The Penalty Box for most of Steve bomber's tenure as a CEO a l decade yeah and the handcuffs came off when Satya took over that
business so I think what I'm trying to say is folks have become extremely sophisticated at replacing round tripping with these complicated Tac 2.0 whatever you want to call it credit oriented deals they'll Finance you to buy their own chips all of this stuff has to be scrutinized a little bit more so that part I support but all of a
sudden launching an antitrust investigation makes no sense so I really think the inquiry should be coming from the SEC about is this real Revenue that's actually the key issue and and this goes to chath what we talked about like let's if we're going to police something tactics make sense not fut competition which has been Lena Khan's
sort of approach to this and she's only going to be in the position for another couple months the the election goes the way it's going so this might all be mood freeberg I want to get your thoughts on this we had that great talk 2851 miles from from Bill and Regulatory capture at the summit you can uh look it would be
in the show notes if you haven't seen it it's great talk Freer your thoughts on this I I don't know what regulatory capture in video are you talking about regulatory Capt of Nvidia just regulatory capture in the framing of AI is it too early hey we're like in the we're not even in the first inning here and already we're going to start
investigating everybody and it just seems pretty one of the silly aspects is they just passed this law in California new some warns against Perils of over regulating AI oh good Governor New warned on Wednesday against stifling the burgeoning AI sector I mean new is well informed by the tech community so sure I
I don't think he and he's also an intelligent person so I don't think he'd kind of you know fall quickly in line on this one but the way that the statutes were written is there's a definition on the size of a model which in and of itself is very quickly changing as we know we've seen recently significant reductions in model size that actually
improve performance overall of the model for specific applications and it's very likely we end up seeing a lot of more smaller targeted models being used in spe specific applications instead of one massive general purpose model being used or networks of smaller models which is what really where I think the industry
is going and if that's where things go then this the statute doesn't even matter it it makes no sense anymore and that shows you I think how quickly things are changing they go and they get quote experts opinions in a couple of months those experts come back they're like here's the size of a model that you need to be regulating and then the
legislators run and they write the the code they pass the statute and all of a sudden it doesn't even make sense anymore so yes I don't think we really know where this technolog is all falling out at this point and I think it's very difficult to have the government kind of reach in too quickly to try and identify
what they should and shouldn't be allowing to happen from a free market perspective your thoughts David Sachs especially in light of the fact that it's looking like we're we're going to have some regime change in Washington and the FTC is going to gonna going to turn over obviously if that happens well look I agree with you guys that this is
just too soon to be opening these inves ations it's true that open Ai and Nvidia have leads in their respective markets but that's all it is at this point it's way too early in the development of these markets to say that these are clearly monopolis there's still a lot of competition going on if a few years from now Nvidia still has whatever 85 90%
market share and no one's even close to catching up then maybe you consider at a monopolis same thing with open AI but it just seems very early to be rushing into investigations of these companies I mean the AI Market is what 18 months old two two years old maybe at most I'd say two is a good way to look at it you sure
yeah so it's just very early to be doing this look I think this is of a piece with remember that executive order or whatever that you remember when the White House issued that 100 Page Plus executive order on AI regulation we covered it on the show and we also thought that was too soon and we thought that if the internet had been regulated
in that way in you know circuit 1995 or 1997 it never would have blossomed the way that it did you know you want to give these markets some time to play out before you bring the down the heavy hand of regulation on them so it just seems to me like the administration is getting carried away here with this desire to
regulate this new space and I mean frankly it's of a piece with you I I would say an innovation hostile agenda you also have the attacks on crypto you just had buying veto a bill that would have finally given crypto a regulatory framework in the US it passed with 60 votes in the Senate including Democrats like Chuck Schumer and it still wasn't
good enough and oh and it was based on a framework I think that came from the SEC yeah but Biden is basically in the Elizabeth Warren camp that he's going to give no quarter to crypto so you've got hostility to AI you've got hostility to crypto you've got hostility to m&a no one can get m&a deal through right now
you put all these things together plus you've got hostility to options as compensation in terms of the 25% unrealized gains tax you add up all these things and again I think this is an agenda that does not benefit Silicon Valley at all well and if you want to understand why people are coming to your fundraiser tonight if you put all this
together it doesn't take a genius to figure out that if you're a venture capitalist or an entrepreneur and you want to see m&a and you want to see entrepreneurship and you want to see your companies Thrive you want to see your employees get rich and have options Biden is basically handing the election to Trump it's like he's doing everything
he can to basically alienate Silicon Valley so and capitalism and you're exactly right and Innovation I wouldn't even say it's Silicon Valley it's like if you're going to go and build things that are at the bleeding edge yeah you know the government used to be the the most critical supporter of that right if
you think about space or defense these are areas the internet itself the government was the partner of Private Industry to make sure that there was no regulation and that like really really looking Innovation could happen that's should be their role and this speaks to this Dell versus acceleration movement that we see here in Silicon Valley and
this is what we see in Texas Florida UAE Riad DOA there are places in the world Singapore where people are accelerating Innovation and this is what humans want not just entrepreneurs not just venture Capital all of us want to see an acceleration of innovation everybody wants to see prosperity and if you put
yourself up as the Dell candidate we're not going to allow m&a we're going to screw with options we're going to do all this stuff people just not going to vote for you and people want crypto legal so take the memo I mean this I mean the fact that the Democrats can't field a candidate that aligns with the what Humanity wants is absolutely
mindboggling this is why I think Biden's getting hot swapped this month you heard it your first he's got no Gavin is going to be running for president it's going to be Trump and Gavin they are hop swapping Biden after this first debate Biden is going to get demolished by Trump of the debate it's going to be elder abuse he's getting
