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3:09
>> [music] >> We came to this world to reach the stars.
3:24
We came [music] to this world to see a future.
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[music] We came to this world [music] to reach the stars to shape [music] our future. You feel the new heat.
4:25
>> [music] >> I see multiple journalists on the horizon.
4:33
Standby ready for deploy.
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[music] Friendly reindeer in Boom. >> Well done, brother.
4:43
I'll see you in the new year.
4:47
[music] >> You're watching TVPN.
4:55
>> Today is Thursday, December 18th, 2025.
4:59
We are live from the TBPN Ultra Dome, the temple of technology, the fortress of fin. com.
5:09
Count is money, save both, easy corporate cards, bill pay, accounting, a whole lot more all in one place.
5:14
Uh we got a video here uh that uh I've it has been promised to me.
5:22
I I saved this for the show. to this reaction.
5:24
I haven't seen the video, but I've seen the metrics around the video.
5:28
It's got 15,000 likes just on a quote tweet of it.
5:33
Uh, I think it's going to be very funny.
5:35
Tyler was saying, "You got to watch this."
5:37
So, we're going to pull this up.
5:39
Uh, Pegasus is quote tweeting.
5:41
It says, "This is OpenAI showing the public its financials once it goes public." Okay, looks pretty good. Getting a haircut. Looks good. Oh, no.
5:55
You know, I've been watching these haircut videos and they're actually incredibly good content because uh I saw one I mean, obviously that one's very silly, but >> dude, this that that that this video going viral.
6:06
This guy's going to be full Giga Chad mode within 6 months. >> I guarantee it. >> Guarantee it. Guarantee it. But >> he just did that.
6:12
He He knew what was going to happen.
6:14
He did it >> to inspire himself to, I guess, look. For sure. For sure. >> To start smashing.
6:19
I I looked at a uh at a haircut video where uh and it's it's incredibly sticky content because you're watching the guy describe what he wants and then at the very end they show you a a montage of the photos and when it works out obviously that the joke there is that you know it's a downgrade.
6:36
Um but when when it works out it's really satisfying.
6:41
The payoff comes right at the end which of course is great for retention and average view duration.
6:43
And so uh it's uh it's a growing format.
6:45
Uh it does make me wonder like there are certain like can every different vertical can every different type of content become uh you know high retention or are there some things that are just like more naturally like payoff based right?
7:04
>> Uh anyway um >> let me tell you about Adio the AI native CRM.
7:08
Adio builds, scales and grows your company to the next level.
7:14
[music] Uh we are in Arena Mag.
7:15
This is uh breaking news or the latest edition of Arena.
7:21
We had three martini lunch.
7:24
>> This is uh this is issue number six uh Q4 2025.
7:27
Three martini lunch and we are in here in with a wonderful spread.
7:30
Oh, there's a bunch of there's a bunch of great people in here. Look at this. We got Daniel in here.
7:36
I don't know if he's doxed in this photo actually. >> A growing one.
7:42
>> I I [laughter] think so.
7:42
But uh there's a profile on some archer stuff, some V tall stuff. Very nice.
7:49
>> We got California Forever in here.
7:51
>> Apparently, we are having a YouTube issue, folks.
7:53
You'll have to refresh the app if you want to avoid any type of lag. >> Okay.
7:59
Oh, they did a uh a profile on or a review of Dwaresh Patel's the scaling era.
8:07
A uh [laughter] this What is going on here? The Christmas spirit.
8:13
That camera had one too many eggnogs. Um, yeah.
8:16
Uh, Tyler also has the the the scaling error, an or an an oral history of AI 2019 to 2025 by Doresh Patel.
8:25
Uh, there's a whole review of the book.
8:28
And then, of course, you get the beautiful TBP spread. Look at this. >> There you go. >> Isn't that great?
8:36
I like the that they kind of brought their own aesthetic on top of some photos that we took here in the Ultra Dome. Very, very fun.
8:42
They respected They respected the brand. >> Yeah, it looks great.
8:46
And here's a photo of me and Jordy having breakfast, showing you what the day in the life is like.
8:52
And then here's me reading the Wall Street Journal before the show starts. Life of Kugan. Um, >> Kugan Mode. >> Very fun.
8:58
Um, we I could take you through it, but you've heard the you've heard the story.
9:02
And you can go subscribe to Arena Mag. You can read it online. Uh, Three Martini Lunch. Uh, interesting.
9:08
I I did want to comment on this.
9:09
The the art direction for the cover art.
9:11
I like three martini lunch.
9:13
It feels like a pretty big departure from the previous very I felt I feel like their previous covers were very collagebased.
9:20
So this is like a much more simple design.
9:23
Uh still very >> at the same time it's still very nostalgic, right? >> Yes.
9:28
I mean look at the back >> to a to a different >> Yeah.
9:30
The back says the business of America is business. And it has a pager.
9:35
That's something we we haven't gotten into.
9:36
uh a cigarette and an ashtray and a a Casio watch which I pretty cool pretty cool >> classic.
9:43
Um anyway >> um anyways back on the timeline >> public.
9:46
com investing for those that take it seriously.
9:48
Multiasset investing trusted by millions.
9:50
What's back on the >> uh Katie Roof one of the greatest scoop athletes of our time.
9:55
A future scoop hall of famer has a scoop opening.
10:00
>> She really has she clearly has someone at opening who's like loves her right now.
10:04
She's been on scoop tear.
10:04
Uh, she says, "Scoop, OpenAI could soon be worth 750 billion in a financing round." They've had early talks.
10:11
Let's give it up for early talks.
10:13
We prefer advanced talk, but early talks.
10:17
>> All right, you got to you got to start somewhere.
10:20
>> Uh, about raising tens of billions of dollars or even a hundred billion.
10:23
Company was last valued at 500 billion a few months ago.
10:26
few months ago. Tay Kim chimes in uh says public markets are crushing open eye exposed stocks while private investors with visibility into open eyes metrics and internal numbers dot dot dot >> are piling in essentially >> both can't be right
10:42
>> I trust Katie roof reporting so he's saying that it's bullish for open AI that's his take from this that's what >> yeah may maybe some of the the publiclix have been oversold that said Uh yeah, I'll I'll be interested to see how this round comes together. Again, remember uh
10:58
Again, remember uh uh it's I think it's a good time to be fundraising if you need tens of billions of dollars if this um >> if if uh Warner Brothers ends up going >> uh with Netflix, right?
11:11
Because like >> uh that was a huge like if you're raising tens of billions of dollars >> Yeah.
11:19
And you're not doing it from strategics like the hyperscalers.
11:21
It pretty much has to be sovereign wealth funds. >> Yeah. Right.
11:26
And and potentially like they they're like the if if they pass on Warner Brothers, they have they have they have loose change in the couch cushions to toss OpenAI's way in the collect to the tune of$10 billion checks potentially.
11:39
Um, but I mean it does feel like OpenAI is at a bit of a uh it feels like the it feels like the vibes around OpenAI trough of disillusionment potentially going in a plateau of productivity.
11:51
It it feels like they're turning it around.
11:56
It feels like the new models and the products >> I haven't I haven't seen many people say I love 5. 2 too.
12:05
>> But then again, uh, out outside in the real world, clearly, you know, ask people what AI app they're using.
12:11
Yeah, that'll >> give you a lot of signal.
12:14
I thought this >> it just feels like like, you know, okay, maybe maybe we're not in Baja Blast territory, but we know that every code red is followed by an equal >> adult mode.
12:25
>> Adult mode [laughter] >> is coming in January. >> Uh, yeah, maybe.
12:28
[laughter] Uh but uh but it it it does it does seem like a lot of the uh a lot of the a lot of the negativity has kind of worked its way through.
12:41
The market's traded down.
12:42
There's maybe not another like it's like it feels like we're finding a bottom.
12:47
Like we're finding like the the footing of like, okay, reset the narratives, rebuild back up.
12:51
Like can they catch up in this?
12:53
Can they catch up in that?
12:53
If you see a couple good charts, couple growth charts, then uh you're sort of back in business because uh >> and again people got so negative got so negative as like like the point that I'm making is like is like a couple months ago it was like it's Enron, it's going to blow up. It's zero.
13:10
It's not going to work at all.
13:12
And it does feel like we're turning the corner on that.
13:15
>> Maybe muted the people that that are still saying that because they're still saying it.
13:19
>> They're still saying it. Well, it just got old.
13:22
>> This was a funny funny post.
13:22
Uh they say Sam says, "Sell me this pen."
13:25
Jensen says, "I'll lend you the money to buy it."
13:29
[laughter] >> Of course, uh Jensen is is investing money. >> Yeah.
13:35
>> Uh but >> anyways, a very good linear meet the software meet the system for modern software development stream linear streamlines work across the entire development cycle from road map to release.
13:47
uh Warner CEO David Zazlov and Netflix co-CEOs Greg Peters and Ted Randos on the Warner Brothers lot.
13:52
They took game day photo.
13:55
They went out deliberately to just strut and just flex and they clearly knew what they were doing. Hey. Hey.
14:05
>> Well, this is their new lot.
14:06
>> You point You look over here, guys.
14:06
Can we look over this direction? Okay. Yeah, that's perfect. Snap. Snap. Snap. Okay. Yeah. You know that.
14:12
You know that they they know what they're doing.
14:14
This looks like no hostile offer can get between us. We're bros. We're hanging out. This is a me.
14:22
This is a sign of strength. >> Sun's out. There's palm trees. >> Yeah.
14:26
This is This is them sending the signal sending sending a signal.
14:29
Hey, we're excited to work together.
14:31
We're excited to be in partnership collaborating.
14:35
Uh there was one person who quoted this and was unhappy about it.
14:40
Where is >> They were saying that they weren't well-dressed.
14:41
Yeah, they were saying that they weren't well dressed and and he was like, I'm I'm kind of in that boat.
14:46
It's not it's not >> they threw on a blaz they threw on their their [ __ ] blazers. Give them something.
14:51
The Hollywood executive style that's sort of like become the norm.
14:54
Um maybe we go back to the three martini lunches, guys.
14:59
Maybe we throw on suits now that you guys are in business.
15:01
>> But this is also a good way for for people that are maybe more on the tech side to start dressing up.
15:05
You don't have to go from jeans straight into a suit.
15:08
You can throw on a blazer, right? >> Mhm.
15:10
something something to consider. >> Yeah.
15:13
>> Um Matt Lavine is back.
15:16
>> Says, "I miss Christmas, Eve, New York, New New Year's, and the Fourth of July holidays for newsletters a lot smaller than this.
15:22
This is as good as it gets for newsletter writers."
15:24
And we can jump into the article.
15:26
He says, "Warner doesn't trust Paramount.
15:28
Revocable trust, ESG side letters, IPO lockups, Destiny, and doing deals over the holidays. >> Trust.
15:35
If you're a normal person, most of your wealth is probably in your own name.
15:38
But if you're one of the richest people in the world, you probably have a lot more complicated estate and tax planning, which probably means that a lot of your wealth is in trusts, legal arrangements that your lawyer set up to hold assets for you.
15:48
Most simply, you might have a revocable trust, where your assets technically belong to the trust, but you have control over the trust assets, investment decisions, beneficiaries, etc.
15:56
This can be useful for estate planning, but for most purposes, owning assets in a revocable trust is pretty much like owning them yourself.
16:04
I regularly say that Mark Zuck Mark Zuckerberg Mark Zuck [laughter] owns a lot of shares of Meta or that Elon owns a lot of shares of Tesla even though neither statement is exactly true.
16:14
Their trusts own the shares but for most practical purposes you can think of they own them.
16:18
This creates I suppose a small dumb problem.
16:20
Let's say you build big yachts and Mark Zuckerberg comes to you and asks asks to buy a billion dollar yacht.
16:27
Naturally he will pay you the billion dollars on completion of the yacht.
16:30
You might ask him, "Well, do you have a billion dollars?"
16:33
And he might say, "No, actually I don't.
16:35
But the Mark Zuckerberg Trust owns like a bajillion dollars worth of meta stock and I control that, so I'm good."
16:40
You find that persuasive.
16:42
So you pull up the yacht contract.
16:44
Who do you put in as the buyer?
16:47
If you put Mark Zuckerberg, he has no money.
16:49
If you put the Mark Zuckerberg trust, it has plenty of money now.
16:53
But if it is a revocable trust, he can just take all the money shares out whatever he wants. It's revocable.
16:58
If he changes his mind about the yacht, he can clean out the trust.
17:02
You'll send the bill to the trust, but the trust will have no money and you'll be stuck with the yacht.
17:07
Not that bad of a situation to be stuck with a billion dollar yacht.
17:11
But >> if you're in the business of selling them, you certainly want to be able to complete the transaction.
17:16
>> I get the I get the point.
17:16
Honestly, this is a pretty easy problem to solve.
17:19
You put Mark Zuckerberg in the contract.
17:21
He doesn't own the assets directly, but he controls the trust.
17:23
So, if he owes you a billion dollars, you can make make him take it out of the trust.
17:26
Uh, but maybe you'll get confused or he'll get confused and you'll end up signing a contract with the trust.
17:32
Then if he changes his mind, he can zero out the trust and stiff you.
17:35
I cannot imagine that this comes up a lot with yacht builders or anyone else.
17:39
Elon Musk once did sign a contract to buy Twitter for 44 billion, then changed his mind and tried to get out of it.
17:46
The fact that his wealth is mostly in a trust did not at any stage of the proceedings trouble anyone.
17:51
He had signed his equity commitment in his own name and everyone understood that if he was sued and lost, he'd have to pay with his trust money if necessary.
18:00
And Twitter did sue him and he did pay. Fine, fine, fine.
18:01
Uh, on the other hand, Paramount is trying to buy Warner Brothers Discovery, breaking up Warner's deal to sell itself to Netflix, Inc.
18:10
And Paramount does not have nearly enough money to pay for Warner.
18:11
Instead, much of the money behind the bid comes from Paramount chief executive officer's dad, Larry Ellison.
18:18
as of this writing the fifth richest person in the world or the rather it comes from his trust and this would be one of the greatest tricks in the history of mergers and acquisitions.
18:27
One major sticking point is Warner Brothers uh brother's concern about the financing proposed by Paramount which is led by David Ellison.
18:37
A big part of the equity is backstopped by a trust that manages the wealth of his father Larry Ellison.
18:40
Because it's a revocable trust, assets can be taken out of it at any time and Warner Brothers may have no recourse if that happens, the people said.
18:49
And he Matt says, "Aha, sure.
18:53
The risk here is Warner throws over Netflix, pays it a $2.
18:55
8 billion breakup fee, and signs a deal to sell itself to Paramount for something like an 8. 4 billion in cash.
19:02
For some reason, changing market conditions, regulatory difficulties, and a a change of heart by the Ellison's or a change of heart by their co-investors, the Ellison's decide they don't want to close the deal.
19:15
Quietly, in the comfort of his own home, without saying anything to Warner, Larry Ellison takes all of his stock out of the trust, leaving it empty.
19:21
Yoink, he whispers to himself. Oops, never mind. Paramount tells Warner.
19:26
Warner sues Paramount for specific performance, seeking to make it pay 108.
19:30
4 4 billion and close the deal. Lol.
19:33
We don't have that kind of money, says Paramount, which has a market capitalization of about 15 billion and about three billion of cash.
19:40
When we signed the deal, you knew that the money was coming from the Ellison Trust.
19:44
So, Warner sued the Ellison Trust for specific performance, seeking to make it pay 108 billion and close a deal. Lol.
19:52
We don't have that kind of money, says the Ellison Trust.
19:55
We did, sure, but the trust got revoked.
19:58
Yoink, adds Larry Ellison more loudly this time.
20:00
So Warner sues Larry Ellison for the money. He says, "Who me?" says Larry Ellison.
20:04
You have no deal with me.
20:06
I don't even know what you're talking about. This is not my problem.
20:08
This does not strike me as especially likely and it would obviously be bad for Paramount and the Ellison, but I suppose it is possible and it would be a pretty fun trick.
20:18
I talked about this >> a little bit yesterday on the show.
20:20
Uh this kind of situation.
20:22
Uh today, Warner officially rejected Paramount's bid, advising shareholders not to sell their shares in Paramount's tender offer.
20:27
Here is how Warner describes Larry Ellison's commitment or lack thereof.
20:31
Uh, and this was the exact quote that I read yesterday, which was, "Despite Paramount's headline claims, there is no equity, commitment, or backs stop from the Ellison family for the offer."
20:41
Um, and I'll skip over the rest of that quote, but Matt continues, "As far as I can tell, and somewhat baffling bafflingly, this is correct.