wiped out and hot swapped you heard it here first well there's a lot of lot of conspiracy theorists online who agree with you a lot of TI hat speculation that he's gonna get Switcheroo hot swap but look I mean I think you make the correct point which is you know I didn't really think about it this way but you're right Biden is the Del candidate
and nobody wants that also Trump has shown a learning curve where he recently has been saying positive things about crypto Y and he's always I think been more Pro economic growth he was a real estate developer from the private sector he actually understands the economy so there's no question that he
would be more pro-innovation much more Pro Innovation than Biden and to your point about this is one of the reasons why people are coming to the fundraiser I had someone from the campaign said something very interesting to me she said that we've never seen this many new donors yes at an event before so we're turning out the new donors for
this reason yes and you know we're not going to be intimidated by people calling us names you know it's like look in any normal election people in an industry would vote for the candidate who they see as most aligned yes with what is good for them their families their industry if you made a list let's just make the list here right now now
make the list of things Trump is in support of right and Republicans are in support of right now they're going to be proa they're going to be Pro crypto they're going to be Pro less taxes they're going to be Pro Law and Order you know what that's where I align those are the things I want so if you just list the issues for me despite how I
might feel about Trump and some of the things he's done he checks off all my boxes he checks off all my boxes and I think that's what's happening here and you know people were scared to come out and say this person backs off all my boxes the Democrats need to realize they're out of sync with America they're
out of sync with powerful people in America especially the donor base they're the Del Cel candidate party now and they just have to flip this thinking they're going to get demolished it is going to be a landslide at this point people want jobs and prosperity from your lips to God's ears do the hot swap I mean I don't really have a lot more to
say I I think a great point take the win I mean and and crypto is such an obvious win and you know what Trump's anti- right now he's been wailing on EVS I guarantee you that's the next thing I bet you next week he comes out next week within the next two weeks here's my prediction Trump says you know what eeve
is not so bad remember he's been saying EVS nobody wants these things we're subsidizing I bet you next week or maybe in 30 days I'm making a prediction here you Bank the prediction in 30 days Trump comes out magically in support of EVS well I think that his point is I he shouldn't be forced to by EVS I mean I don't I don't think he's against them
per se I think he's against people being forced look I think that what the new Administration hopefully or what Trump should propose is effectively a modus vendi with big Tech where the point is that if you stop censoring our people if you stop censoring conservatives if you restore the civil liberties of the
average American to say what they want online to basically Bank online to stop essentially deplatforming and censoring people then we will let you innovate we'll let you do m&a we'll let you get back to business that basically is the basis for a peace agreement between big Tech and the Republican party yeah and by the way I'd say in the
next 30 to 60 days you're going to see 10 incredibly high-profile people come out and support of trump if Biden isn't swapped out and when I say high-profile I have the inside line on this extremely high-profile people not just Doug Leone not just David Saxon cha it is is going to be about 10 high-profile people who
are much higher profile respectfully than jamath and Sachs and Doug Leone so just wait for it folks uh you cannot be a deist in you know this world let's keep moving roaring kitty aka Keith Gil just disclosed a NF figure position in GameStop yes we're back to where this podcast started we're talking about GameStop and SS as crazy as it is and a
ER trade is considering suspending his account this is going to take a little bit of background I apologize here I don't to deplatforming him here we go again quick background you remember the first basically viral moment for this podcast this AI moment I remember I was in Taho skiing was the GameStop Saga back in 2021 thousands of retail investors
following this individual Keith gild were posting in this subreddit called Wall Street bets if you're not familiar and they created a massive short squeeze and they sent the stock flying Robin Hood halted the trading remember Vlad came on that went all went crazy uh we covered that all and then Keith Gil went silent for the past three
years on Twitter and Reddit he said nothing then on May 12th he posted this meme on X which has been viewed 28 million times now if you don't know this meme this is the lean forward meme when you got a game controller in your hand it is a way to Signal like Hey we're getting to the boss level it's going to
get exciting here's your GameStop chart folks you see that first Peak that's when we were reported on it back in 2021 and here we go again it just had the slow ride down for 3 years and [ __ ] popped up again so gamestock stock tripled at the posting of that meem why is this important well uh he has a huge position he increased it from 200,000
shares basically to 5 million had 120,000 call options shth will'll comment on all this in a moment if he exercised all these calls skill could own an additional 12 million shares here's G Gensler who was on CNBC Wednesday trying to like calm the markets down and or try to get control of this craziness here's
the clip I say to you look I want to put up a a a I want to put up a a cryptogram and it's of a chair leaning up which we know from video game playing means come on this is the ninth inning get ready and we know that I'm a person who happens to like the stock of GameStop this is the single come on get ready is this something hypo ically that is that
the SEC should worry about so look again it's not so hypothetical because you're describing things that are in the public domain and and the public is is uh you know interested in so but generally speaking you have to make sure that you don't mislead the public and that you don't in any way do things in the markets that may
be manipulative or misleading and so that the key thing in our Capital Market no the key thing is if you can cure it with disclosure this is brandise you know if they disclose it this is something that they are called action then you can't go after them disclosure is one really key part of our Capital markets when you buy the stock
of a company you expect that they give you full and fair disclosure that's by the way not what you're getting right now in this crypto field so I just you know cautionary tail there that disclosure but disclosure doesn't necessarily protect a bad actor if they're manipulating a market chth you've been you've had a lot of comments on the
markets and uh specifically this one uh over the years what are your thoughts is posting this meme stock manipulation or disclosure no it's he's posting a meme okay thank you he put a picture on the internet okay I mean the again this is like the problem that we have which is that he disclosed his position in a