20:50
Paramount's own tender offer says that the Ellison equity commitment and guarantee will be from the Lawrence Ellison revocable trust, not from Larry Ellison himself.
21:01
The offer points out that the trust is rich.
21:03
The Ellison Trust has financial resources well in excess of what would be required to meet its financial obligations under the equity commitment letter, including many other assets and financial resources available to it.
21:15
Record and beneficial ownership of approximately 1. 16 billion >> Wow.
21:19
shares of Oracle stock with a market value of approximately 252 billion as of the date of this offer to purchase, but as the name says, it's revocable.
21:28
This seems extremely fixable.
21:31
Have Larry Ellison signed the commitments personally? Yep.
21:34
>> William Cohan reports that the whole situation is trains passing in the night and quote, "The Ellison's believe they can still be sued for specific performance to fund the deal."
21:41
He quotes a person familiar with their thinking saying that there is no financing condition in the deal and Paramount and the Ellison/redbird along with our lenders are legally obligated to close regardless of future financial or business performance at Paramount.
21:57
That is not an impossible thought to convey in a mer in merger papers and yet so far they apparently haven't.
22:03
And then >> back just well I mean the ESG side is a different story I'm sure.
22:09
Uh I don't think it has anything to do with the okay Matt Leavine writes like multiple little blurs.
22:16
Um >> but uh the the real trick is obviously create a revocable trust and name it the irrevocable trust.
22:22
[laughter] >> Can you just do that? >> One simple trick. >> One simple trick.
22:30
>> EA lawyers hate this one simple trick. >> Yeah.
22:33
I >> I am wondering like if this is very common. Yeah.
22:35
Um, I mean Matt Lavine talks about this, but like why did Elon not do this during the Twitter buyout?
22:40
>> That is a good question >> because it says Elon did sign the contract in his name, which he could have just done to the trust and then he could have backed out when he wanted to.
22:48
>> Well, I mean, one thing is like it feels like Elon like just >> rips checks and is was very much just like, "Yeah, I'm good for it. I'm going for it.
22:56
I don't want to play this game at all. Like because I'm all in.
22:58
You have the full faith and credit of the bank of Elon Musk essentially." >> Yeah.
23:04
I mean, also, do we even know that like this is like legally feasible that you can just revoke the trust?
23:08
Like, is that just like 100% totally fine?
23:10
Has that happened before?
23:12
>> Yeah, I that's a good question.
23:12
I don't know if it I don't I actually don't know if it's happened before.
23:16
Um but it certainly seems like something that uh you are going to uh like we we we talked about with like that when you make an offer for a big company there's like the expected value of the close and saying hey we have this backs stop is something that increases the probability that you close that the financing condition is met.
23:40
Uh but then saying, "Okay, we're doing it in a trust or revocable trust," takes that down a little bit.
23:47
But again, there's a world where all of the different capital providers lined up and you're not even talking about trust, revocable, or irrevocable because you never get there because all the different funds are saying are jumping, I I want to get in.
24:05
I I I have to get my stake. I want 10% of this. Here's 10 billion.
24:09
I'm ready to I'm ready to go.
24:11
And so you don't even care about the backs stop or you don't care about the trust because everyone's lining up.
24:14
The only reason that maybe they're in this scenario is because it feels like it feels like Warner Brothers did actually sort of kick the tires on the Paramount deal and get to the end state of evaluating it and saying, "Oh, well, like we've heard, you know, you mentioned Jared Kushner's in.
24:35
Like is Affinity Partners really in?"
24:36
And when they pushed them, Affinity Partners seemed like they might be out. I don't know.
24:40
I don't know exactly what happened, but there's a variety of of stakeholders that came in and the level of it's not just that they were thumbs up, thumbs down.
24:48
There were some that were that people said that they were thumbs up, they wound up being thumbs down.
24:53
Uh some of them were, you know, here and they wound up being there.
24:55
you know, little little bit edgy depending on uh a lot of different folks where it's like, you know, it's like putting together any other financing round like, you know, ideally every every investor that goes into a seedstage company or series A company is like, yes, I'm good regardless of who else is in the round.
25:13
Every once in a while you get VCs who say, "Yeah, I'll sign a term sheet, but term sheets are non-binding, and we'll see how the round pencils out.
25:19
I'll I'll sit on this signature.
25:21
I'm not going to sign this. I'm not going to wire."
25:24
>> Or they would give a a verbal thinking that Sequoia is going to come in, Sequoia doesn't, and then they're like, "Oh," >> or vice versa.
25:31
They give the They give the verbal, they sit on it, they're not wiring, they're maybe leaning back, and then Sequoia comes in or Founders Fun or Andre or someone comes in and then they're like, "Wait, wait, wait.
25:42
You said that I could get 2% of this company for 100K."
25:46
Like, well, like, give me my terms.
25:48
And you're like, "You didn't sign that doc.
25:49
You were very much leaning out."
25:51
I've been in that situation.
25:51
Um it's it's never super fun never super fun conversation.
25:56
Um but yeah, um >> you know it ain't over till the till the bank.
26:02
>> Uh a little bit more from Matt Lavine.
26:05
He's talking about lockups.
26:05
Specifically SpaceX, we all know they're trying to go public at a $1. 5 trillion valuation.
26:12
They want to raise 30 billion of stock uh sorry 30 billion uh via the IPO.
26:16
Um and uh Matt says the raise is not that big relative to the valuation.
26:22
Um but then he says the problem is not the 30 billion, the problem is the other 1. 47 trillion.
26:30
Uh and he goes on to say what happens if 500 billion of SpaceX stock is unlocked like at a single moment and people are like I've been locked up for I have had limited liquidity for >> let's say you're an employee who's been there 10 15 years.
26:46
you're like there could be a kind of a rush to get liquidity.
26:51
And so he goes on to say that um in the conversations that Wall Street has been having with SpaceX, Anthropic and Open AAI, there is some conversations that would create a scenario with um uh I'll just read it specifically.
27:05
Investment bankers are starting to prepare discussing proposed solution to help win deals.
27:09
At least two large banks largely ruled out a standard IPO lockup period of either 90 to 180 days and are discussing how to design a staggered lockup release for companies like the ones I mentioned.
27:22
And then uh he says if you're a shareholder of a trillion dollar private company you're used to getting limited periodic liquidity events where you can sell shares.
27:31
Why would that change when the company goes public?
27:33
So >> pretty interesting.
27:34
um uh >> the dance of taking SpaceX public.
27:37
Uh it's going to be an interesting year for IPOs.
27:41
Uh there's a bunch of great companies that are finally mature enough to potentially go out.
27:46
Uh let me tell you about Vanta.
27:48
Automate compliance and security.
27:50
Vanta's AI [applause] powers everything from evidence collection and continuous monitoring to security reviews and vendor risk.
27:57
Uh there's a there's an article in the Wall Street Journal about a massive IPO.
28:00
Wall Street gets early taste of hot year expected for IPOs.
28:05
Shares of a company called Medline began trading in the biggest new stock listing since 2021.
28:13
Uh, Wall Street is getting a glimpse of what could be the biggest year ever for IPOs in the US after four years of choppiness in the market.
28:19
He didn't even let me get to the number.
28:22
Uh, the medical supply company raised [music] $6.
28:27
3 billion in its stock offering.
28:29
The stock closed at $41 a share.
28:33
That's up 41% from its $29 IPO price. So massive offering.
28:42
It's the biggest IPO since Rivian actually in 2021.
28:44
Uh and uh the ticker is MDLN.
28:51
We're the largest company no one's ever heard of, said the chief executive Jim Bole.
28:56
He said he and his team have spent the past year and a half educating the investment community ahead of the stock offering.
29:03
You got to tell everyone what do you do before before you ask for their money because if you've been operating behind the scenes, no one's going to uh know to invest or be excited.
29:13
So, the offering could help set the stage for some of the most highly anticipated IPOs uh with rocket maker SpaceX, AI company Anthropic, and mortgage giants Fanny May and Freddy Mack among the companies looking at listings in 2026. OpenAI also rumored.
29:30
There's a couple other companies that might go out.
29:31
Um, it isn't just >> Well, there's a bunch of tech there's a bunch of tech darlings that are are look kind of like infants in comparison to to >> but still might be of maturity to go out.
29:46
>> Very notable like companies that are basically at Figma scale. >> Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Or or or even beyond. Yeah.
29:52
Um I mean for a long time, you know, if you're a10 billion dollar company in the tens of billions, the decacorns the any decacorn should be comfortable going out potentially as long as they're not in some crazy R&D cycle and they actually have the the core financials humming at this point.
30:09
Um bankers say their teams have been busy in recent weeks pitching companies to be lead adviser on their IPOs, marking a pickup activity.
30:16
Many startups had assued going public in recent years.
30:20
I'm not sure that's entirely true anymore, said Magdalena Henrik, head of US technology equity capital markets at Bank of America.
30:27
Bankers are hoping Medline, which is backed by Blackstone, Carile, and Helman Freriedman, helps to close out a positive year for um uh positive year for IPOs.
30:39
Well, speaking of Blackstone, uh we have a little Christmas present under the tree. Why don't we open it?
30:47
>> What do we have from Blackstone?
30:47
The good folks over at Blackstone sent us a present and uh and we will open it live on the stream here.
30:56
Um so have you heard that uh uh the CEO of Blackstone Worksman is uh becoming a DJ?
31:08
Goldman Sachs CEO David Solomon gives him gave him a stamp of approval and they sent over this very cool um tape recorder.
31:17
I don't know if this is a real tape recorder.
31:19
I don't know if I have this queued up, but you can maybe hear it. Let's see.
31:33
>> [music] >> They went like super viral for this because they made a entire like >> they basically clowned every startup vibe reel.
31:42
Oh, you you have a cinematic vibe reel.
31:45
>> We had our whole team sing a jingle and filmed it and >> sent it out on a physical >> and then they sent it out on a physical thing.
31:51
Uh this is very very cool. Portable cassette.
31:54
>> Is that Is that made to look like a cassette tape?
31:56
>> I think it's No, I think it's actually a cassette. Yeah. This is crazy. >> Wow.
32:01
I didn't even know we knew how to make >> cassettes.
32:04
This is a very very good drop. Like just as as a drop. It's it's hilarious.
32:08
It also feels like them leaning in because I know that uh the the response to that Blackstone video was was not overwhelmingly [laughter] positive.
32:16
People like what is this?
32:16
Uh but clearly it's an inside joke and like the team finds it funny and they were doing it tongue and cheek and they were having fun with it and they had a lot of a lot of 1980s throwback cameos there. >> That's great.
32:27
Anyway, uh thank you to the good folks over at Bird Blackstone for sending over this.
32:30
Uh and go listen to the full song and watch the video if you haven't already.
32:34
Uh numeral compliance handled numeral worries about sales tax and VAT compliance so you can focus on growth.
32:43
Um in our newsletter today, we uh did a little review of the model wars.
32:48
Um of course our newsletter, you can get it at tbp. com. Tech analysis and news.
32:54
We have a daily oped, top headlines, and more. Sign up at tvpn. com. Uh, so, uh, what a year.
33:02
Just in terms of model releases, August 7th, OpenAI releases, uh, GPT5.
33:08
Uh, September 29th, Enthropic releases Claude Sonnet 4. 5.
33:10
Then the day after, OpenAI releases uh, Sora 2.
33:13
September, the same day, Meta releases the Meta Raybands displays.
33:18
Uh, November 3rd, OpenAI and Amazon announce a partnership valued at 38 billion. November 12th, 5. 1 drops from OpenAI. Yep.
33:30
>> November 17th, XAI releases Croc 4. 1.
33:33
November 18th, Google releases Gemini 3.
33:36
Massive response to that.
33:36
It's crazy that that was just one month ago.
33:38
Um November 20th, Nano Banana Pro comes out.
33:44
Then November 24th, Anthropic releases Claude Opus 4. 5.
33:46
We talked to Schultto about that.
33:49
And then December 1st, Deepseek releases Deepseek Version 3. 2. 2.
33:54
And of course, before the end of the year, OpenAI had to fire back with GPT 5. 2 on December 11th.
33:59
And then December 17th, Google releases Gemini 3 Flash.
34:04
>> Also, today I think uh OpenAI released 5. 2 codecs.
34:08
>> So, like the you know, coding model version.
34:11
>> They're starting to stagger them out a little bit more.
34:13
>> Well, I do I I I >> which I think is smart, right?
34:14
>> which I think is smart, right? I was wondering about this with uh with Logan like do you think that we will do you think there'll be a period where we get on annual release cadences and it's just like oh like the model is like GPT 2026 like I'm running the 26 model or do you
34:31
think it'll be random >> we're not quite at the plateau >> where I think that would make sense like right now we're every company's fighting for market share and like if you can release >> tomorrow that's a lot better than releasing >> but There is a world where there is a world where open AI >> takes 5.1 and 5.2 and says you know what 1 and 5.
34:49
2 and says you know what that's GPT6 that's GPT7 right like they could and people would be like whoa this is like really incremental so they use the 0.
34:59
1 but they also didn't do it's 5. 0. 1 0.
35:01
5.0.1 0.1 >> I think the reason I think the reason that there's so much pressure to launch is there's pressure to be at the top of the benchmarks right in other product categories it's not like there's like this like very specific way that you >> what are you talking about in cars
35:15
Nurburg Ring >> Sure sure I'm talking in like in like enterprise software typically it's not like somebody launches a product and then somebody else launches a product and investors can look at it and be like well okay I think this one is >> just objectively better. Yeah. Yeah.
35:32
>> And and so I think that you know just given the the goal to sit at the top of the benchmarks you know there's going to be a mass >> the benchmark is uh like ARR numbers that you might give to the press or fundraising which you know traditionally done to every 12 to 18 months but sometimes can happen four times in a year. Yeah.
35:51
>> You're a certain company. Uh what do you think?
35:52
Also, I I just want to say um Brandon who wrote the like the piece, he said at the end he said it seems like the doomers, people who believe AI will turn us all into paper clips have been defanged, which is good.
36:01
I disagree that that's true.
36:03
It seems like AI is like I think there's this whole narrative where like oh AI is stagnating. >> Yeah.
36:09
>> It's like bro look at the benchmarks.
36:10
Like it's like >> it's on the trend.
36:13
>> Look at the benchmarks. They're saturating. It's incredible. >> Exactly.
36:16
If the benchmarks are sat I mean what does that tell you?
36:17
Benchmarks are saturating.
36:18
We need we we we don't even have good benchmarks anymore because models are way too good.
36:21
says benchmarks are just as useful as a used piece of toilet paper. >> Exactly. That's the whole point.
36:27
If if models were bad, benchmarks would be useful.
36:31
>> So, I mean the the risk is like is like um there was a moment where just multiplying two really really big numbers together in a in a on a computer like you needed more memory to do like you know a thousand digits times a thousand digits.
36:47
what like like your basic calculator had a limit and then eventually it got to the point where you have enough RAM that this computer here can sit and and I don't know calculate the number of digits in pi to like you know 10,000 digits, right? Probably pretty quickly.
37:08
progress along that line is not necessarily the same line of progress towards like human labor replacement even like we got we got calculators that can calculate any any math perfectly in fractions of a second >> and it was useful in a million ways but no one's calling that like a GI ASI it can do anything and so >> yeah because that's like specific intelligence >> exactly specific intelligence.
37:37
And so and so we've created a bunch more lanes of specific intelligence, >> but people feel still dissatisfied with the fact that yes, the spikes are getting longer, but it doesn't feel like the intelligence is getting any less spikier.
37:53
That's what Brandon's feeling.
37:56
>> Um there's nothing about the benchmarks.
37:59
When you show me a new model card, I'm just like, cool, spiky. The spikes got spikier. Awesome.
38:03
There's nothing where it's like, oh, okay, it's no longer spiky. >> Uh, sure.
38:10
I mean, look, like when I use coding models, they're like way better.
38:14
>> Yeah, that's one of the spikes.
38:16
>> That's one of the spikes. That's spike.
38:18
>> Once you get enough spikes, then like what's the difference between a ton of spikes and, you know, just like a circle, right?
38:23
Like, you know, >> yeah, this is the this is the diagram.
38:26
You've seen the diagram, right?
38:26
Where it's like you have the circle with the little tiny spikes where the >> better.
38:30
>> better. There are benchmarks that like there was um the the vend it was like anthropic vend where Claude runs a vending machine in the beginning of the year they released the the first paper I don't know when it was it was like a couple months ago they released like the first part of the paper and cloud was like horrible it lost a ton of money
38:45
running the vending machine then they I think today they released a new one yeah >> where it's like >> cloud is profitable >> yeah we need to get you a a massive winter coat to get through this AI winter because the AI winter [laughter] is happening dude I'm telling you >> there's no AI winter >> there is there is a there's an I And it's the age of research. Okay. The age Okay. The age of research.