different way now we don't know whether that disclosure is accurate because I think it was just a screenshot of like some statement inside of a Reddit thread right and then that got posted many times elsewhere is this accurate I don't know because he has no obligation as an individual to do any of this stuff because he's not running a hedge fund
and he's not running other people's money now if he was acting in concert with other people you could say hey hold on a second if you're repping not just your money but other people's money and you did this then there's probably a disclosure obligation there but at the end of the day this is a guy that acted and basically created
hype and right now the SEC does not have a framework to deal with that because the rules that existed didn't understand social media and whatnot and he's also not a regulated entity he's just an individual now if it turns out that he was selling while he was posting this stuff and trying to manipulate the market in some way obviously they could
find issue with that but just for him being a credible influencer and creating momentum for an underlying position that in and of itself is not illegal saxs I think we have to go to judge Sachs here judge Sachs what is your verdict R meme stock manipulation judge Sachs no I don't see any manipulation there I like Jamal said
this posting a meme what you saw gu not guilty what I see in that clip is Jim Kramer trying to stir up an SEC investigation of Keith Gil for what I mean what exactly has he done here this is kind of the Wall Street Journal as well if you look at the Wall Street Journal today there's an entire article basically with the headline is what
Keith Gil is doing illegal and I think you can view this in a different lens which is here is a an individual that is totally outside of the establishment that however he's done it has gotten a hold of hundreds of millions of dollars maybe even now billions if the stock keeps going and I think that that for
the establishment that controls those pipes very disconcerting right if he if he was one of those apex predators on Wall Street if he was one of those major hedge funds that donates a lot of of money to the political Elite in other words if he was a well-connected political player I doubt anyone would be asking these
questions freberg you got thoughts on this Market manipulation or meme ston fun good times you're buying GameStop you're buying AMC like buy or beware you're you're in on the joke what are your thoughts Nick can you pull up the image I'm gonna talk about the stupidity of buying the stock of this company valuation this is a uh company and and
then I think we can talk about whether that's even relevant which I think indication is that it's not GameStop finished the year 2023 fiscal year with sales of 5.3 billion down from 5.9 billion the year before so sales declined by 12% in the year adjust billion in Revenue selling games adjusted ebit for the year with 65
million and they have about 1.2 billion in cash currently as of today the market cap is about 13.5 billion doar so that makes it about a 125 billion do Enterprise Value 12 A5 billion divided by 65 million of ibata means that this stock is currently trading at about 192 times IA a business that is profitable and you can say that the profits are
stable and predictable and it's likely not going to grow very much well typically trade for 7 to 12 times IA and the stock is trading at 192 times IA and the revenue is declining 12% a year so I'll just point out like I don't think that there's anything about the actual performance of the underlying business
and the security that you are buying or selling when you were making a decision about whether or not to buy or sell this security and I think that that's the real question does that even matter clearly it doesn't let people have fun let them go to Vegas let them play in the roulette table they know what they're getting into the disclosures are
all there all the SEC filings are there all the financials of this business are there what you're actually buying is publicly viewable you can look at it you can make an investment decision as an individual investor and Trader and you want to blow your money trying to see when the social trends are going to shift one way or another let it be your
decision I think this is well said if you're buying nfts if you're buying stonks like this if you're playing poker in a if you're playing bomb pots look it up folks if you don't know what bomb pots are and you're going crazy playing bomb pots for eight hours like we did the other week you're there to gamble if
you are playing bomb Pots if this is the bomb pots of the stock market have fun go crazy if you're buying nfts if you're buying crypto and token you know what you're getting into there's no law there's no law that defines why you should or should not buy a security with respect to the diligence you have
individually done to determine whether the underlying business is worth the price you're paying yes the law says that the businesses that are listing their Securities for public trading have an obligation to make disclosures on their financials and any other material events to the public and they do that through the SEC filing process that's
all out there and then what you as an individual will do with it is up to you enough with the nanny State go ahead sax so when's the right time to put a short on this company by the way inv advice the stock is up the stock is up 40% today and then there's these reports that came out yesterday on a bunch very big hedge funds that put very big short
positions yesterday on the stock and it's up 40% today so they're all going to get margin called so this is where you see the same thing that happened last time where what was that guy's name the the capital uh Melvin PL G plot got blown out gonna get blown out on the wrong side of the you're gonna get Plotkin you're about to
get Plotkin don't get plen in a sarami yeah that's what you don't want to do because you could lose it all in a Sac rucci or it's basically a game where you know the redditors are they bid up they bid up the stock yes to levels that re realistically it's not worth that much but it puts a big it basically creates a
short squeeze so the stock flies up yeah then the hedge funds know it's overvalued so they Bas put new shorts on and then they do the next shorts and they'll do something that's even more dangerous which is they can get synthetically short so they'll they'll add leverage to this using all kinds of esoteric derivatives that other banks on
Wall Street will happily sell them and then when those are disclosed then the redditors can just pump it even more which causes massive margin calls so I think the thing that freeberg you're saying though this is this existential thing that comes back it's happened in nfts it's happened in the Doom bubble it
happened in spaxs it's happened in crypto are we supposed to protect people and then the question is who is the Wii and are you supposed to say if you're an adult and you can read then read the disclosures and you're on your own that's what the SEC says and that's what the rule of law has been and so this is going to be an interesting test
because instead of an organization it's going to be a person in this case Keith Gill who will be the face of what happens to the stock because if a bunch of people all of a sudden plow into this thing and then it goes to five it'll be really interesting to see the reaction hey you should have saved us how could