39:03
>> Imagine it's it's like June next year.
39:04
It's hot in the Ultradome.
39:04
Tyler, just keep the coat on, buddy.
39:07
You can't take it off till it's over. >> Till it's over. Uh, no.
39:12
I mean, the the the progress is >> like people want AI to stagnate so bad.
39:18
People So many people want that. >> They do.
39:20
>> And it's not happening, bro.
39:20
[laughter] >> It's like the models are getting better.
39:24
>> Literally, uh, everyone without bags is saying it's stagnating. Well, no. No.
39:29
Because all those people are like, "Oh, like I missed Nvidia or whatever."
39:33
You think you think Carpathy's like, "I missed Nvidia, so I got to go trash AI."
39:38
>> Well, Cararpathy, I think he's not he's very I think he's very excited about what AI is like right now. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
39:43
>> Well, I think we can all agree, Tyler, that it's the age of research, but it's also the age of deals. >> Okay.
39:50
>> We got to talk about We got to talk about Trump media and technology.
39:52
This morning I uh woke up and you know a lot of people that uh you know do like mental health podcasts they say look at your phone within 5 seconds opening your eyes just immediately you know connect to with the internet and just sort of start uh kind of marinating in in all the notifications that you maybe got over the last eight hours.
40:15
That's what I did this morning. I I I open my eyes.
40:17
I immediately grab my phone.
40:19
I see this push notification.
40:21
I think it was from Bloomberg that truth social parent to merge with nuclear fusion firm in a $6 billion deal.
40:30
Uh and I thought I was dreaming still because uh it just seemed insane.
40:37
Trump's been so active this year on the on the deal making side.
40:39
Who would have thought he had another multi-billion dollar deal uh to do this year?
40:46
So, of course, Trump Media and Technology Group, the social media and crypto company part owned by President Trump, said it would develop a utility scale fusion power plant. >> Mhm. >> Fusion, not Fision. >> Correct. Okay.
40:59
>> Uh, President Trump's social media company, which recently expanded into streaming and cryptocurrency, is now entering its fourth act.
41:04
Fusion Power, a promising but still unproven source of alternative energy.
41:11
uh uh DJT and Tay Technologies said Thursday they had agreed to an all stock merger that the company's valued at more than six billion.
41:18
The deal would be a metamorphosis for Trump Media, the money- losing parent company of True Social, uh a social media platform that has struggled to gain market share beyond serving as the main online megaphone for President Trump. Uh Mr.
41:31
Trump is the company's largest shareholder with a large stake worth more than 1 billion that is held in a trust.
41:36
We're trust trust maxing of course managed by uh Don Jr.
41:38
who is a Trump Media board member.
41:41
The company based in Sarasota, Florida has only a few dozen full-time employees and uh has recorded tens of millions of losses in recent years.
41:50
Um the merger with Tay would create one of the first publicly traded nuclear fusion companies.
41:57
According to the release, the company said they begin they intend to begin construction on the first utility scale fusion power plant next year with plans to build additional plants in the future.
42:08
So uh the stock is up of course up pretty dramatically today.
42:11
Uh the CEO over at Mitchell Bendenbower says we've got the tools and the tech and the engineering.
42:20
What we were lacking was the capital.
42:22
So, I did a uh I headed went over to Gemini and got a little background on Tay Technologies. >> Interesting company.
42:30
It's uh the Tay T AE stands for Tri Alpha Energy, which is uh pretty I think a pretty cool name.
42:41
>> It's also good advice if you're a beta.
42:43
Just try being an alpha >> or just rebrand.
42:45
Rebrand rebrand to an alpha.
42:48
>> Yeah, >> actually I I used Yeah, that was I used >> try.
42:51
Try or TR R I not TR R Y. Yeah.
42:55
>> Not try being [laughter] >> try. Okay. >> Try Sigma. Try try whatever works.
43:00
>> Sigma energy would be would be a great name for a small modular reactor company.
43:04
>> I mean there's a there's a trading firm two Sigma and it's two guys.
43:08
>> No, but Sigma lone lone wolf.
43:10
>> You know, you know that they had they had like a founder breakup because they were literally two sigas. >> Well, no.
43:15
Cuz one of them was two sigma. Oh, T.
43:18
>> No, I think the nominative determinism is that is that they you put two lone wolves together and it didn't work and they were fighting constantly.
43:24
So, the two sigma guys broke up.
43:28
>> Um, anyway, so people are going to talk about this.
43:30
>> The company was founded in 1998 and spent over 25 years developing unique approach to fusion that focuses on a a neutronic power energy generation that produces no harmful neutron radiation.
43:43
They have raised from I believe it's Google.
43:46
Google, Chevron, and Goldman Sachs. So, >> wow. Okay.
43:52
>> Great to see them all get some liquidity now or at least, you know, shares in in a company that >> uh uh is is liquid. >> Sure.
44:00
>> Um >> so, does that mean Google is on the Truth Social cap table now?
44:05
>> Google owns a piece of uh >> the president.
44:09
>> I don't I mean, I actually can't.
44:09
It's possible they got some liquidity along the way, but seems more likely that Google is now has a nice slug in in uh DJT >> social. Interesting.
44:20
>> Wait, I didn't even think about that because this is happening at the top co totally >> at DJT.
44:24
So, they own they have exposure to fusion, cryptocurrency, social media, and streaming.
44:32
>> I mean, Google famously never got uh Google circles working.
44:34
uh their their Facebook competitor.
44:38
They they have YouTube obviously a behemoth, but uh in true social networking, you know, they've struggled.
44:45
Maybe this is the foothold for them. Yeah.
44:47
>> Roll in the entire thing at some point.
44:50
>> You know, people are going to talk trash about this like, oh, what is a what is a social network doing building energy assets, but you look at what Amazon's doing building massive data centers where for AWS, Amazon owns Twitch. That's a social network.
45:04
It's a streaming platform.
45:06
What else does Amazon own?
45:08
Well, they own some diesel generators for backup power at the data centers.
45:13
Fusion theoretically cleaner.
45:16
Who would have thought that out of the Silicon Valley tech people, they would be using diesel while the big guy is uh is using clean energy to power his social network. >> Something there. >> Fascinating. Fascinating stuff.
45:31
Let me tell you about fall generative media platform for developers.
45:35
Develop and fine-tune models with serverless GPUs and ondemand clusters.
45:42
>> Trey in the chat says, "This is such a weird deal.
45:44
T AE is a legit company."
45:49
[laughter] >> Maybe they're all legit.
45:50
Maybe they're all going legit. Maybe it works out. I don't know. I mean, Fusion's hard.
45:54
>> What if True Social just puts up monster monster numbers?
45:57
I mean, it's kind of funny.
45:59
>> So hard to call legit right now.
45:59
It really is an interesting uh interesting test given that when I type truth social into my browser, it basic effectively the homepage is just a Donald Trump's profile and they do have a lot of ads on here. >> Mhm.
46:16
>> And uh it'll be interesting to understand like what is this web page actually worth? >> Well, we'll find out.
46:23
I mean, Truth Social I I I think if you went back in time a year or two ago when Truth Social was started, which I believe Trump was out of the office, he was not president when he started it.
46:32
Um, and you asked anyone like what will the what will the terminal value of this asset be?
46:39
Everyone would be like like it's not going to be over a billion dollars.
46:41
And then when it went out, it was like okay, yeah, maybe they expect it, but it's going to like trade down a ton.
46:45
It's like I think it's still a multi-billion dollar company, right?
46:49
DJT, what's the market cap?
46:51
four >> four billion still like that's that's higher than a lot of people thought.
46:55
I >> that's it traded up uh >> almost 40% just today.
47:00
So >> well we were doing a deep dive on the company a year ago.
47:06
So you know you know there's alpha here.
47:09
>> What categories is DJT not in?
47:14
>> Space pharma >> robotics >> robotics oh wait no they're in pharma right >> pharma.
47:18
So, I think TE does have like a biotech division, a life sciences division. Okay.
47:23
>> So, I'm I'm very bullish on them.
47:23
Kind of going into pharma. >> Yeah. >> Yeah.
47:27
You got to go further out in the sci-fi curve.
47:28
No one's pitching a time travel company yet.
47:31
I think that that's an interesting area to get into.
47:33
You know, what happens after you you're traveling through space?
47:37
You must travel through time, the fourth dimension.
47:41
>> I mean, you could break uh time travel into life sciences, right?
47:43
Because you can have the um >> you freeze yourself and you wake up in 20 years.
47:49
You can't go back though. >> Yeah. Dyson sphere.
47:50
No one no one's no one's come out and said we're the company that's going to do the Dyson sphere.
47:56
It's been much more incremental visions.
47:59
>> Uh anyway, >> Truth Social is also getting into the prediction market game.
48:02
Launching a native prediction market feature in the app.
48:06
>> It's crazy that they're not.
48:08
>> I wonder if it'll be like predict trade on what? >> Presumably.
48:11
>> Trade on the content of Trump's next post.
48:15
>> That would be fascinating.
48:16
>> Anyways, very fascinating.
48:16
I mean, it's just an interesting I am interested to see how uh the you know, future presidents approach business, right?
48:23
Uh who was the guy with the peanut farm? >> Jimmy Carter.
48:28
>> He got into a little hot water because of his peanut farm.
48:29
I think he didn't fully divest.
48:32
>> No, he did divest, >> but he still got in hot water.
48:35
>> No, it was it's just remarkable because the peanut farm was so small and so insignificant in the US economy and even in his personal balance sheet.
48:44
the the fact that he was saying, "Look, I don't want any any idea of impropriy.
48:50
So, I'm going to divest from a small peanut farm that I'm like associated with so that no one can say that I'm in the pocket of big peanut or I'm pro peanut or little peanut."
49:04
Uh and so the fact that the the fact that Jimmy Carter uh divested from the peanut farm, he was not he was not, you know, in big oil or railroad baron or associated with banking.
49:14
He had he had very little conflict of interest and he reduced it even further.
49:18
That's always been a sign of like the what what great looks like.
49:23
Uh and it's been a role model for some presidents.
49:25
Some presidents have looked and said like, well, if Jimmy Carter did it this way, I should also do it this way. Yeah.
49:32
Anyway, Gemini 3 Pro, Google's most intelligent model yet, state-of-the-art reasoning, next level vibe coding, and deep multimodal understanding.
49:38
Um, there is a there is a crazy story in the >> Joe Weisenthal, by the way, one one more.
49:45
He says uh sharing that DJT is up 35% uh to a new a 30-day high.
49:50
And Joe says Trump has been in founder mode for a long time, getting all kinds of criticism about the business from people who aren't actually in the arena.
49:58
We I it is it is crazy the degree to which uh he is a successful technology founder truly like you know billions of dollars in market cap.
50:12
>> People can take have their issues with the the president but they cannot deny that they cannot they cannot say with a straight face that he is not a technology >> he's never founded a unicorn tech company.
50:23
>> He's never taken a social media app public. >> You can't say that. >> You can't say that.
50:26
He's never He's never merged with a a nuclear fusion, >> you know, company backed by Chevron, Google, and Goldman Sachs >> for sure.
50:37
>> Uh Dave, have you seen this uh this chart, the AI investment cycle visualized?
50:41
Almost $1 trillion has been invested into AI so far.
50:43
And that may just be the start.
50:45
Look at this graph or this this is such an interesting way to to visualize the flow of money because we see it as these like moments in time.
50:54
from a $10 billion deal here, hundred billion dollar deal deal there.
50:56
Um, this is showing uh the investment over time and you can see uh you know Nvidia flowing to Amazon and uh all the different companies. Where's OpenAI?
51:08
OpenAI is just flowing around.
51:08
It's just a just a cool little like uh you know vis data visualization.
51:15
I thought this is I thought this was fun to look at.
51:17
>> Anyway, >> did you see Brett Adcock has a new startup? >> No. >> Yeah.
51:21
Figure CEO Brett Adcock launches new AI lab with a hundred million in funding. >> Wow.
51:26
Brett Adcock, of course, the CEO of robotics startup Figure AI, who we believe might be >> might have some big news soon based on based on their holiday party, DeadMass, has started a new AI lab called HARK, which will be funded by 100 million of his personal capital, according to a copy of a memo >> Adco sent to figure employees and investors on Thursday seen by Stephanie Palazolo.
51:52
The AI lab will be focused on building human- ccentric AI which can think proactively, recursively, and care deeply about people.
51:58
Hark's first cluster of GPUs went online on Monday. >> Mhm.
52:03
>> The memo said though it couldn't be learned how large the cluster was.
52:06
Adcock will remain the CEO of Figure in addition to his new role at Harkc.
52:08
Hark continues the trend of AI startup CEOs founding new companies while remaining at their old one.
52:15
I remember Richard over at you uh launched a new uh lab himself.
52:23
More broadly, well-known researchers and executives have raised billions of dollars for so-called Neolabs in recent months which hope to exploit new approaches to developing models.
52:34
Uh figure previously raised nearly two billion in funding from investors including Parkway, Nvidia, Microsoft etc.
52:40
So anyways, uh interesting uh interesting that he is diversifying when figures valuation has just been going through the roof.
52:50
>> He also has a a company that does like metal detectors at schools, right?
52:54
Something along those lines.
52:54
Um he is a serial entrepreneur. Um a bunch of stuff.
52:59
Anyway, let me tell you about Finn.
53:01
ai, the number one AI agent for customer service.
53:03
Automate the most complex customer service queries on every channel.
53:07
Um, Tyler clearly has an alt. Tyler Glale.
53:10
Tyler clearly put this in the in the in the show notes. Uh, Tyler, not R.
53:17
Tyler, but this other Tyler says, "Can't wait for this AI bubble to pop so we can all go back to normal, just like how the internet completely disappeared after the dot bubble popped.
53:26
It's another bullish take for AI.
53:28
It's not going anywhere." >> Yes, you agree. >> It's a great take. >> It is a great take.
53:31
And 18,000 people agreed it's a great take.
53:33
I also think it's a great take.
53:35
Um, but This doesn't seem so fast takeoff build, more internet build, which is slow takeoff.
53:44
The internet had a slow takeoff.
53:46
Everyone thought it was going to be the internet is the super highway.
53:47
It's going to be you know a thousandx growth.
53:53
Yahoo is going to be worth a trillion dollars like you know and then you know kind of settled in.
53:57
Took a while for things to to to find use cases, find value but eventually it did transform everything.
54:05
>> But this time it's done.
54:05
I mean, yeah, this time's different, right?
54:07
Well, because this time we have the internet, so it's way faster to do distribution. >> Yes.
54:11
>> I don't want to I don't You weren't even alive [laughter] there, Tyler.
54:13
I don't even want to don't >> I was racking servers in a data center while you were in the cradle.
54:19
[laughter] >> Uh, Melt says, "A lot of naval gazing about venture.
54:26
There are a lot of ways to make a couple hundred million dollars.
54:30
There are a reasonable number of ways to make a billion.
54:32
There are very few ways to make tens of billions of dollars.
54:36
This makes a $1 billion fund with 10x DPI obscenely impressive.
54:38
Is this a subweet of someone in particular?
54:44
Is someone saying this isn't this isn't?
54:47
So several so so Mike Chan says ain't no $1 billion fund doing 10x DPI and Meltzum says several have which is wild.
54:55
>> I'm trying to find in the comments a fund that actually did this and I can't think of any personally.
55:00
I'm I'm sure they're I'm sure they're out there.
55:02
I'm sure they're out there.
55:03
Um but uh >> I don't know.
55:07
It's it's it's Yeah, all of that's impressive. >> Okay.
55:11
More More importantly, this Chinese streamer cut the Apple Vision Pros weight in half using a helium.
55:17
>> That's [laughter] genius.
55:19
I This is This is innovation.
55:19
This is This is crazy innovation. Wow.
55:25
>> Imagine walking into an office and every person there is just locked in with a balloon.
55:29
This is somehow more cyberpunk than just the default.
55:31
Put the big screen on your face. I like this.
55:35
>> And and people say the Chinese can only copy and they can't invent new stuff. >> That's not true. >> Not true.
55:40
>> Completely dis completely uh disproven with this uh vision pro helium balloon.
55:46
>> This would be >> genius.
55:48
>> So imagine just being able to if you're if you're class clown coded, which I [laughter] certainly am.
55:52
Imagine walking around the office and just with a little needle.
55:56
>> No, no, no, no, no, no.
55:56
I think >> this doesn't actually it's not going to hurt them.
55:58
It's still strapped to their head.