this happen you know he dumped this on all of us and the answer is no he did not where was the government to save our day where was the government to protect consumers that's with the nanny State that's the next cycle of the story the next cycle of the story is the and you showed how the government protected everybody which was you showed
the revenue and the profits and the margins which is publicly available and you did it in two minutes I mean anybody anybody can look at your analysis and and see you didn't even use a sophisticated model you used probably the calculator app on your freaking Mac to figure out that it was back envelope no no no I'm sure he used the calculator app so
you the whole point is you can figure out that there's no logical justification for this company using one Google search and the calculator app on your Mac yeah it's on you I think the question is should we make all sports betting legal and all online casinos legal so if you follow this to its natural conclusion let people do what
they want why are all of the other gambling Industries so tightly regulated I think there's aumers I think there's a big difference well because we need a stock market we need we need the ability for companies to go public it just so happens that you can get this weird effect where some stocks can become meme
stocks but but that doesn't mean you want to design the entire system of Securities laws around one or two meme stocks the fact of matter is that investors are sufficiently protected by robust disclosure requirements that apparently GameStop has followed all that information is out there you basically dismantled the company in like
2 minutes so anyone watching this show has all the information they need not to buy this stock at 190 times earnings okay if they choose to follow that information yeah the other thing that you're saying which is really important is you have to remember what the capital markets and the stock market is there for it's not meant for this this is a
small little culdesac but the over whelming majority of the capital markets and the equity markets is to allocate excess Capital to good ideas that's what is usually happening there's a bunch of us that will put a bunch of our money into things because we think it's the right thing to do and that is the overwhelming majority of what is
happening in the stock market every day and David's right every now and then one of these things randomly comes up and every period of time there'll be a few parts of the market that go crazy but the reality is that's not what the overwhelming majority of of the actions and that's not why the security are
there have you guys seen this guy his name is Tim nackie on Instagram so what this guy did this guy's incredible so this guy went out and he basically bet 10 cents in online Blackjack because he's legally allowed to do it where he lives I think he's in Australia or something oh yeah that's 10 cents for every follower he has on Instagram so
over the last couple of months he's been yeah he's been ra racking and racking up the bets and he ended up doing these $100,000 plus bets because he got to over a million followers he ran this thing up to over a million bucks and he quit but it's it's now he's formed like a blackjack Syndicate so everyone wants
to kind of Pile in and bet with him I think that there's this really interesting phenomenon of like social betting everyone wants to be in a group together he's got hundreds of thousands of people that have put money in this is so great and then he goes and does this online gam like Nick pull the video up I just sent you watch how this guy and
he's so entertaining he's awesome oh man sa this this could be deadly for saaks saaks didn't know about this 78 Blackjack and 10 Instagram follow I've God there are 94 ,000 of your weapons with us now so a $94,000 bet coming right up all righty ladies and gentlemen we have a $94,000 going on the line for the 940,000 of your weapons with us 90 on
the butt 2K each of the side bets this blug definitely gloves up both hands on the golf course never has a black stood down such an impact on my life I'm not healthy FAL gross seven versus six ah that might be a double down that might be I'll take three that's a double down that's a double down that's a double
down damn you go te for me here of course we're counting C 18 we'll take the we will take the godamn to these pting Lords a glorious day for the 10 with the 10 10 on can I get the job done again that'll go little will see you tomorrow you smug son of a oh my God this is so great this guy is so good SX do you know about this that's
some serious degeneracy it looks so fun though all in Syndicate let's go one hand a day there's only one a day oh my God and every day his follower account goes up so every day he bets more and then your follow and he ran this thing up to a million of profit oh so good I haven't seen sax this awake during the Pod you don't get the 10 cents he keeps
it he started this just by betting his own money and he would put 10 cents down every day for how many followers he had and so he he started betting more and more of his own money account that he can is it still all of his money that he's betting so then as of a few weeks ago or like a two weeks ago he stopped betting his own
money he took the million off the table he called it a day and he set up a Syndicate and now people send their own money in and now he's betting the syndicates money I love and so everyone Tunes in and he does one hand a day and he keeps racking this thing up it's just what happens when he loses is there a day where he's lost a lot of money oh
dude you got to watch it good loser video it's so funny I want to see what happens when he loses like a b wait can we hit this guy at the all-in summit plays online blackjack right so there's always like a fake dealer and he has all this hilarious commentary on fake dealer what they look like set up an account at
bpn right now I'll be honest with you this may get me back on Instagram this is so juicy oh we should get this guy out to the summit this guy's got to come to the summit and do a live hand with Mr big big shout out is he on Tik Tok or no just in I think he only does insta Yeah Tim NE I haven't seen saak listen to freeberg on this
podcast more than he just did that was incredible you got Sax's attention saak did you know you could play live online Blackjack from your phone did you know this did not did not know that this is important information for all of us big day coming up there is 514 th000 of you in here now and a $1,400 beit coming up all right day 60 a
Monumental day we can hit the the 50k button here we will do $50,000 on the button we'll go $800 on the 21 + 3 $600 on the perfect Piers this is by far and away the biggest bit I have put on a table in my life we're trying to itch ourselves into gambling immortality 14 Place three no oh it's a disgusting pull
on day 60 with all the marbles on the line we will stand and look for 10 T and bus TNT and bust TNT and bust come on the heroics to be a hero go yes yes yes day 60 stick that in your pipe smoke it holy pulled it off oh my God we've broken the push streak with the Adventures of Tintin and you better believe that means I'll see you tomorrow