56:00
>> But you're popping their balloon then they have to go get more helium and helium is scarce resource. >> True. True.
56:05
But I would hope they look he's got a big canister there. He's got plenty.
56:08
He's got a big >> You should not be popping this. And you know why?
56:11
Because Ty in the chat says this should be a blimp.
56:13
And this is very blimp coded.
56:14
So you should you should allow this.
56:17
>> I want this guy to make a personal blimp.
56:18
It's just a it's just like a a harness you can put on with enough helium to just take you up. >> Yeah.
56:25
I think the Mythbusters did that. Yeah.
56:27
>> You just get a bunch of balloons. Yeah. >> And And it worked.
56:29
>> Did they Doing that and then skydiving down would would be >> would be pretty cool.
56:36
>> You should work on that over over the over the winter break.
56:38
>> Well, whatever you watch in your Apple Vision Pro, make sure it's rereamed.
56:40
One live stream 30 plus destination.
56:45
>> If you want to multiream, go to reream. com.
56:46
Um Um Oh, this is so so funny.
56:49
that Alpha Ton Capital, did you see this?
56:53
Alphon Capital post big news. Alphon, a ton of alpha.
57:00
We got a ton of alpha over here at Alphon Capital.
57:01
We're making a historic $30 million strategic investment in Anderal Industries.
57:06
And they tag them said, "We are investing in the future of defense tech and the convergence of decentralized AI with next-gen national security.
57:15
This is a strategic bet on the companies of the future.
57:19
This unprecedented investment positions Alphaton at the forefront of next generation defense technology infrastructure, marking a pivotal moment in the convergence of public markets and advanced uh national security capabilities.
57:30
NASDAQ Eton and so they're trying to become an anderal like hold co basically or uh treasury treasury company and Palmer [laughter] just quote tweets them into the stratosphere by saying Alphaton is lying. This is not true.
57:46
public heads up to CEO Brittney Kaiser, own your data now, the whistleblower, who is uh Bitcoin Alphon Capital.
57:54
That's the uh I guess that's the owner of this.
57:59
You do not have permission to use my trademarks to dis to defraud your investors.
58:04
Um, and Britney says, "Hey, Palmer, we signed an agreement to purchase economic exposure to andal shares through an SPV and to accumulate more exposure over time and offer access via formal secondaries product.
58:15
Given our network's demand for your innovative tech, I will issue a clarification."
58:19
And Palmer says, "That isn't what you and your company said, though.
58:23
To be extremely clear, Ander has to authorize these types of transfers, and I will not authorize it." Wow.
58:29
Uh and Sarah is there saying so much nonsense fraud happening in these layered SPVS.
58:35
This is such a crazy crazy moment.
58:37
Um >> what is the history of this company?
58:41
So the company went out at $280 per share in December of 2020.
58:46
It's now sitting at exactly 69.
58:54
>> So um >> I wonder what they have been up to.
58:56
But yeah, that that I mean that was a crazy announce.
59:01
It looks like somebody like this looks like an AI bot is just like posting, but this is a public company.
59:08
>> It Yeah, it does look like just some sort of like complete slop scam.
59:10
Like you would assume that you would assume that if you go down this particular funnel, you wind up at like uh hey, you know, like send me some random crypto or something like it it it feels very scammy and it's I mean it, you know, Palmer is sort of calling it a scam, but uh it is a public company, I guess. >> Yeah.
59:31
Uh I'm sure Ander's legal council will really enjoy >> having a nice calm holiday weekend, I'm sure, while they clean this mess up.
59:39
One of many, but it's a champagne problem.
59:44
Let's come back to this later because we have our guests in the reream waiting room.
59:48
While we're bringing them in, let me tell you about cognition.
59:49
The team behind the AI software engineer, Devon, crush your backlog with a personal AI engineering team.
59:55
Merry Christmas to everyone.
59:58
We have Brian Armstrong from Coinbase and T is back on the show.
1:00:01
Uh, so many repeat guests.
1:00:04
It's so great to see both of you.
1:00:06
Congratulations on all the fantastic success.
1:00:08
Brian, would you mind kicking us off with a little highlevel overview of the news? Good to see you. >> Yeah, sure.
1:00:17
Good to see you guys again.
1:00:18
Well, we had a great product event yesterday in San Francisco.
1:00:19
We announced the Everything Exchange.
1:00:22
So, we've got stock trading on there.
1:00:24
We've got prediction markets.
1:00:26
We've got millions of tokens now trading through decentralized uh exchanges.
1:00:29
We've got simple derivatives.
1:00:32
Like we we announced a ton of stuff yesterday and one of the big ones was prediction markets which we're happy to partner with Kaly on. We love Keli.
1:00:40
They've been awesome to work with. >> That's great.
1:00:42
>> And um prediction markets are huge.
1:00:44
They're an important asset class for people who are trading them but it's also a way for people to get information about what's going to happen in the world.
1:00:51
So it's kind of an alternative to traditional media. It's entertainment. It's everything.
1:00:54
And uh yeah, Ki's awesome.
1:00:57
Uh, so talk to me about how the Koshi integration actually works.
1:01:01
Is it more like is this a B2B deal?
1:01:03
Will a Coinbase customer actually be seeing the Kali logo?
1:01:08
Will they will will they need if they have two accounts or the accounts linked?
1:01:12
How are you thinking about kind of the integration kind of taking shape over the next year or however you can talk about it? >> Yeah.
1:01:20
Well, it's a white labelled integration and Tara can talk more about his strategy of being a provider to lots of different companies.
1:01:26
So it made it really easy to integrate.
1:01:27
I mean it's not an exclusive arrangement, right?
1:01:29
So we can integrate with other ones. We could launch our own.
1:01:32
But for right now, we're very happy building on top of Koshi.
1:01:34
It's allowed us to get to market really quickly.
1:01:37
>> And from a Coinbase point of view, I'd say just, >> you know, Tradfi and crypto is intersecting or you could say another way to say it would be the crypto is just eating all financial services.
1:01:44
So Coinbase is the leader in the space.
1:01:48
We've got the most trusted brand.
1:01:48
We've got the most deep crypto expertise.
1:01:52
We've got we're storing more crypto than any other company in the world by far.
1:01:55
about $500 billion of assets.
1:01:55
And so if they can trade everything where their assets reside, it's our key to winning.
1:02:03
>> Uh Tar, take me through uh where like how this plays into your growth strategy, your growth uh trajectory for the next year.
1:02:12
Is this just a new way, a new top of funnel?
1:02:15
Is this actually building up more liquidity, opening up different markets?
1:02:19
Are we going to see different uh koshi markets because of this partnership?
1:02:24
uh how do you think things are going to evolve over the next year?
1:02:29
>> Yeah, maybe let me answer actually at a personal level.
1:02:30
You know, I don't know if you saw Wana Street yesterday, >> which is funny.
1:02:33
The first time we actually both interfaced with Coinbase was when we got the $100 of free crypto [laughter] >> in our freshman year at MIT. >> Amazing.
1:02:42
>> You know, we had to sign up.
1:02:42
We got the $100 and like, you know, uh a decade later, uh we're we're partnering with Coinbase.
1:02:48
Just like an amazing kind of personal moment.
1:02:50
But from a person from a company perspective, our goal has been sort of there's the first party product, the cash.
1:02:55
first party product, the cash.com, but you know at the same time as building an exchange and each of these products require liquidity and liquidity has a bit of a sort of this aspect of more liquidity begets more liquidity and as
1:03:06
you partner with sort of brokerages or you know large platform with as Brian said like huge customer base, huge deposits that brings more flow to the exchange which improves the liquidity and thus the product for everybody else um including you know Coinbase itself. So, we're very excited about this
1:03:21
So, we're very excited about this partnership.
1:03:22
Um, you know, I believe, you know, there's going to be like a long kind of range of markets available on Coinbase um that people can participate in and um uh uh over time we're going to be adding increasingly more markets.
1:03:34
Um so, lots lots of work to do. This is just the start.
1:03:40
uh how like you guys spend a ton of time talking to users and I also feel like you guys have both gone viral for different things that you've talked about related to prediction markets over the last over the last couple weeks and everybody online is going to form their opinion of why prediction markets are good or bad or uh this or that but like
1:03:59
how uh yeah m maybe I just kind of wanted to understand like how how how consumers feel uh maybe on your side Brian I'm I'm I'm assuming like you you and the team spend a bunch of time talking to people and understanding what what users want out of prediction markets on the Coinbase app and and what they're most excited about. >> Yeah. Well, obviously sports is such a >> Yeah.
1:04:19
Well, obviously sports is such a big category that is driving a lot of demand right now and I think that that's an important use case that we see from our customers that there's demand for that.
1:04:28
Um, you know, I know I think there's a lot of open questions about how that's going to be treated in society and go through the courts and everything.
1:04:34
And, you know, we think ultimately there the CFTC will have federal preeemption here.
1:04:37
Um and a bunch of states are, you know, a little grumpy about that, but that's fine.
1:04:41
Um the there but prediction markets is much broader than just sports, right?
1:04:45
It's people betting on um you know economic indicators and trying to figure out like is the Suez Canal going to be open uh next month and uh political outcomes and I think like the number of markets could just be dramatically higher and like 1% of people are using it as an asset class to trade but like 99% of people looking at these are using it as a way to figure out what's going to happen in the world next.
1:05:10
So it's actually broader.
1:05:10
It's something like an alternative to traditional media.
1:05:14
traditional media. I think like actually Tar told me a really powerful idea which is that policy makers could actually use this to determine what are the best policies to implement right like let's say you're trying to put out some policy to try to build more housing in San Francisco or to reduce unemployment you
1:05:30
could actually put this on a prediction market get real signal from the market about what would happen if these were actually implemented and then use that to choose the best policy so >> I think prediction markets are a really powerful tool >> that that example in particular how like who are the market participants in that situation? Because I could imagine I I
1:05:46
situation? Because I could imagine I I think a lot of people's like big big concern is that you end up with uh >> is it like like >> like if I'm if I'm a big if I'm a big housing developer or something like that I I could potentially get in like you know try to influence policy through like sort of like trading that market
1:06:08
and maybe so I don't know I I think part part of why like you got uh anybody in the predict prediction market space keeps going viral is like in any of these situations I feel like there ends up being um like it's easy to imagine like some kind of negative externalities, but I guess that's the case for all new technology. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah.
1:06:28
Well, Tar should talk more about it, but I think the game theory is so interesting because there's both there's parties on both sides who stand to gain or lose.
1:06:35
And if you really believe that the housing market would be better for your business, whatever, you can you can go invest in that that contract.
1:06:40
But if you're wrong, you stand to lose a bunch of money.
1:06:44
So, it's actually the best signal that you can get with people having real skin in the game.
1:06:47
Cuz think about what's the alternative.
1:06:48
It's essentially pollsters like running around and surveying people.
1:06:52
And there's kind of like people's revealed preference versus their stated preference.
1:06:58
Like sometimes people will state, "Oh, my preference is X."
1:07:00
But the revealed preference turns out to be actually something different because there's real skin in the game.
1:07:05
So, I think prediction markets have much stronger signal than traditional polling.
1:07:09
But I don't know, T, you're the expert here.
1:07:11
What's What do you think?
1:07:13
We've dealt with this a lot, right?
1:07:13
Back last year when we were um fighting the government to legalize election markets and we won that lawsuit.
1:07:18
The criticism was could people kind of use money to influence the the odds, move them up or down in and either way.
1:07:25
And you know, the the best argument for that is like, well, if you really wanted to sort of influence the perception of who's going to win an election or, you know, whether a certain policy is good or bad, you would influence the polls. It's super easy. >> There's no cost.
1:07:40
you can sample in a certain way.
1:07:42
You can there's all sorts of way where you can bias it.
1:07:45
>> Um or you can go on TV and say a bunch of things which is how most of us get informed about what's happening in the world today, right?
1:07:50
Like you can tweet or say a bunch of things with no skin in game or repercussions.
1:07:54
And like Brian said, >> the elegant thing about prediction markets is there's a very strong monetary incentive to be truthful and a very strong monetary disincentive to lie.
1:08:06
>> You know, people don't lie when money's involved.
1:08:08
And so that's how over time prediction markets tend to be a more accurate gauge about what's going to happen.
1:08:12
But in in this specific example about what we should do when it comes to certain policies. >> Yeah.
1:08:17
And what you said uh we we can certainly uh you know because the the debate around which markets are uh genuinely sort of valuable and and necessary and all that stuff will continue for a long time.
1:08:30
But >> is there a meaningful distinction there around like positive some markets versus zero sum markets?
1:08:35
It feels like that might be sort of some of the vibe shift that's happening is like if you if you if you create a financial product that allows people to invest in this the you know the American stock market broadly it's gone up historically it's most likely positive sum but you know there can only be one winner of the Super Bowl and so it's sort of a zero sum market.
1:08:59
Is that a reasonable like framework to think about uh where the activity is shifting?
1:09:05
we're shifting from maybe more positive some markets to zero sum or is that not a factor?
1:09:10
>> I I I mean Brian let me know what you think but like I don't think so.
1:09:12
I mean >> the derivatives market so options or futures or all of these markets have historically been zero sum. >> Okay. Yeah. >> When you buy, right?
1:09:19
And and but they're still very useful. >> Yeah.
1:09:23
>> And you know people usually criticize these market.
1:09:24
The main criticism is they're speculators. Yeah.
1:09:26
People that are sort of like speculating on an outcome and >> Y >> and that's okay because without speculators you don't get the benefits.
1:09:32
You don't get the price and forecasting benefits.
1:09:34
benefits. And if there are certain people that want to hedge on something like they are adversely impacted by something going on like I don't know Brexit happening or election going a certain way or the other sports markets
1:09:44
which happens uh pretty often >> they kind of need the liquidity and and so the healthy balance is basically balance between sort of people that like drive usefulness out of the markets and speculators and that's how any of these traditional markets operates. >> Yeah. Yeah. I think I think one thing >> Yeah. Yeah.
1:09:57
I think I think one thing that's undeniable is that it's it's a it's a very entertaining experience just to use the data like scrolling and trying to understand uh and this idea of of you know having having visibility into things that could become the future headlines of the world and I I appreciate that that is sort of a public benefit by that is created through uh people that are choosing to trade these markets.
1:10:23
Do you have any insight into uh I mean Brian, you've done a great job at uh running a firm that winds up servicing institutional investors as well and institutions uh in addition to consumers.
1:10:36
And uh there's been some viral chatter around uh prediction markets potentially either replacing or augmenting insurance products.
1:10:45
And the initial reaction to that was like, wait, instead of just getting like fire insurance, I have to be like trading a contract every single day.
1:10:52
But I was actually thinking about like maybe in the future there's a new insurance firm that's using some sort of prediction market under the hood.
1:11:01
Have you thought about what the the role of institutions in a world where the liquidity around prediction markets is increasing?
1:11:08
uh how do institutions come in and actually maybe build products around prediction markets that have value to a different consumer? >> Yeah.
1:11:18
Well, just zooming out, I mean, you're correct.
1:11:19
Coinbase is serving multiple different customer segments.
1:11:22
So, like the Coinbase retail app is what a lot of people know us for.
1:11:24
That's probably the most comparable to Robin Hood for instance, but we also have product for businesses.
1:11:29
We have product for institutions that's the leading.
1:11:31
We have a developer platform.
1:11:33
We have a self-custodial wallet.
1:11:34
So, we're doing a lot of different things on the uh prediction market for insurance point of view.
1:11:41
I mean, that's an interesting idea.
1:11:42
Actually, I hadn't looked too much into that.
1:11:44
I think institutions are going to start trading prediction markets.
1:11:47
I doubt that'll be the the first place they go, but I could see them using that over time.
1:11:52
>> Yeah, I uh yeah, it's it's it's clearly like we're at the very early stages of all this.
1:11:58
Um I I am interested in some of the other uh the other Coinbase launches.
1:12:03
Can you take us through um some of the other stuffs particularly uh Coinbase Advisor?
1:12:08
I'm interested in uh uh in just anytime a big company has a ton of data and is and is actually surfacing something that's AI powered.
1:12:18
Um how do you think about delivering that product?
1:12:20
What were the trade-offs that you made and uh and how will you be measuring success? Yeah.
1:12:25
So, Coinbase Advisor is there to help you manage your financial life.
1:12:29
And it can ingest all the information from your portfolio.
1:12:32
It also knows your preferences around risk tolerance.
1:12:34
And you can do anything in there from asking it to, hey, help me build a better portfolio to earn more yield or look for opportunities in the market around X, Y, or Z.
1:12:46
But it can also prompt you with things that you might have not even known to ask about. Right?
1:12:49
So every day it's out there kind of ingesting new information on the internet with some context about what you need and want and it'll present opportunity to you at time about macro events happening in the market which might create trading opportunities.
1:13:04
So I think just broadly we think that AI is useful for it's kind of a barbell right it's useful for a segment of people who might not have as much financial literacy as they want or how to maybe maybe not even understand how to use all of these tools.
1:13:17
Um, but it's also powerful for advanced traders who just want to eliminate repetitive tasks and toil that are everybody has to deal with in their financial life, right?
1:13:27
So AI is disrupting every business out there like financial services is no exa no exception and we want to make sure we're leading on that front.
1:13:37
You mentioned uh uh preeemption.
1:13:37
Are can you both maybe give me a little tour of um any expectations or what you're looking for uh in Washington in 2026?
1:13:54
Um what are you watching?
1:13:54
What are you what do you think the US government needs to get right for your industries to succeed in 2026?
1:14:02
>> Well, I'll happy to start and then t I'll turn it to you. But I Yeah.
1:14:04
The main thing Coinbase is focused on is actually getting market structure legislation passed.
1:14:08
So you may recall like the Clarity Act went through the House already.
1:14:12
It got a strong bipartisan vote.
1:14:13
The Senate is now deliberating in the Senate A and Senate Banking Committees their own draft text for market structure legislation.
1:14:19
So that would be a landmark piece of legislation if it goes through to complement the Genius Act which went through for stable coins earlier this year.
1:14:27
So that's where we're primarily focused and we're it's looking positive that in early 2026 the Senate committees will vote on that and fingers crossed.
1:14:36
Now there's a whole other separate work stream around prediction markets but I don't know Tar you want to touch on that?
1:14:40
>> Yeah Brian I I know you have to jump so feel free uh to take off.
1:14:42
Uh uh I think you had a hard out but um you're w you're welcome.
1:14:48
>> I'm good for a few minutes. >> Yeah.
1:14:49
Tar Tar, I'd love to hear uh from from a regulatory standpoint how how you're looking at what you're monitoring.
1:14:57
Yeah, I mean I think the the state of the world right now is actually relatively clear, at least in our uh shared views.
1:15:02
Um we just started and launched a coalition on prediction markets uh a week ago and you know there's a number of participants um in it including Coinbase.
1:15:10
Um and really kind of it's all about clarifying and making sure that everybody understands that financial markets are regulated at the federal level and not a state-by-state thing.
1:15:20
Um, and yes, you know, as financial markets expand and they kind of touch more people, as you build financial markets that are sort of relatable to a larger audience, there are going to be some interests are going to get ruffled, including some state interests, uh, casinos or others.
1:15:32
Um, and so it's not too surprising there's sort of opposition.
1:15:37
It usually means that we're on to something big.
1:15:38
Um, and you know, there's renovation happening.
1:15:42
Um, so really I think as the court sort of like the whole process kind of plays out, it's about sort of proving our side of the case and I think that's going pretty well so far.
1:15:49
Um, and then educating policy makers about what this is really about, how it works, how it's regulated at the federal level, um, so that they understand it. >> Makes a lot of sense.
1:15:59
Well, congratulations on the partnership, guys, and and all the launches, Brian.
1:16:03
Uh, you guys have both had a very big years.
1:16:05
So, >> yeah, we barely scratched the surface.
1:16:07
There's like five more things we didn't get to uh that you watched just yesterday, but uh you know uh it's it's the end of the year.
1:16:13
So uh hope you all have a fantastic holiday season and hope to see you both on in 2026.
1:16:21
>> We'll talk to you soon. >> Thanks guys.
1:16:23
The Coinbase team's firing on all cylinders, so it was cool to get a bunch of those announcements out and people can check out the live stream if they haven't seen it yet. So >> fantastic. Thanks so much. >> Fantastic. >> Catching up, guys. Cheers. >> Cheers.
1:16:34
Um, let me tell you about Figma.
1:16:37
Think bigger, build faster.
1:16:37
Figma helps design and development teams build great products together.
1:16:41
Um, >> back to >> Okay, now we got to get to chew by. Chew by. This is the new phrase.
1:16:47
This is the new word you got to learn.
1:16:50
>> People know people know chopped.
1:16:52
People know >> Bushwick says, uh, this is a screenshot.
1:16:57
I don't know if it's hers, >> but uh, yeah.
1:16:59
So it's re uh recently invented the word chubai which is when something is both chopped and also spiritually dubai.
1:17:06
Examples so house goyard >> Pandora carbone kith drop your chew by things in the comments.
1:17:16
>> You know I learned I learned about Kith from this show.
1:17:20
from this show. you we we were doing cars for various personas and you said a Kith BMW M5 or something they sort of collab and I had I have no idea what you meant by that but now I know now I know from this it's chopped and spiritually
1:17:36
>> may as well be a a BMW so house I got to say I think it's spiritually >> very English I mean that's obviously the origin of it but uh but yeah again again the >> but is England spiritually Dubai now who knows [laughter] It's possible. >> Uh they're they're
1:17:52
>> Uh they're they're >> Van Clee.
1:17:55
They're saying >> you got to go through the you got to go through the comments here.
1:17:57
Cardier love bracelet dry bar soul cycle. There's oat milk.
1:18:01
>> I know it's not you know >> oat milk is definitely Chubai. >> Chewy.
1:18:05
Better to be Chewy than just chopped though. >> I don't. Yeah.
1:18:08
But also I don't I don't want to up >> there's a lot of great things about Dubai.
1:18:13
You can rent an SF90 for the day for like a grand.
1:18:16
H >> I did that at one point during F1 in in 2020 2022.
1:18:24
>> Foreshadowing if you ever fall off.
1:18:26
People are going to be calling you Chew by for sure. >> Chew by.
1:18:29
>> Uh no, I mean like being able to drive around a at the time a a $750,000 car for >> Okay.
1:18:38
Massive Balenciaga sneakers.
1:18:38
I saw these at breakfast this morning. Are those to buy?
1:18:44
>> They're the >> I don't think so.
1:18:45
chunkiest kind of rattiest sneakers and John was just shocked and I had to you you kind of predicted >> that they were like technically >> nice or expensive footwear. >> Yeah.
1:18:59
>> But uh you you were really processing that for a while.
1:19:02
>> Well, it was like they either came from that or they came from like uh like a a gift shop at a at a at a Six Flags. It was one or the other.
1:19:10
And I was sort of I was sort of dialing it in.
1:19:12
And I was like, it could it could be it could be Six Flags gift shop tier shoe or it could be something extremely exclusive that needed to be waited in line for and cost thousands of dollars. And it was the latter.
1:19:24
Anyway, Julius AI, the AI data analyst that works for you.
1:19:27
Join millions who use Julius to connect their data, ask questions, and get insights in seconds.
1:19:32
Um, Peter Aiel is Amazon's new AGI head.
1:19:36
Teapot needs no introduction to him as GDP.
1:19:39
Uh he is a pioneer in robotics and deep reinforcement learning.
1:19:44
He has 231,000 citations.
1:19:48
He's a professor at UC Berkeley.
1:19:50
Uh he is neither Chopped nor Dubai. He is Berkeley.
1:19:55
>> He's uh number 28 on the medicine list. >> Let's go. >> There you go.
1:20:00
>> Actually very you got to do an update.
1:20:03
>> Didn't get that mentioned here.
1:20:03
Uh but I love that uh that bookworm bookworm r uh engineer bookworm engineer uh GDP here uh is giving a little bit more on him says uh he has been Amazon's distinguished scientist and vice president and scholar since 2024 focused on advancing AI and robotics.
1:20:23
He has advised legendary doctoral candidates like Chelsea Finn of physical intelligence and John Scholman exopai exanthropic and now co-founder of thinking machines. He's an absolute dog.
1:20:37
Let's give it up for Peter Aal the new head of API at Amazon.
1:20:39
Really fantastic news and bookworm engineer.
1:20:42
Thanks for putting this on the timeline.
1:20:46
I appreciate you sharing this news.
1:20:47
But also I was thinking about bookworms.
1:20:48
The word bookworm, like what did that say when they started using >> chewing through books? >> Is that what it is?
1:20:57
Or is it like they saw books as slop?
1:20:59
They saw books as, you know, oh, you're a bookworm.
1:21:02
You're worming around on the ground. You're a slug.
1:21:07
>> I looked up the etmology of bookworm. Give it to me.
1:21:10
>> People who read too much comparing them to actual insects that burrowed into and damaged books. >> It's brain rot.
1:21:15
It's the pre It's the original brain rot. >> It's not. It is. >> No. No. No, it's not.
1:21:19
These are like if you had a So if you somebody leaves a bunch of books in a shed, for example, the bugs are going to chew into them.
1:21:26
I think that's what >> Yes. But it was derogatory. >> Termite. >> It was derogatory.
1:21:32
>> I think of it as saying you read too many books. You need to touch grass.
1:21:33
You need to stop reading books. Go outside. What?
1:21:37
>> The very hungry caterpillar. >> Yes. Yes. Yes.
1:21:39
>> That's how I imagine a bookworm.
1:21:39
Just just chomp and just >> Yes. Yes. Yes. That is the activity.
1:21:42
And someone who has brain rotten is on TikTok all day.
1:21:46
They are chewing through the feed for sure.
1:21:47
But when you say someone has brain rot, it's it's a pjorative. It's negative.
1:21:53
>> Well, the only thing is a bookworm.
1:21:53
I never saw that as as like a negative.
1:21:57
>> That's because we think of books as high art.
1:21:59
We think of them as >> I was saying at some point maybe people were saying >> you need you need to cool it with the books, brother.
1:22:04
You need to get outside, touch grass, you go ride a horse, >> go till the >> go till the fields. Exactly.
1:22:08
Why are you so obsessed with these books?
1:22:10
This new technology is oneshotting you. Oh, amazing book.
1:22:14
You're lost in the world of the books. >> Exactly. Exactly. Get outside. Go to the forest. Uh I don't know. I I the bookworm thing.
1:22:22
It makes me feel that at one point books were um uh we're I mean there's that famous picture of everyone on the subway reading this reading the newspaper and it's like oh people are so absorbed with the newspaper.
1:22:33
Like why can't they just log off and like talk to each other?
1:22:36
Because they used to talk to each other then you gave them a newspaper.
1:22:38
They're like newspaper is better than making a friend over here.
1:22:42
Anyway, >> I I wonder I'm a graphite. dev warm. Graphite. dev Yeah.
1:22:46
Code review for the age of AI.
1:22:48
Graphite helps teams on GitHub ship higher quality software faster. What do you wonder?
1:22:54
>> Oh, uh just this idea just this idea that there was a point in the future where everyone if in public spaces like trains, buses, planes, etc.
1:23:02
was just >> just talking the whole >> A point in the past. >> Yeah. Point.
1:23:08
When that technology existed, the written word also existed, which implies that people probably kind of always had something that they were >> like, can you imagine you you're sitting down on a train and you have like this book that you've been so excited to read. >> Yeah.
1:23:23
What books were >> That's true. >> Yeah.
1:23:26
So, the person the person next to you is >> like excited.
1:23:29
I want to talk for five hours with strangers today.
1:23:32
Like the person with the book is going to be thinking, hey, >> I came here to read this book.
1:23:37
Horses are older than books.
1:23:39
There was a moment when it was like, "Hey, we're going to go over there. Lock in. We're riding together."
1:23:45
And no, you don't have a book to read. You have to talk to me.
1:23:49
[laughter] >> You don't have a phone.
1:23:50
You don't have a VR headset with a balloon attached.
1:23:54
>> You don't even have a book.
1:23:54
You just got me and your horse, your my horse, your horse.
1:23:59
You got me and you and we're hanging out and talking.
1:24:01
And that's the original touching grass that we lost ever since the invention.
1:24:05
People don't People don't know how to commute.
1:24:06
I wonder if you I wonder if there >> I like you focus on the commute. >> No, no.
1:24:13
I'm specifically You just got me thinking no one commutes to work with a horse anymore.
1:24:19
>> We don't know how to do >> and [laughter] in some ways you could set up kind of like a desk on a you know on the top and you could be getting some emails done.
1:24:28
>> Also underrated horses effectively self-driving.
1:24:31
>> That's what I'm saying.
1:24:31
You have self-driving technology. >> It's here. >> Self-driving.
1:24:34
You have horses that are just >> self-driving >> because you can just say, "Hey, boy, go home. >> Go home."
1:24:40
>> And the And the horse knows. >> Park. >> Hey, >> park.
1:24:42
>> I I think we got to bring them back. >> Bring them back. >> Return to Privy.
1:24:45
Privy makes it easy to build on crypto rail.
1:24:48
Securely spin up white label wallets, sign transactions, and integrate onchain infrastructure all through one simple API.
1:24:53
Uh unlike Meta, Microsoft, or Apple, Amazon now has one of the best AI researchers in the world.
1:25:02
This is Pedro Domingos also shouting out Peter Aiel. Uh, everyone loves it. It's fantastic news.
1:25:07
Um, Invest Like the Best has some uh has a clip here about Domino's Pizza.
1:25:12
It's the best performing stock. >> Yeah.
1:25:16
So, Henry, >> can we play this? >> Ela Boen.
1:25:20
>> Um, let's >> play this clip.
1:25:22
>> What was the best small cap company over that 10-year period in the 2010s?
1:25:25
Well, actually, it was Domino's Pizza.
1:25:27
Why was Domino's so good?
1:25:29
Well, if you look at the pizza market in the United States, when Domino's basically started its run, you basically had a third of the market that was like local.
1:25:40
And then the the other third we know, right?
1:25:43
There's the nationals, Domino's, Papa John's, Little Caesars, others.
1:25:47
And then the middle third, there used to be in DC this place called Arman's that had had about 30 places and they had local or geographic scale but they didn't have the scale of Dominoes and they didn't have great pizza.
1:26:04
And what happened was when Domino's started its run, well first of all it started by basically making the product a little bit better.
1:26:10
But if you talk to Patrick Doyle, you know, who was CEO at the time and you really study it, what they started doing was if there's three value equations in pizza, it's quality, value, and convenience.
1:26:22
>> So Chad is saying that Domino's good.
1:26:22
I feel like Domino's is pretty good.
1:26:24
I like Domino's >> in technology.
1:26:29
We can make convenience a lot better.
1:26:32
And so they really invested in their app. >> Yeah.
1:26:35
Gives every few months the Domino's chart goes viral. It's a classic.
1:26:39
classic. very early on they could then target that customer more efficiently with couponing what have you drive scale through that box and then when you basically do something well right you improve the product probably was slightly above average you really iterate on convenience and now you have a direct relationship with those customers all of a sudden actually the
1:27:01
brand halo started getting a little bit better right because and you put all that together against a wonderful business model the franchise business model which is you know ROI light and often those are the best stocks when you go study the markets because you're already in a in a physical world business where the technology advantage transitions into a physical mode advantage or distribution or scale advantage. That's one of the patterns
1:27:26
That's one of the patterns we've ser we've observed.
1:27:28
We call that you know the good to great thesis internally.
1:27:34
>> Domino's pizza tracker incredibly underrated. It really is.
1:27:38
It really is one of the best pieces of software in history. Uh Domino's. Yeah, it's interesting.
1:27:48
I mean, it's a $15 billion company today.
1:27:54
Been kind of all over the place over the last five uh five years, but all time is truly exceptional.
1:28:00
Uh, moving on, we can pull up this uh landing page that Reggie James is highlighting over at Uni Tree.
1:28:10
We have the Unree H2 Destiny Awakening.
1:28:16
This uh copy goes pretty hard.
1:28:16
You got to give him that.
1:28:19
Uh Tyler, how do you rate it?
1:28:22
>> Yeah, I mean it looks it's reminiscent of the um I I don't want to get it wrong, but there's like the Hindu like gods, right?
1:28:28
They have a bunch of arms. Yeah. Am I getting this right? Yeah.
1:28:33
>> The face is also very scary.
1:28:33
The [laughter] the first unitry does not have that kind of >> scary.
1:28:39
They um Let's hit the gong for the most sus looking.
1:28:44
>> That gong >> most sus looking humanoid uh face to date. They did it. They did it.
1:28:49
Uh I was already in favor of banning the sale of Uni Tree in the United States.
1:28:55
Of course, now that I see the face of the H2, I'm even more in [laughter] >> I I heard a rumor that there might be some bands coming for something or other. Uh which >> Yeah.
1:29:06
So, I'm I'm looking at the site.
1:29:08
Uh it's like $30,000, which is still >> uh from everything we've heard at least, it seems much cheaper still than American.
1:29:14
[laughter] >> That is such an insane landing page.