and I'll be bidding even more this guy's got great energy can he do one live on the show next week oh day 55 oh here we go Instagram follower I've got outrageously there is an extra 21,000 of you in here today so $3 37,600 bit going on for the 376,000 of you Legends in here now coming right up okay day 55 brings about a big godamn we
have $36,000 on the button 1,000 on the 21 plus 3 and $600 on the perfect pair 37.6k total bits are closed we've just had a goddamn dealer change we've been duped here I'm call I'm calling the commissioner play Oh 12v King oh my God before I before I hit the hit button I will say this having talked to the morning Rumble this morning uh last time
I spoke to the media about this journey I I broke a sixday winning streak that day and I lost so if it happens again today this one's on Roger fary we need to see 8 or9 go low no oh my God come on that dealer CH so dirty I guess you just can't win them all but we've been on and I will see you tomorrow when we'll be
bidding even more that dealer change was so dirty you saw the dealer change at the last minute he came up and they changed the dealer they theyve done that to me before I've been with you when they've done that ice they do that every time with you when you start running it up they send in the dealer to ice you I think there's a particular dealer
they've got you know they do they it's like in the bullpen the blank cooler yeah we know the one the blank cooler I don't want to say anything but it's the cooler we need this guy next week on the Pod to do the live bet and then we each give him 5K how about that you guys in I've had them Trot out the cooler when I
was playing craps once I was so mad and I was on such a heater and what happens is you guys have seen me play crabs where it's like it's all Rhythm right so it's like I get the dice in a certain way you know I do and then they bring in this guy and he was like a clutz it's like Daniel de Lewis in my left foot all of a sudden he's everything
over four dice fall off the table I got so out of rhythm it was so hor I was so I want this guy in the Pod next week we're each putting five dimes in we got 20K from all in let's do it that would be so much oh my God we should get him to play a special Allin hand and let him run up our capital on the summit let's take the
profits from the summit and do a live hand we could put like a million bucks each on it we double up and then we're done with the Pod we don't have to do a summit next year really good idea J really let's do it let's Let It Roll all right God this is so much action for us I don't know if we can continue but there's more stories to
come and just buyer beware I mean if you're betting on this stuff I mean what do we have to tell you if you're betting on GameStop no we don't have to tell you anything you're an adult you're an adult right go to your own job well here's something really interesting put on your seat belt drive your don't drink and drive don't use drugs that means like
all of a sudden like we need to govern how you're not adult hey by the way if you swim in Cape Cod alone in the deep water in the kelp bed you might get hit by a great white shark do whatever you want and please just take responsibility for yourself because not our job absolutely I'm responsible for my children not you well I mean also it's
it's I just want to ask one question here is there anything with the short selling that could there could be more disclosure on that shth just if the SEC was going to do something I hear that bubble up once in a while should should short sellers be more disclosed I really think that's a very good idea I do think
that there are some short sellers who are doing it because they have to hedge a position that they have but then there are other short sellers who are doing it speculatively and there are synthetic instruments that banks will sell you to go massively super short that's how you can get a situation where 140% of the
stock is sold short which does shouldn't make sense if there's only a 100 shares of a company how could it be that 140 Shares are sold short it's because you can have these synthetic explain synthetic for the audience because I don't think people know this concept so there there are ways where if you have a formal trading relationship with Wall
Street and you you need to be of a certain size and they go through a diligence process they give you so you know I have one called an isda and it's essentially an account and a framework that you negotiate with a bank that allows you to call them and say hey give me a b or c and other times they'll call you and say hey I have this really
interesting way to play XYZ and one of the things that you can do with them is you can say listen I want to go super super long or super super short a theme or a company and they'll create a contract with between you and them that'll allow you to get that kind of exposure now you're not supposed to do that on a regular basis nor are you
supposed to lever this up this is actually what blew up a different hedge fund called Aros I remember we covered it and in that I guess what happened was the gentleman was calling many banks oh and doing all these things and One Bank didn't know what the other bank was doing so all of a sudden there was this
massive synthetic leverage that he was getting on I think it was news corpse stock and then they found out then it was Unwound then he owed a bunch of money he couldn't pay it the whole thing shut down the stock market went crazy so there does need to be that disclosure but there isn't a rule that says that and every time somebody tries to
introduce it the broker dealers basically Lobby and kill it so in a way it's almost like a parallel universe where bets are occurring on outcomes in the stock market that are not tied to the stocks in the stock market well it is tied in the sense that ultimately it all needs to feed back to an actual physical share and so this is where all
this price Behavior gets further Amplified I think the point is that these forms of expressing risk yes can really amplify what would otherwise happen so in freeberg example most people would sit there get the financials some would maybe say historically this thing looks like a short or I wouldn't even buy it at all
right but other people might say well if I listen to the chairman and I think about the future maybe I go long that's a that's a fine thing you can enter the stock market and do that but all this other stuff amplifies all these things to a degree that we're not really used to and let's be honest the people who
are betting I'll use the word betting here the people who are betting on these things are not looking to get a 7% return or beat the average I mean they're looking to double their money in 48 hours they know what they're getting in for they're just walking up to the roulette table and putting 10K on black or red and and then clapping and seeing
five Reds in a row and saying oh it's got to be black next I mean they're pH hel you with thing this they don't say that when they lose the no of course not yeah no no personal ownership here well here's an interesting thing that's sort of related a little bit of jurisdiction shopping or placing of companies and
products continues and Texas is very hot in this regard Black Rock and Citadel are backing New Stock A New Stock Exchange to take on uh the New York Stock Exchange and the NASDAQ duopoly so of to the Wall Street Journal The Exchange would be based in Texas and called the Texas Stock Exchange or the txse they've raised 120 million so far