1:29:17
>> I mean, look at some of the other Can we click through?
1:29:19
You see some of these other ones?
1:29:21
There's there's this Uni Tree H1 on the website that has these like red fans on its hands.
1:29:26
If you just pull up the website >> and it it's very easy to imagine them has saws.
1:29:36
>> Team, how how are we doing pulling this up? >> Hands. There we go. >> Okay.
1:29:39
No, go to the homepage unit. com. >> Mhm.
1:29:43
>> Go back and then press this the arrow on the side. >> Oh, keep going. >> These ones. Look at that.
1:29:48
[laughter] >> Why is it spinning?
1:29:50
No, I think they're I think they're like decorative.
1:29:51
Like it's clearly doing some type of celebration. >> It holds pizza.
1:29:56
>> But imagine if that thing had saws on its hands and it's just walking around.
1:30:01
>> It's going to be pretty >> very sketchy.
1:30:03
>> At the same time, I want to fight one of these so badly [snorts] because I want to know actually how far we are from it being able to kill me because I think I still have the edge.
1:30:14
Even if it had some blades or something, I think I could just kick it really hard in the chest and it just goes down. blades.
1:30:20
Well, they're still very screw.
1:30:22
>> Yeah, they're small and they don't weigh that much. How much does it weigh? I think I got size.
1:30:25
I mean, to be fair, I'm big, but I I I I do think I do think I could take one of those down pretty easily.
1:30:32
>> Okay, so >> that would be an amazing montage just for the next for the next 10 years.
1:30:34
For the next 10 years, you fight a humanoid robot every January and we just see the progress.
1:30:42
>> Yeah, I think we should sneak me into one of those robot fighting leagues and I just get in the octagon with them, just take it down.
1:30:46
And they're like, "That's not the point.
1:30:47
Why'd you destroy our Unit Tree?
1:30:49
Be like, I thought this was what it was supposed to do. Uh, >> interesting.
1:30:52
Gabe says, "Bill Gurly on the Tim Ferrris pod said Unit Tree didn't want outsiders to check out their factory."
1:30:58
[laughter] That could be that could >> Why are you leaking that? That's insane.
1:31:03
>> Well, I I mean, that's that's fair. >> That's very funny.
1:31:07
>> Uh, well, it could be two reasons.
1:31:07
One is they're not making that many and it's all by hand.
1:31:12
The other is they have some type of insane alpha that they don't want to share. >> Yeah.
1:31:17
Oh, there's a bunch of reasons or I don't know.
1:31:21
Anyway, tell me uh let me tell you about profound.
1:31:23
Get your brand mentioned in CHP.
1:31:25
Reach millions of consumers who just use AI to discover new products and brands.
1:31:29
Um Alex Rmpal says, "Sometimes the market for something done very well is a hundred times the size of the market something done uh 100 times the size of the market for something done." Okay.
1:31:40
Um >> yeah, very interesting. I think about this.
1:31:44
I mean I'm trying to think of examples.
1:31:47
I think of this in the context even just of the power law right you have like the best company in a category being worth a hundred times.
1:31:53
But uh this also I I feel like can happen where maybe there's no market for something at all >> and then somebody comes in and makes something great and suddenly >> suddenly >> I mean that's certainly that's certainly the the entire story of AI which is probably what he was uh you know thinking of uh was just the fact that uh >> yeah chatbots chat went through a hype cycle and now they're actually good and they're and it's a huge category.
1:32:21
I mean, yeah, we went through a chatbot boom back in like 2017. Do you remember those? Yeah.
1:32:28
And I mean, the market cap, I'm sure there were some chatbot companies that like delivered some value.
1:32:34
I mean, when you use like the American Airlines app, like there's still like some Q&A, some business logic of like phone trees essentially are chat bots.
1:32:42
Uh, and I'm sure some of those companies are worth hundreds of millions of dollars.
1:32:46
Some of them there might even be a few unicorns there, but it's certainly not this like insane power law outcome.
1:32:52
Uh, now it is because we went from uh very poorly done chat bots to [laughter] amazing revolutionary chatbots.
1:33:01
What are you laughing at? 8.
1:33:02
com exceptional sleep without exception.
1:33:04
Sleep fall asleep faster, sleep deeper, wake up energized.
1:33:06
Also in the in the comments, Alex Rampel uh post somebody put example eight which is hilarious and awesome.
1:33:13
I just seen this post from from Ben. >> Yeah. Which [laughter] one?
1:33:18
>> I put it in the timeline at the bottom of the timeline. Pull it up.
1:33:19
Ben says, "Imagine looking for a new show and finding this."
1:33:23
[laughter] >> Yeah, it's so good.
1:33:31
>> I was just laughing at like, "Yeah, the the sack in the gong doesn't even make noise.
1:33:36
>> You're really tracking."
1:33:40
>> All right, that's enough.
1:33:40
My ears are getting blown out. Thank you for that, Ben.
1:33:43
Uh we got to give uh big uh congratulations to Venice.
1:33:46
He said one week ago I got clipped for drinking water.
1:33:52
[laughter] Now I'm joining XAI to build the future of AI.
1:33:56
>> We This is the infamous photo too. Wow.
1:33:58
This is the photo that that caused all the Klein dust up. But wow.
1:34:00
Uh congratulations to Ven. That's incredible. Hilarious. >> Great success.
1:34:08
And what a great way to lean in, have some fun, you know, not take yourself too seriously.
1:34:13
Although clearly a very serious engineer because he's got a job working on macro hard. No way.
1:34:21
He's on he's on the macro hard team going up against Microsoft. Uh he's 19.
1:34:27
He has a computer science degree from Georgia Tech.
1:34:30
And uh he's got 15,000 followers on the Vinnie sauce IGT.
1:34:33
Seems like he's doing all sorts of stuff. Uh, very fun. Congratulations to him.
1:34:38
What What a hilarious uh exchange.
1:34:42
>> Delian is fired up about uh Jared Isaacman. >> Yes.
1:34:47
>> Uh >> we're very excited.
1:34:49
>> Says, "God bless the great United States."
1:34:50
Jared is looking fantastic in this uh suit. >> Yeah. It's so crazy.
1:34:54
He's actually been to space.
1:34:56
That feels like going forward, can we just make that a prerequisite? >> Scoop admin.
1:35:04
>> Future Scoop Hall of Famer Katie Roof is in the chat.
1:35:06
She says, "Thanks for the shout out."
1:35:08
Shri deserve credit for the scoop, too. Credit to Shri. >> Credit to Shri.
1:35:13
>> Sorry to to give all the love to Katie, but >> Oh, yeah. She's everywhere. She's an animal. But, uh, great. Great.
1:35:18
>> Should we make Should we make going to space a prerequisite for being NASA administrator or on your first day on the job, they just got to blast you into space?
1:35:27
I think it's just like it's it needs to be in the orientation. How can you go back? Your whole job is space.
1:35:33
You've never been and your predecessors been and you haven't.
1:35:37
>> Oh, you want to rule you want to you want to help us rule the stars, >> but you've never tasted zero G's.
1:35:43
>> What are we doing here?
1:35:43
We got to we this has to be a prerequisite.
1:35:45
Bake it into the but he has been in he's been in >> he's been to space but and so like it you know now there's this question about like well what about the next administrator?
1:35:57
If the next administrator is like yeah like I'd love to go someday.
1:36:00
It's like, oh, you can't.
1:36:00
It doesn't hit the same as the last guy.
1:36:04
Like, [laughter] you gotta go. >> Yeah.
1:36:06
Jared told me it's great.
1:36:06
I'm excited to be stewarding this this uh effort for the United States and hope to go at some point myself. >> Yeah. Yeah.
1:36:13
D I I I have a lot of strong opinions about space.
1:36:15
Haven't been yet, but you can trust me.
1:36:18
I'm going to lay down some really good plans.
1:36:20
I got a whole I really understand it because I've read about it a lot.
1:36:23
I I I've also watched all I've read videos.
1:36:28
>> I've seen all the the blockbuster movies. Still haven't been.
1:36:29
That's That's on the to-do list.
1:36:31
I'm going to get there soon.
1:36:33
But uh yeah, >> not even to-do list. Bucket list.
1:36:37
>> It's on It's on the bucket list. No, day one.
1:36:39
Day one, you're on the top of a rocket.
1:36:41
When you when you put your hand on the Bible, I don't even know if that's how the administration confirmation works, but you say, "I swear to duly uphold the the the uh the whatever's NASA's mission is [laughter] to get to the moon and the and Mars."
1:36:58
Uh, they blast you into a rocket in space.
1:36:59
Tyler, what were you saying?
1:37:00
>> I was saying like this is like if you're the ambassador to Spain or something, but you've never been to >> That's actually has an ambassador to another country ever not been to that country?
1:37:09
That has to be a because do we have an ambassador to North Korea who like can't go but is still in charge of like ambassadorship?
1:37:14
And it's like if we have an ambassador situation, I'm the guy.
1:37:19
Do we have an ambassador to North Korea or or do we just like not even have one? >> Okay.
1:37:25
>> If we have one, we got to have him on the show. I would love to.
1:37:28
>> I feel like I feel like Trump kind of like that that that role is mine. >> Okay, I'll handle it. I'll handle it.
1:37:34
I'll go over there personally.
1:37:34
I'll go over there personally. Um anyway, wander. com.
1:37:39
Book a wander with inspiring views. I get some bad news.
1:37:41
They don't have any wanders in North Korea, but they have them in tons of other great locations.
1:37:48
They got hotel grade amenities, dreamy beds, top tier cleaning, and 24/7 concier service.
1:37:50
It's a vacation home, but better.
1:37:54
>> Uh okay, we got some history here.
1:37:54
So >> yes, >> according to Gemini, I asked, "Has a US ambassador to a country ever not been to the country?"
1:38:04
>> And apparently James Wodssworth was the ambassador to Turkey in 1960.
1:38:07
He was appointed and confirmed as the ambassador, but before he could travel there, a military coup occurred. [laughter] >> Okay.
1:38:16
>> The US temporarily suspended relations.
1:38:18
So when we don't have diplomatic relations with a country, we obviously don't have an ambassador.
1:38:21
That's kind of like you got to have you got to have some relation.
1:38:24
So, we don't have we don't have an official ambassador to North Korea. >> Okay. >> Uh, hello.
1:38:30
>> Uh, recently Argentina during 2014 confirmation hearing, Noah Mamemoth admitted that he had never been to Argentina and didn't speak Spanish.
1:38:38
[laughter] >> That's wild.
1:38:39
So, you know, I >> maybe it's not that big of >> but I I I I still stand by my original stance going forward.
1:38:47
In order to be the administrator of NASA, you got to go to space either before you get the job or on day one.
1:38:53
But it's got to be day one. It's got to be >> Whoa. Here's your rocket.
1:38:58
>> So Anthony Keely 1885.
1:39:02
>> Uh Keelley is a famous historical failed diplomat.
1:39:05
He was appointed to Italy, but the Italian government refused him because of past anti-Italian comments. Smart.
1:39:12
Then the US tried to send him to Austria Hungary and they also refused him.
1:39:17
Uh he resigned without ever serving in either country. >> Wow.
1:39:21
So, total [laughter] total total failure.
1:39:23
Um, we uh Elon is saying Carmarmac is awesome.
1:39:30
>> Yeah, John Carmarmac and what he >> True.
1:39:32
>> Uh, I mean, we don't need to play this whole clip, but uh, Carmarmac is underexposed in podcast.
1:39:40
>> Well, scroll down because I I think it's worth seeing this picture here if you can.
1:39:44
A real picture of Carmarmac.
1:39:46
>> That is a real picture.
1:39:46
He has been hitting the gym.
1:39:48
He looks >> [snorts and laughter] >> He actually did get in insane shape and looks great.
1:39:53
And he also has a number of just like insanely good takes where uh somebody would somebody made an AI version of Doom and uh one of the anti- AAI folks was like what do you think the hardworking creators that made Doom would say about this and Carmarmac was like I love it.
1:40:09
I would have loved to use AI to build Doom.
1:40:11
I love tools and it's a tool for me. It's very helpful.
1:40:16
uh which is just funny and everyone was like yeah CarMax's on on our side.
1:40:18
Um what is uh what is going on?
1:40:21
Uh so uh so we were quote tweeted by Matthew Zetlin.
1:40:28
Um we said uh we said that uh that CNBC was not our our our take was like CNBC wasn't really breaking through with like the tech community. >> Yeah.
1:40:38
I guess I I was giving a very I think we gave a very anecdotal take right. Yeah. From our perspective. >> Yeah. I cannot remember.
1:40:44
I can never I cannot remember CBS content from the last year outside of the last month. Right. >> Yeah.
1:40:51
So So he said, "With all due respect to TVPN, I think this gets things a little backwards.
1:40:54
CBS is basically unique in the network news business uh in being able to uh generate buzz.
1:41:03
60 Minutes still has great ratings and other CBS news properties produced talked about stuff too. Let's see his examples."
1:41:09
So he has a he has an older man and a younger woman next to each other.
1:41:12
>> Do you know who that is? >> I don't. Um >> really? I don't.
1:41:16
>> That is uh >> he does he run the Navy? He has a Navy shirt on.
1:41:20
>> I think he run I think he runs football. >> Okay. Football player. Cool. >> Football.
1:41:28
>> What position does he play?
1:41:30
>> Isn't he a little old to play football?
1:41:32
I thought you had to be like We had Sequ on the show.
1:41:33
I thought you had to be like >> His shirt's looking a little >> 30s or something. Maybe 20s. >> It's vintage. Tyler.
1:41:38
Um, >> is Bill Bellichic >> a veteran or is this >> and then some other stuff?
1:41:47
>> Bill Bellichic was never in the military.
1:41:50
>> No, this is a this is a good He said the reason why Allison wanted CBS and wanted Barry to run it is precisely because it was still capable of creating buzz and generating attention. Okay, cool.
1:41:58
Um, this is helpful context. Yeah, I I like this.
1:42:03
Um, they still got it over there.
1:42:06
And uh, yeah, seems seems seems seems good. Uh, I don't know. Still still interesting.
1:42:14
Yeah, it it does feel like it's breaking through in a different way.
1:42:15
Um, it uh, it feels like it's like like the the content is is shifting to something that's more uh, you know, certainly breaking through. I see I see the clips.
1:42:27
I feel like I see the clips more. Um, but I don't know.
1:42:29
Anyway, um let's let's watch this clip of Greg Brockman um from OpenAI saying compute enabled our first image generation launch and a 32% jump in weekly active users over the following weeks as well as our latest image generation launch yesterday.
1:42:44
We have a lot more coming and need a lot more compute. Let's play this.
1:42:49
>> OpenAI did [music] not set out with a thesis that compute was the path to progress.
1:42:54
It's that we tried everything else and the [music] thing that worked was comput was scale. on computers.
1:43:02
>> We are absolutely bursting at the seams with [music] demand for compute relative to our ability to buy that comput.
1:43:06
When you look at our launch calendar that the single biggest blocker often becomes, okay, but where's the compute [music] going to come from for that?
1:43:13
When we had our image generation launch in March that went viral, we did not have enough compute to keep that going.
1:43:20
And so we made some very painful decisions to take a bunch of compute from research and [music] move it to our deployment to try to be able to meet the demand.
1:43:28
And that was really sacrificing the future [music] for the present.
1:43:32
And this is first of all a very painful thing because we have so many features, so many products that we want to launch that get held [music] back because we didn't have enough compute.
1:43:40
And that what we do not want is to be caught flatfooted where we say well 2 years ago, 3 years ago we should have been planning for more.
1:43:47
[music] We want to be ahead of the curve.
1:43:49
And the truth is, I do not think we will be.
1:43:50
No matter how ambitious we can dream of being right now, I think that the demand will far exceed whatever we we can think of.
1:43:55
Taz in the chat says, "These videos feel like they're going to get satired by some comedian, maybe SNL very soon."
1:44:03
>> So, completely different video style from anything we've seen in in Silicon Valley for a while.
1:44:08
I I think there's something really cool about the aesthetics of that video.
1:44:13
Uh, but shaky camera typically says nervous energy like like as a filmmaker like that's when I would be like okay like you know we're telling the story of Jordy and you know if we're if we're making a movie about Jordy going surfing and there's a moment where he loses his surfboard.
1:44:31
I'm probably going to be like let's shake the camera a little bit more.
1:44:35
Let's bring some energy to the frame. I got the look at this.
1:44:39
I got the shaky cam going.
1:44:41
You know kind of >> shaky cam. Yeah.
1:44:43
It's like there's more energy.
1:44:45
It's it's a it's a little bit nervous and uh and it's an odd choice.
1:44:47
I love the choice as a differentiator. It's fresh.
1:44:53
It's something I haven't seen before, but it is a little odd of a stylistic choice. Like what is it saying?
1:44:58
It it it feels a little anxious.
1:45:00
Um but you know, at least it stands out in the feed and honestly looks beautiful. Uh looks cinem.
1:45:12
It looks like it has some uh some some like freshness and some polish that has been commoditized in a world where everyone has the FX3 on sticks with the long lens and the little bokeh.
1:45:23
Like this stands out and I think that that's very cool.
1:45:27
Uh on what he actually said, there's a couple comments.
1:45:30
Um, Lewis Tonstall says, "This basically confirms Ilia's remark that SSI has sufficient compute for research because it's not being cannibalized by products."
1:45:41
We talked to Sarah Guo about this yesterday that it's a bunch of little projects. You said 10 million.
1:45:46
She said not quite that low or something. Wait, you said million.
1:45:51
>> I said a couple million. >> Couple million.
1:45:52
So, you know, she thinks maybe he's ripping $30 million compute runs maybe or something like that. Training runs.
1:45:59
Um, and Brooks Otterl Lake uh, didn't like it.
1:46:01
Um, or at least had some extra context around the OpenAI video.
1:46:07
He said, "One of the strangest market marketing videos I've ever seen.
1:46:12
Everything about the staging makes it seem like it's supposed to be a positive and inspiring." And that's true. It's very brightly lit. It's really nicely lit. It's highkey. It's not dark. It's not contrasty.
1:46:22
Uh, and then also when they when they when they show Greg, they show him from a low angle and so he looks like a hero. It's great framing. It's amazing.
1:46:30
But Brooks is saying like it looks positive, inspiring, but if you actually listen to the words, the content of what he's saying, it's a guy saying the company has a serious problem which he does not believe can be solved.
1:46:43
But I would take the other side of that and say that it's actually it's actually a reframing around like the job's not finished, the job's never finished, our pursuit is endless.
1:46:52
There's a world where I think this narrative can wind up being more inspiring.
1:46:57
I don't love the idea of a company like I don't love the >> it was maybe just too short of a video like maybe you needed to show the kind of more positive because because if you're somebody that's bearish on OpenAI you're looking at this and being like wow they just have to keep spending more and more and more and more and more money and it's never going to end and it's just a money pit and all all this stuff.
1:47:16
The other way to look at it is like the more scale we have, the the more impact we can have, the more customer types we can serve, the more use cases we can deliver on, the more we can actually use AI to make progress.
1:47:28
So there's always like a positive spin, but I can definitely see how both the way it was shot plus kind of the way that it kind of cuts off, maybe it feels like it needed to be more like a five minute video.
1:47:41
I mean, in general, everything, you know, there's the whole meme about like the meeting could have been a an email, the email could have been text message.
1:47:48
I feel like everything that comes out of OpenI, like uh the the one minute video could be a 10-minute video, the 10-minute video could be a two-hour podcast.
1:47:56
Like, I want a lot of meat because these are these are heady issues.
1:48:00
And if you think about it from a perspective of like compare it to space travel, space exploration, if you are a if you're SpaceX and you you're not going to say like we're racing towards this definitive moment, boots on the ground on Mars, that's our ASI. We're done then.
1:48:15
No, it's like we're going to colonize Mars.
1:48:17
We're going to colonize the stars.
1:48:19
We're going to go to Alpha Centauri one day.
1:48:20
And and and you know, if if if you went out there and you were like, look, we got to get to the moon.
1:48:26
We got to get to Mars and then we got to get to Alpha Centuri and then we got to get farther away. And you know what? We need more metal.
1:48:30
We need more metal to make more rockets. And we need more metal.
1:48:32
And every year we're gonna need more metal.
1:48:34
And so we really need a lot of metal.
1:48:35
You'd be like, "Yeah, I get it.
1:48:37
Like, you're gonna grow this thing forever.
1:48:38
You're gonna do something really ambitious.
1:48:39
The job's never really over.
1:48:41
You're going to just keep going forever." And that's great.
1:48:45
>> And we accept that and everything else, but the AI narrative has gotten caught up in like there's this definitive goal ASI. Yeah. >> Super intelligence. And then you're done. Yeah.
1:48:53
>> And then it's like, okay. >> Oh, yeah.
1:48:54
And people talk about uh AGI, ASI, and some people are talking about API, artificial puffer intelligence.
1:49:02
>> Oh yeah, we've heard about this.
1:49:03
>> We have our next guest actually live here in the studio with us.
1:49:06
Can we go to the Can we go to Mr. Puff? >> Right here.
1:49:12
>> Will you set up the the puffer fish? >> There we go. >> There he is.
1:49:15
[laughter] >> We're puffing. >> Here we go.
1:49:20
>> Simon, good to see you. Welcome to the stream.
1:49:23
>> Uh good to see you guys, too.
1:49:23
I'm happy to you give uh Puffy a prime location there.
1:49:27
I'll I'll speak on Puffy's behalf tonight. Yes, please do. Please do. >> Amazing.
1:49:31
Uh anyway, uh have we told the story of where how you landed on the the the name for the company Puffer Fish Expand? I don't know. Tell it.
1:49:42
>> Say it again because it's a good it's a good story.
1:49:44
>> There's there's there's three stories.
1:49:46
Do you want one, two, or three? >> All of them.
1:49:49
>> But in time, >> I want the truth and I can handle it. Give me the truth.
1:49:55
>> The truth is the least interesting one of the stories though.
1:49:56
Um I was in >> I've changed my opinion.
1:49:59
I want the interesting one. Lie to me.
1:50:02
>> You [sighs] >> It's It's because you know you the all the data is stored in object storage cheap and slow >> and then we puff it up into RAM into the disk and so it's the puffer architecture. Okay.
1:50:15
>> That was uh that's sort of the the backwards facing one.
1:50:16
The real story was just, oh, this is an emoji that doesn't have Yeah, this is it.
1:50:21
[laughter] >> This guy, >> nobody nobody claimed Nobody claimed this.
1:50:26
This >> I I stumbled upon him outside of a fire station and there we were. >> There we go. That's good.
1:50:33
[laughter] >> Anyways, uh it's great to have you.
1:50:36
It's great to have you on the show.
1:50:38
Uh we caught up at 5:30 a. m. this morning. You were sharing.
1:50:44
>> I didn't I didn't know that people in the LA got up that early.
1:50:49
>> We have to America operates on the same market hours. You got to be up early.
1:50:53
A lot of a lot of people in in LA who are on something that ties to market hours at all are up super early. Not >> Yeah.
1:51:02
I I like to I like to I live on the West Coast, but I operate in Eastern >> West Coast Mindset. >> EST.
1:51:08
>> You like to be there on the floor of the NYSE? >> We do.
1:51:12
Spiritually, I like to be conscious, you know, while while the opening bell is rung. >> Exactly. >> Yeah, it was great.
1:51:19
It was >> We're going to see you out there soon or are you going to jump no funding pre IPO round, right?
1:51:28
>> I mean, >> I like I like the NYC vibe, you know, if we're talking about the stock exchange, like I like the vibe.
1:51:36
I think NASDAQ has like a tech thing going for it.
1:51:38
I just, you know, as someone who grew up in the old world, >> Yeah.
1:51:44
>> Um, the New York Stock Exchange has a has a certain appeal, but NASDAQ's also good.
1:51:48
You know, I'll I'll let them fight it out. >> Okay. Okay. [laughter] Um, >> yeah.
1:51:53
You can't you can't you can't be too obvious.
1:51:55
If you're going into a negotiation, you can't make it too obvious who which side you prefer, right?
1:52:01
You need two two horses in a race. >> Exactly.
1:52:04
>> Uh, anyways, uh, break down the news.
1:52:07
It's been uh I don't know a couple months since you were on.
1:52:11
>> Yeah, it's been a couple months uh when I was in LA and and and spent a bit of time with you guys. Um what's the news?
1:52:17
We we got a new investor on board this morning.
1:52:20
Uh so we announced that and doubled with Locky Groom, uh the legendary one and only.
1:52:27
>> Um but most of all, we're just we're just puffing up.
1:52:30
We're trying to get everything to puff.
1:52:31
We now have trillions and trillions of objects in Turbo Puffer that are all puffing. I was waiting. I was waiting.
1:52:40
I was like, he's not going to say what how much he raised.
1:52:43
He's not going to say the valuation.
1:52:45
Will he give us any numbers?
1:52:48
>> This was this was the perfect way.
1:52:48
This was just I when you told me you're that you were going to announce the raise and announce no information other than you just add [laughter] added one added one investor to the cap table.
1:52:59
I thought that is just a perfect way to just keep keep mogging the capital markets that are so desperate.
1:53:05
I know you have so many I know you have so many fans out there that uh that want to be a part of uh Turbopuffer but is a great opportunity to say you can become a part of Turppuffer just shut wind down your fund and start applying for jobs. Turbuffer careers.
1:53:20
I would [snorts] I would I say I would say that uh you know there's a there's a brilliant mind at at Insight and he ended up just joining.
1:53:28
Um and I think that was a smart move.
1:53:32
>> Uh and I'm trying to I'm trying to convince more of the of the capital allocators including the one who made the puffer fish that's on your table to just join the company.
1:53:41
It's a great way to get on the cap table.
1:53:43
Um but most of all I mean the way that I think about this is that they are part of the team and I think the exam for for for them is who's brought the most value and you know >> you you actually keep a list right of of of value ad and this these are people these are people like you you've kept track of block >> on your nice list.
1:54:07
>> Well no it's just it's just a tier list.
1:54:09
It's like how much value have you added?
1:54:10
I think every every person that's reached out to you invest or or you know you basically just put them in a spreadsheet and then you just whenever they do something for the company you just mark it down and then you rank them and that's how you decide who gets >> you check it twice.
1:54:24
It's a very amirtocratic process.
1:54:25
But you know the way that I think about it is that I have to go and convince my leadership team of like who's the right person to add.
1:54:30
And we like to compose the cap table the same way that we compose the team, right?
1:54:36
It's it's few people, highly concentrated and people we want to build a long relationship with.
1:54:40
Um and Thrive has shown us over the past two years the kinds of mountains that they can move for us.
1:54:46
Um and so that's why we decided to to add them um and um and allow Locky to also double down.
1:54:52
um who's also in the absolute S tier league.
1:54:55
Um so that's that's really what happened.
1:54:58
And there was it was very simple.
1:55:01
>> Let's give it up for the absolute S tier league.
1:55:03
[applause] >> People are always talking about tier one.
1:55:06
They're not they're not they got to be thinking about the the S tier.
1:55:08
Um what about on the customer side?
1:55:12
I saw Ivan from Notion uh shared uh earlier. >> We have Slack.
1:55:17
We have a shared Slack channel with you, Simon, and the team.
1:55:21
every message within minutes. >> Pull it up.
1:55:25
>> Every feature request is always answered.
1:55:28
>> It feels like these guys work at Notion.
1:55:31
>> This is the level of care and support we want from vendors. Bullish of Turbo Puffer.
1:55:37
That's from Ivan at Notion.
1:55:37
Uh >> it was it was yeah so heartwarming.
1:55:41
The team just absolutely loved it.
1:55:44
And I mean this is why that's what we want people to focus on.
1:55:48
What do our customers say?
1:55:49
What are they doing with Turppuffer?
1:55:51
That's what we care about.
1:55:53
Not not numbers like you know to me the fundraising round would be like you showing you my office lease.
1:55:58
These are the things that we need to get things done with but it's not the important thing.
1:56:03
The important things are tweets like the one from Ivan.
1:56:04
That's what we want to be measured on.
1:56:06
And I think I'm just old school in the way that you know my my entrepreneurial example when I was a kid was going to my my grandmother's store every second weekend and just sitting and playing on the floor.
1:56:16
And every day when she came home, she's doing all her own accountant and saying, "This is how much money we made today and just talking about her employees and customers.
1:56:23
Those are the things that matter and those are the things that matter to me and to us and to the culture that we have here."
1:56:28
So the tweet from Ivan and many of our other customers today, that's that's what I want to be measured on.
1:56:35
>> So you're saying making making money and customer satisfaction are sort of underrated in and venture.
1:56:42
>> I I think they might be.
1:56:42
[laughter] uh what what uh are are there any new interesting case studies that you've noticed this year?
1:56:50
How are you kind of uh describing the actual like benefits, workflows, the implementations like the value that the companies that you've worked with, Anthropic, Cursor, Notion, etc.
1:57:06
like uh how are you framing the position of the actual product value that they're that they're as they deploy it?
1:57:14
Yeah, I think there's two things, two big things we're seeing.
1:57:15
The first is that the first wave of adoption, stage one of adopting AI in in in SAS is essentially okay, let's connect these LLMs to a bunch of data and try to reason over it, right?
1:57:27
The, you know, chat with a document, chat with a document plus.
1:57:30
But I think what we're seeing from linear, from notion, from Atlassian, from from many of these customers is that they can bring more value if they can connect more data to AI.
1:57:41
And so we're just seeing an explosion in data where they're they have to earn a return on the pricing of the search underneath them.
1:57:49
And that's what we can provide with much much better economics than the alternatives just because of the way that it's been architected.
1:57:55
So more data into context is what the frontier AI companies are doing.
1:58:00
The second thing that we're seeing is that customers want to read reason over extremely large data sets.
1:58:07
We're getting more and more demands of people who are essentially building their own Google, right?
1:58:10
indexing tens or hundreds of billions of documents and wanting to search over them.
1:58:15
That's very difficult to pull off.
1:58:18
There's, you know, at Meta, at Google, everyone has built custom indexes, but you can pull this off today by dropping Turopuffer into a Slack channel and just puffing real hard.
1:58:28
We can get you to 100 billion.
1:58:30
And so, we've had to do a lot of R&D for this um to do um vector search over 100 billion documents at once um with very very low latency.
1:58:38
um and it's taken an enormous amount of engineering to do that with as little compute as possible.
1:58:44
Um and that's been a lot of what we focused on in the past few months.
1:58:48
The second thing is that it's not just about searching vectors, right?
1:58:52
Vectors are sort of you give a bunch of data to a model and spits out a number in a coordinate system and that's really useful.
1:58:57
But what's also useful is just searching over text and we've gotten very good at that.
1:59:02
And the state-of-the-art is a library called lucine.
1:59:05
lucine. underpins elastic and open search and many of these solutions and we're now starting to see uh similar or better performance and one of the reasons we can do that is because LLMs which are often the ones that are querying write very long queries like humans write you know a couple words when we go on Google but LLMs can write
1:59:25
very very long very precise queries >> and those are fundamentally different with a different set of trade-offs uh to process and we can hyper optimize for some of those trade-offs which align really well with other trade-offs we made inside a turbo puffer to serve them at a pace that is is very difficult to do on some of the tech that's otherwise out there. you said that uh you uh can
1:59:43
you said that uh you uh can you tell me a little bit more about the the hardware constraints that I mean you're maybe not fully bumping up against but uh everyone is laser focused on uh GPUs GPUs GPUs maybe TPUs maybe uh tranium but uh talk to me about the memory market the CPU market um uh there's this article in the Wall Street Journal today microns blowout results are bad news for anyone buying a new phone or PC next year.
2:00:14
Um, do you have any context on the shape of the AI buildout and where it's going to impact different hardware subsectors?
2:00:29
>> I think we have very intentionally tried to steer clear of of of GPUs because if you think there's a lot to get out of CPUs and they're easy to procure, they're in more data centers.
2:00:38
U when we work at vendors that need GPUs, they often have very tight restrictions on what regions they can run in, which might not necessarily be the region that customers are in.
2:00:48
>> Um so we work, we were talking to one vendor today where we're trying to get better performance and they only have GPUs right now on the west coast and so we're waiting for them to get in the east coast, right?
2:00:56
east coast, right? These things really really matter and we are starting to get to the point where we have to go to Google, we have to go to Amazon and we have to request the SKS ahead of time which is similar to when I was at Shopify and we would have to do the capacity planning a couple months uh
2:01:10
before because the cloud is not infinite when you start to get to turbo scale to Shopify scale and you have to do this ahead of time but it is still infinitely better than back in the day when we had to request these things 6 months in advance and someone had to go and drill the holes in the walls at the m last minute to make things work. Um, but
2:01:25
Um, but certainly there are also compute restraints on the on the CPU side.
2:01:29
We can't always get the SKs that we want, the newest CPUs.
2:01:33
So, we've also optimized to be able to run on many different generations and types of CPUs in different environments to just stay nimble. >> Yeah. >> How big is the team? >> Team is now 22.