it seems like a low number and the general pitch here is the New York Stock Exchange in NASDAQ have become expensive and they've been increasing their compliance cost NASDAQ has a new Bard diversity Target that went into effect at the start of this year all the Dei stuff and so this exchange is pitching itself as a CEO friendly and the
anti-woke exchange so here the plan timeline file an SEC registration docs later this year start facilitating trades next year host the First new listing in 2026 interesting I guess that Citadel and black rock are in this group because they could bring a lot of business obviously and you know some of this other stuff that's been going on
with Texas Texas is now Tesla's corporate headquarters they moved it from paloalto and California to Texas in in 2021 your thoughts here chth on moving okay why why do you love it so much chth tell me competition I do think that it's hard right now for companies to get access to Capital I think more diverse and more flexible
ways where smart investors can allocate their money into the ideas that they want are better I think that the duopoly hasn't created enough competition so the NASDAQ and and New York Stock Exchange haven't innovated and in fact they they've probably been a little regressive in terms of filing requirements listing requirements in
terms of board composition they've fallen for a bunch of things that don't actually point to the economic rationale or value in a company and so I think if you have a third player there's a chance that more competition will create more rational Behavior which will flow into the companies themselves so I'm a huge fan
of this I I think that the the stock exchanges right now are too brittle because and there's and that reason is because there's only two of them freberg any thoughts for you about more options for I think part of actually there's been these rules imposed by NASDAQ and New York Stock Exchange that have tried to enforce upon
the listed companies rules and regulations that are not tied to Securities laws including some of these aspects of diversity of your board and I know that there have been a lot of public company board members and CEOs that have quietly tried to push back on these rules that they're imposing social systems upon you know
what is effectively a regulated exchange and so there's certainly like an interest and a pushing for a a competitive Marketplace for exchanges there was a survey done recently that showed I got to find some of this data but it showed the cost of going public on NASDAQ MX or the New York Stock Exchange was about $7.4 million cost of
going public through an over-the-counter bulletin board listing service was about $2 million and then there's these additional kind of rules that are being imposed if you want to be listed on the big boards so clearly there's interest and it's great to see a competitive market emerge you know how there have by
the way there have been other attempts there's that long-term Stock Exchange you guys remember that a couple years ago that was me to incentivize long-term Holdings there was two other Equity security exchanges efforts made in the last couple years that didn't take off so this isn't super novel in terms of like seeing a new Challenger exchange
step up but I think more competition is always better all right in other news apple and open AI have reportedly struck an iPhone deal according to Bloomberg apple is going to announce a major partnership with open AI at WWDC next week chat GPT will be integrated into iOS which means apple is outsourcing its AI chat B at least at the start I guess
you could argue it benefits both sides because open a gets access to over a billion phone users and apple gets a native integration of a top tier language model terms are not clear but most people think this is going to be a short to midterm deal with Apple building out its own AI chatbot in the future but it's just not ready for prime
time right now also plans to make Siri AI powered and bring AI features to the Apple ecosystem you have heard that Apple is going to try to let Siri dive deeper into Apps I.E if you were ordering your door Dash or Uber Eats or an Uber or ayt or whatever it might actually be able to execute those things inside of an app interesting line from
the article Apple Executives were concerned about reputational damage from a rogue chatbot some people within Apple have a philosophical aversion to having a chatbot at all very interesting so thoughts on this Sachs just getting you back in the loop here well we kind of predicted that something like this could
or should happen we said that the big win for apple and AI would be to make Siri actually work based on an llm because Siri just you know its understanding of language historically has not been great and that's really limited the usefulness of it imagine if Siri worked with the conversational abilities of chat gbt 40 if it had that
level of semantic understanding if it could talk to you the way that 40 can talk to you that would make Siri really powerful and you know for me siries is a feature I've turned off because it's so annoying but oh it sucks right never works if you give it the power of the best open AI model and then the speed of
running it natively on the iPhone I don't know what they're going to do about that but presumably there are things they can do to speed it up and then you give it access to the internal apis you're using to control apps that could be really powerful now Siri could be an agent that you can just tell it to do things and you know not just ask like
the weather and the time and set alarms well it's really interesting I think about this deal chth is Apple is having a hard time getting people to upgrade their phones right and people have lost faith in the stock now you say hey we're going to put a language model on here you can make it a local language model
and have it be privacy protected so that means you need more memory on the phone you're going to need another chip on the phone it's going to there's a distinct reason to upgrade now if you had a language model on your phone and Siri was like this super Siri that actually got stuff done I would upgrade my phone immediately and right now I skip two or
three generations what are your thoughts on this as a way to maybe reinvigorate the iPhone franchise Tom you buy it or not no the problem is that we don't know what the right form factor for a super scaled consumer AI app looks like so we've all all again I I'm not trying to be a wet blanket it's just that when you
look at what's building built so far I think most of the things we've seen are the friends and mys spaces of this class of app we haven't seen the Facebooks and the Instagrams yet and the reason is because we haven't experimented and pushed the boundaries of the form factor so for example in the first phases of social
networking the idea that you would collect information about all your friends and then create something called a Newsfeed was totally shocking and I remember when we first released it people got really upset and then it just became this de facto why were they upset about it tell me well it's this idea that you collected this information and
then you presented it about all of your friends was disconcerting in as a feature now if you don't have a Newsfeed of some kind in your app for many apps it's DOA right so the same problem exists today all we've done today is we've replicated an existing use case with a slightly better feature here or there nobody has gone out and said on a
blank canvas let me completely reimagine how consumers want value with these things to enable it and until that happens we're just wasting time so the idea that apple with this thousand device is all of a sudden going to figure out that this is why you're going to upgrade I think is pretty speculative and I think
they're going to be disappointed I think people have realized that four generations ago was more than enough and on top of this the stuff that you value inside the iPhone is not what you're going to need for AI so you know spending a trillion billion dollars on the fourth camera lens is not going to be what solves this problem and
so you're more likely to have a very simple earbud that is you know very inconspicuous and discreetly in your inner ear well speaking information to you then you are and with a companion $500 phone then I think you will be with a $1,500 you're in the new form factor I I'm going to take the other side of the camp I think that because you have this
data on your phone all your iMessages all your documents all your photos videos music collection there's a unique set of data on that phone to make your personal llm that's going to do extraordinary things for you because it's going to watch you and all your behavior on that phone and man if I could have a personal llm that's been
watching me order very specific sushi rolls or you know where I set my Ubers what type of Ubers I like what music I play I feel like that llm to my point is you don't need a $1,500 device to do that so if you spend $5 data set is so cool don't you data is Uber has the data door Dash has the data Apple has you're
missing my point the data of me clicking on the screen that patter that is not Apple's to collect it's not they're not I it is I think they'll collect it put it in there you have to you would have to fundamentally change the SDK the idea then that Apple can take a tax on that is outrageous I think the whole app
economy would blow up if Apple tried to do that oh I think it's the opposite I think the app economy with five you have this like great thing where I could tell it order the same thing I ordered on door Das encourage Apple to try to change the trims of service and see what happens okay freeberg your thoughts on this any thoughts no okay well let's get
to this it's time for science Corner temperatures in the Atlantic Ocean are alarmingly high freeberg couple weeks ago we saw this uh crazy chart on the X about the Atlantic ocean temperatures pre Hurricane Katrina right about now and uh take us through this because it's very disconcerting there's not much to talk
about except to highlight this image which shows um again we talked about this a few months ago hot ocean temperatures Drive hurricane and tropical storm activity because as the wind the air above the ocean starts to move the energy from the ocean gets pulled out you know like things cool down the water cools down but that energy actually goes
back into pushing the wind to move faster and faster and that's how tropical storms Cyclones and hurricanes are formed is warm ocean temperatures and there's been this kind of persistent warming since last year in the Atlantic in this particular region where all the hurricanes form and normally the hurricane season starts kind of call it
August to October right now we are seeing temperatures that are so far beyond what we've seen anytime historically this image that you're looking at here actually compares the ocean temperatures right now in the Atlantic to where we were at the same time period in 2005 which was a record hurricane year obviously with hurricane
Trina right yeah and so their National Hurricane Center a lot of the climatologists are forecasting that over the next couple of months we could see and should expect to see probabilistically much larger stronger bigger more frequent hurricanes than we've ever seen historically so we'll see if it plays out just a very small
tidbit of news to share thought it be worth highlighting not getting a lot of main mainstream media press atten but ask to just confirm a couple things for me because we live in a time where people are questioning Science And scientists and we we have institutions we don't trust whether it's freeletter agencies in Washington or scientists and
all these papers being written and everything we're finding out and nobody trusts anybody and and we're sort of resetting trust I want to just ask you as somebody I trust as a scientist number one global warming temperatures increasing putting aside you know what we do about it temperatures in the ocean it is undeniable or increasing at a rate
that you would describe as concerning am I correct we have not seen in the modern era temperatures in the ocean like we're seeing now that's a fact right so I'm not I'm not going to do this whole big prognosis on everything all inone because I think that's where people feel like there's rooms for discrediting
things yeah we can be very specific about things here's an example so this is the sea surface temperature going back to 1981 okay and as you can see at this point in the year and you know the temperature oscillates because of the way the the Earth tilts towards the sun um and so at this point in the year we
are seeing right now sea surface temperatures that are beyond anything we've seen historically and it is continuing to climb so if this does not taper off or level off we will see record sea surface temperatures in the August to October time frame which will almost certainly push massive hurricane events out of the Atlantic and they will
find their way towards the Continental this super clarifying this should not be controversial to anybody we have temperature readings in the ocean and this is simp data it's just simply data right so you know putting aside what political party you on and what you think about gas and oil I will tell you there's a lot of theory one one of the
theories so there's theories about Alo there's theories about climate change contributing to this there's also a theory about sulfur dioxide that is now been banned in shipping and cargo vessels that okay go across the oceans last year B sulfur dioxide use in the the fuel that's that's coming out of these and sulfur dioxide actually
reflects sunlight so as it goes up into the air into the atmosphere coming out of these ships it actually blocks and reflects light so that would make the oceans cooler and so a lot of folks have said that over the last couple of decades we've actually dampened the temperature and the warming that's happened on Earth because of all the
sulfur dioxide we've been putting up into the atmosphere but because sulfur dioxide causes acid rain environmentalists have been pushing for years to ban sulfur dioxide the problem is with Banning sulfur dioxide you may have this other side effect which is now more rapid increased warming got it of the surface and of the oceans so these
are complex systems and you we should be delicate with them if you were to give us a prescription here freeberg what's like a basic prescription are we just experimenting in a way that is not advisable with you know this ecosystem and we should just not run the experiment I think that might be like a non-political non-charge way to say it
like this experiment is a little bit too crazy to run on the one planet Earth we have yeah which experiment the experiment of doing things that increase global warming which would be you mean living well yeah I mean not burning fil an experiment people are just acting in their own economic best interest yes and
if that economic best interest increases temperature so much you have a fear freeberg that it will compromise the oceans and and damage them to a point that would be extremely concerning is I guess what I'm getting at there is a reduction in biodiversity that's under way we can see that like using data but to chim's
point humans have prioritized the progression of individuals forward China had a billion people that came out of poverty in 30 years yeah and they came out of poverty because of the industrialization of the production of consumable goods that that population gets to consume they get access to more calories they get access to More Foods they get to
have cars they get to have houses all of that making cement making concrete all of those things require Industrial Systems and those Industrial Systems have a cost that cost is the dollar economic cost which we're kind of rationalizing with greater productivity then there's this whole cost that's externalized got we understand that yeah
sure so so that's the the tension is like if you're wealthy if you're a wealthy Nation if you're the Western Europe or the United States you get to stand up and say stop carbon but if you're the rest of the world you're like I want to have a home I want to have a car you want to have the same Evol that
America went through or Europe I want I I want to progress as a as a person I want to progress as a society and that's the tension that makes this a very difficult problem to resolve which is how do more of the world get to progress while being cognizant I'm trying to get at freeberg I am deeply optimistic so
let me just say this oh yeah because that's what I'm getting at are you optimistic or are you pessimistic tell us I believe strongly that there is a strong relationship between the output of atmospheric carbon and the delar effects we see in ecosystems okay that is something I feel like is true from data I am not however as pessimistic that the
world is going to end in the next decade or two because I see improvements in productivity meaning how many units we get out for every Unit in or how many units we get out for every unit of carbon that's emitted and those productivity meaning better technology systems are rapidly changing how we make things and how people are accessing
goods and services and I think that that's why I am like because I'm a techno Optimist I'm optimistic about where things are head are headed and it is also why I get very angry and upset about any efforts or attempts to slow down the adoption of Technology because these things will pull people forward and make that happen faster without all
the dilar side effects that we've unfortunately had to do in the absence of technology so trath I'll pull you in here so based on what freeberg is saying here yes these things are occurring but the technology and the advances we're seeing in but one example solar and then some people might bring up nuclear and
other ones we just had Phil deuts at my conference this week give a great talk on this solar is just getting so cheap batteries are getting so cheap putting batteries in your home putting solar in you know and then putting data centers next to nuclear things this is all adding up to we can solve this problem and so you two feel optimistic about
this yeah totally I think that climate change stalled when it was an emotional and philosophical rallying cry largely of the left when instead it became something about resilience and domestic manufacturing both sides came together and I think we're at a point now where the US's energy Independence plus the amount of Reliance on non-carbon based
fuels will drive a sea change in the United States I think it'll be copied in Western Europe and it's also going to be at enough of a low price point where it'll get embraced in the developing world so it's a it's an incredible example of if you want to take an idea and a bunch of solutions and want to die on the hill of
messaging and platitudes it'll make no progress but if instead you're willing to sort of be less extreme about it and actually just frame it in economic value ad all of a sudden everybody Embraces it and it just becomes obvious so I think that we're going to do wonders over the next 20 and 30 and 40 years all over the
world to push back on the General State of warming but I think it will have happened because the economic incentives aligned not because of an a philosophical or emotional framing of the issue all right everybody this has been in a very productive episode of the number one podcast in the world the Allin podcast and good luck
tonight gentlemen with your fundraiser I wish you great luck David Saxon chth po hopp even if it's not my preferred candidate that's totally fine we could all differ and you can have a great great event tonight good luck I have one thing okay go ahead Jam I have one more birthday in my family today making us
all look bad this is one of the most incredible people in my life charismatic funny Charming intelligent it is my bestie David friberg's birthday today oh it is love you DAV we love you David we had a nice little h birthday cake at the liquidity Summit this week for him I had a had had a cake made thank you for showing happy birthday and
here we go and and it's also AK-47 Alan King's birthday today as well another have the same Love Alan keing is is 45 and one is 47 what here we go it's karma do you know the significance of that of course he's going to win all the odd number elections and there we go here we go I think it's a sign it's a sign listen I
wish good luck to you all tonight I hope that uh it goes off well for you for you gentlemen and listen I would love to have Trump on the Pod would love to have Biden on the Pod like all things we just want to have a great conversation here we keep it respectful sometimes it gets a little chippy but we love each other and we love you the audience for
participating in this don't fall for the mainstream media's nonsense in trying to divide and conquer we got important tasks to do and problems to solve in the world and the way we do that is through great conversations hopefully we set a tone an example for everybody else have just had to do that we still love each
other and uh we sometimes some elbows get flown and it's all good chamath saaks good luck tonight freeberg uh happy birthday and bye bye we'll see you all next time on the number one podcast in the world you all In Pockets tell your friends about it love you byebye love you let your winners ride Rainman David and instead we open source it to
the fans and they've just gone crazy with Love Queen [Music] of Besties are this my dog taking driveway man oh man myit will meet me we should all just get a room and just have one big hug orgy cuz they're all this useless it's like this like sexual tension that they just need to release [Music] Som we need to get [Music]
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camp and tournament for women only so for the ladies out there if you want to learn how to play poker just like the besties and Jenny just you can join this four-week training class get unlimited playing time and you play in a tournament I'm going to come and uh play in one of the sessions but here's the great part we uh donated a ticket
because we think it's worth uh encouraging women to join the poker community and so uh there's a $7,500 Allin Summit 2024 ticket at stake there's only 80 spots go ahead and join at poer power.com summer- boot camp poker power.com summer- boot cab it's going to fill up quick I know a number of the women who work at my Venture firm
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