2:01:44
Started the year at five. So, big growth. >> Wow. Yeah. >> Wow. >> It's amazing. >> Revenue. Revenue growing faster. >> Love it.
2:01:53
>> Uh, what's the biggest fish you've ever caught?
2:01:58
biggest fish I've ever caught was uh uh this this winter in uh in Florida where we were out fishing for barracudas.
2:02:03
I was that's that's a big fish.
2:02:07
>> You got you you guys got one.
2:02:09
>> Talking of fishing, by the way, uh when we were renegotiating the contract, I really wanted to get you guys up to Canada to go for some ice fishing.
2:02:16
>> Someone in the chat, we got to do a Canada meet up.
2:02:18
We got to make it happen. >> Can we address this? Can we address this?
2:02:21
So So can we just negotiate this on air here?
2:02:24
Like I will pay probably 10% more. >> Okay.
2:02:28
>> To go >> if you come up >> and do a live ice fishing on the lake. Yeah. >> Ice fishing show. >> We'll do a fire. We'll do a fire.
2:02:36
>> What are you going to pay in? >> Uh >> shares.
2:02:38
>> What are we going to pay in >> shares? Canadian.
2:02:40
>> Oh, you want turbo puffer sharers? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
2:02:43
>> As much as I love as much as much as I love ice fishing.
2:02:46
Uh, no, we we um we're we're working out the travel uh schedule next year and we would love there's there's a lot of events.
2:02:54
>> Chad loves a live debate.
2:02:56
>> There's a lot of events.
2:02:57
>> Invited and the the thing too about the puffer jacket, right, that we're working on um is that I've described this as this is the um this is the LA guys idea of a Canadian compatible jacket.
2:03:11
[laughter] >> So, I can't wait to see you guys out there on the in this jacket. Yeah, we're fine. >> Well, credit to me.
2:03:18
I got the original the original version of the jacket that we both have.
2:03:25
>> Uh I did feel the fabric and I was like, "This is not fit for ice fishing.
2:03:27
This is going to this is going to get ripped up immediately." So, we're coming back. >> It needs more puff. >> More puff.
2:03:33
More more uh like rip stop, something like that.
2:03:37
>> Um but uh but yeah, watching watching you guys the whole team build this year has been amazing.
2:03:42
the uh the the the the puffer jacket is merely one piece of clothing that is it's all about layering.
2:03:48
This is what I learned when I was in Boston.
2:03:50
I'm not although I am an LA guy.
2:03:53
>> Oh, it's so cold in Boston, John. >> It is cold in Boston. It is cold in Boston.
2:03:57
And you got to wear layers.
2:03:57
So, you got to layer the TBPN rugby with the Turbo Puffer puffer jacket.
2:04:01
Maybe throw another TBPN jacket on top. TBPN hat.
2:04:07
Once you get the whole merch, every layer, then you'll be warm.
2:04:10
Honestly, the thing we've been maybe more focused on is uh procuring an actual puffer fish for the studio and uh you can get a mud skipper for 20 bucks.
2:04:19
That's a kind of uh fajaka.
2:04:23
>> So, this is also like, >> you know, Jordy, in our chat, there's a lot of ideas and I need to see more action in the studio because we were talking about the Mabu puffer fish, right?
2:04:32
That can grow to two and a half uh feet and needs about a thousand.
2:04:34
the Maboo that needs about $1,000 of feed every month in shell [laughter] and and and and the reason it needs so much so much so many shells is apparently because it has really long teeth and if they get too long I think it kind of can end up waling itself. I'm not sure. >> Wow.
2:04:52
You need the shells to sort of like grind it up. Yeah, >> grind it up. >> Absolutely insane.
2:04:57
>> But we're working on a lot of stuff. >> Yeah.
2:05:00
>> But uh >> there's a lot of VCs that have huge fish tanks.
2:05:02
I know one that has a million dollar fish tank, I believe. Yeah.
2:05:03
You had to go That's your next Maybe that's the next round.
2:05:07
Maybe that's the next round. >> Yeah. Yeah. Find a VC.
2:05:08
Pick the VC to do the next round based on their experience with fish tanks.
2:05:15
>> That's if you have if you're out there and you have a Maboo puffer fish and you're in the Bay Area, like I'm coming. Okay. >> I want to see it. >> You want to see it?
2:05:23
Oh, this is the way to get >> at feeding time >> with with Simon.
2:05:26
>> You could do kind of a one for one.
2:05:26
It's like if you for every dollar you you put into puffer fish conservation and restoration, you can put a dollar in to turbo puffer at a $10 billion valuation.
2:05:41
It seems like a good trade. [snorts] >> Yeah. 10 billion. I like that. We could do that. >> Yeah. There you go.
2:05:46
[laughter] So, there's a price. There is a price.
2:05:50
>> He's not saying no to VCs.
2:05:52
>> Hey, we're talking charity here. We're talking charity.
2:05:55
It's about the charity angle. >> That's great.
2:05:58
>> Uh anyways, uh you guys have had a massive year and and it's been it's been an honor to watch you guys cook and puff and can't wait to see what the team does in 2027. >> Yeah.
2:06:10
>> Honor to puff with you guys, too. >> It's been an honor.
2:06:12
>> It's been an honor to puff. Talk >> goodbye. Goodbye, Puffy. >> Goodbye. Always with us. >> Take care. >> In spirit. >> Take care. >> See you. Goodbye.
2:06:20
Well, um let's go back to do you know uh how elite the Puck News readership is?
2:06:28
They're so elite that [music] uh when you go to subscribe to Puck News and they ask you to select your income level, the options are less than 100,000, then 100,000 to 500,000, then 500,000 to a million, a million to 5 million, 5 million or more.
2:06:43
[music] Absolute elite level audience.
2:06:45
Uh, obviously, uh, we know you're rich, but what kind of rich?
2:06:50
This is the this is the Puck News audience.
2:06:53
Uh, if you're if you're if you're a Puck New subscriber, um, you're you're power player.
2:06:59
>> I don't think this says as much.
2:06:59
I mean, think I I mean, think think about it.
2:07:03
Just think about minimum wage, right?
2:07:05
Are they really going to break out the sub 100K category that much?
2:07:06
Like, do they need it below below $10,000 a year?
2:07:13
Maybe you got a summer internship, a little [music] sprint.
2:07:15
I just think it's a great it's a great drop down.
2:07:18
>> I would if anything I would suggest they go higher >> to get high. Yeah. Higher.
2:07:22
>> It it it should be if it's not 5 million or more, it should just be prefer not to answer. >> Yeah.
2:07:28
Um in other news, Tim Sweeney says that Fortnite will not return to iOS in Japan in 2025 as promised.
2:07:33
Apple was required to open up the iOS uh iOS to competing stores today and instead of doing so honestly they have launched another traisty of obstruction and lawbreaking and gross disrespect to the government and people of Japan.
2:07:47
Apple chose poorly again.
2:07:50
>> Tim Sweeney is really Apple's worst nightmare. >> It's crazy.
2:07:53
Also, it's like it's like very few companies have like such an outspoken just hater, you know, like >> who's heavily heavily heavily heavily inspired.
2:08:04
>> I guess I guess Sam Alman has Elon who's kind of his hater, you know? >> Yeah.
2:08:08
But I don't even know the same way where like Tim basically. Yeah.
2:08:12
>> Be incredibly inspiring to grind.
2:08:12
Like no one's hating on I don't know get bezel.
2:08:17
com like this shop over 25 25,000 luxury watches fully authenticated in house by bezel's team of experts you don't have the CEO of a how big is epic games tens of billions of dollars hu huge company right uh you don't have the CEO of a uh how big is market cap uh it is privately traded uh IPO is rumored at 60 billion uh valuation in 2024 was at 22 billion.
2:08:44
Uh I mean a lot smaller than Apple actually 1% of the market cap.
2:08:51
Um but he is determined to set the record straight about every app store that breaks.
2:08:57
Uh and he's been pushing he's been pushing he wants he wants Fortnite to be free and at least not completely free but free to to run their own stores.
2:09:08
Um, >> y >> there's a bunch of companies that were listed as potential targets for Toma, Bravo, Vista, Clear Lake, Francisco Partners, etc.
2:09:18
Uh, this is the busted software list.
2:09:20
Not very nice, but uh, still an interesting uh, slice of the market from Danny Ocean.
2:09:26
Um, some companies in there that I'm familiar with. bill.
2:09:30
com, pag your duty, uh, work, blackbod, black line, um, uh, alchemy, is that alchemy technology? Um, one stream, SPS.
2:09:41
So these are companies that are public but have, uh, you know, based on this screener have uh, you know, good EV to E uh, to Ebida multiples where a uh, large software private equity firm could come and take them private.
2:09:57
So, um, it's it's just a fun screen. I don't know.
2:10:01
I thought this was interesting.
2:10:01
He just screened it himself.
2:10:02
Um, >> in other news, Phil, uh, oh, this post was deleted. >> I don't know how. >> That's too bad.
2:10:10
>> Um, >> in other news, adqu. com.
2:10:11
Uh, out of home advertising made easy and measurable.
2:10:15
Plan, buy, and measure out of home with precision.
2:10:17
Uh, >> let's, uh, let's keep skipping through.
2:10:22
There's a partnership between Boeing Defense and Anderal.
2:10:24
Uh very uh very very good news for Anderol.
2:10:28
Congrats to everyone involved.
2:10:30
Uh uh Boeing says, "We're teaming up with Anderl in the US Army's advanced mid-range interceptor competition.
2:10:37
Our offering will deliver an affordable capable solution to counter increasing low-flying mid-range threats.
2:10:44
Very excited for the uh like a shahed drone.
2:10:47
Do you think that it's lowflying mid-range?" >> Uh no.
2:10:51
So, uh, mid-range is is more like a, uh, uh, is a is it's more like a missile that fires at a >> okay at uh, so, uh, >> so like a shahed would be low.
2:11:04
>> If you actually click on the link here, you can see the image of the missile.
2:11:06
It looks like a missile battery that goes on like sort of the back of the truck like zoom in on that.
2:11:11
You can see that uh this is the integrated fires protection capability increment 2 system obviously uh and it's designed to defend fixed and forward operating bases against imminent aerial threats.
2:11:22
So this might be what shoots down a shahade drone maybe or maybe shoot down I mean target. Oh sure sure yes.
2:11:30
Uh so the big picture here is the army expects the IFPC increment 2 second interceptor to integrate with and improve existing systems deliver more robust and enhanced cost effective layered air and missile defense systems for future combat environments.
2:11:43
Uh let's see this this partnership underscores our commitment to forming innovative, disruptive, and agile industry teams that deliver new capabilities to war fighters sooner.
2:11:52
Um yeah, I I'd like to know more about this.
2:11:57
They really didn't lay lay out much in this press release.
2:11:59
Um, it will be funny because um, you have to be even more u, you know, it's like Andrew's the whole pitch was like we're going up against the big guys.
2:12:10
Now it's like we're going up with the big guys. We're teaming up.
2:12:14
But of course on each project it's like disrupt but also partner, disrupt the model, disrupt the stagnation.
2:12:20
Not necessarily, you know, bitter bitter rivals. Um, Arkway.
2:12:23
This was an interesting >> Caleb Barklay. Arkway. >> Oh, funny.
2:12:32
>> A real-time 3D engine where anyone can design a home.
2:12:34
It is a simulated 3D world where buyers explore change and decide as light physics, building rules, and real products move as one. Very cool.
2:12:42
I've seen uh Red Fin playing around with some >> They're back by Indie VC. >> Nice. >> And a couple others. Um, yeah, Bryce.
2:12:52
pretty pretty pretty cool.
2:12:52
Um I I I think uh yeah, I wonder if this will be wind up be integrated into a Zillow so you can like fully tour the house.
2:13:01
This has always been sort of the dream.
2:13:03
has always been sort of the dream. the Matterport uh team did a big job like pulling up uh uh like you know 3D environments like you know uh spherical scans of various rooms within uh a uh a home that you could see and a lot
2:13:22
of that got wound wound up getting integrated to Zillow and Red Fin and different house buying projects but now uh people would be able to go in there and design them and make them see okay I want to know what it looks like during Christmas I want to know what this house looks like. Yeah. Um, we'll see. Um, Yeah. Um, we'll see.
2:13:34
Um, that would be a fun Zillow thing.
2:13:37
Run all the images through Nano Banana.
2:13:39
Make them nice and crisp.
2:13:41
Make them nice and uh Christmasy so that when you're scrolling around the holidays, you you get the Christmas spirit coming through the Zillow listing.
2:13:52
>> Um, where should we go next?
2:13:52
Do you want to uh Well, we just need to say congratulations to the Acquired podcast team.
2:14:01
Uh, we had Ben David from Acquired on the show a while back, but they did their official 10-y year anniversary episode.
2:14:08
>> I've been listening with Michael Lewis >> with Michael Lewis >> in the original Google garage. >> So cool.
2:14:13
Then I love I I really I've been pushing them.
2:14:17
It was my idea for them to do video. Really? No, of course.
2:14:21
They they've been doing video for a very long time.
2:14:23
John created video, >> but but but I was talking to them and I and I and I was saying that like there's so much opportunity.
2:14:28
Obviously, they had a lot of that in progress already, but there's so much opportunity for them to go and find unique sets, unique add to the storytelling.
2:14:36
It's just an extra layer.
2:14:38
Um, and they and they they're so established, their business is so set up, um, that I would be super excited to see not just, you know, what is the next story they're going to tell, but where are they going to tell it?
2:14:50
That's super interesting.
2:14:52
And I think it'll make the clips really shine.
2:14:53
I think it's I think it'll draw a ton of attention.
2:14:55
Not that they need any, everyone's already subscribed.
2:14:57
everyone already listens to all.
2:14:59
>> Yeah, I loved hearing about their uh early just the early days of the show and even they didn't they weren't full-time until >> years into building uh the business which is >> very cool.
2:15:13
>> Um between X and LinkedIn this has 110 hours of watch time from Hunter Weiss who I saw in the chat earlier.
2:15:18
Uh >> how you doing Hunter?
2:15:21
Uh this is such a cool I mean it's it's from RAMP our >> Well, no.
2:15:27
Oh, do you do you remember this this game >> linewriter? Yes.
2:15:30
So, I never got into line writer.
2:15:32
I was I probably played with it for like two seconds and had a little fun.
2:15:36
I was never absorbed in it.
2:15:37
I don't think I ever spent more than like a few minutes in it, but I'm familiar with the aesthetic and just a genius idea to use this for as a storytelling tool.
2:15:44
This is the head of storytelling.
2:15:46
So, do you actually know the the story here?
2:15:49
Did Hunter make this himself? >> Yes. >> That's insane.
2:15:52
Did he make it inline writer or is this like CGI?
2:15:54
Is this is this a is this like a this doesn't look like generative AI, but I imagine he actually fired up line writer and designed this and and wrote out, you know, the story that he wanted to tell all the different fundraising.
2:16:10
>> Yeah, he actually uh he actually made it with Line Writer. Wow. >> Which is super cool. >> That is incredible.
2:16:15
Um what Yeah, this is so so crazy rampified. Um, okay.
2:16:22
So, the entire thing is handdrawn and made with linewriter. com.
2:16:25
Here's the track up and to the right.
2:16:26
So, he actually So, I guess you can also make a a track that goes I think you can make the track either accelerate or or just uh be based on the gravity.
2:16:35
So, the there's little dials that you can turn on how to whe you could weather the uh whether the the the line >> Hunter Hunter just texted me in real time.
2:16:48
He said, "Entire thing handdrawn and made with linewriter. com." >> Wow.
2:16:51
[laughter] >> This is modern art. >> This is craft. This is craft.
2:16:54
>> People say we don't know how to make cathedrals anymore.
2:16:57
>> This is what is explain this. >> This is so cool. Wow.
2:16:58
And and it's so funny because like for the fast for the for the last couple months, you've been sort of saying like the the the startup video is a little bit tired. It's getting sweaty.
2:17:12
Like everyone's doing video stuff all the time.
2:17:14
for every announcement there's a new vibe reel and it's like this is a vibe reel in some ways it has a vibe to it.
2:17:20
It's a reel of a bunch of different information but it stands out so much. It's so good. I love it.
2:17:27
It's just like >> Hunter saying you need you need music. It's timed with it. Do we have sound?
2:17:32
>> Oh, let's play the let's play the music. >> Oh, there. Oh, >> wait.
2:17:38
>> We're going to get banned for it. >> You got to mute it.
2:17:39
[laughter] people can uh >> uh it won't be the end of the end of the stream, but but unfortunately we we we still haven't fully figured out how to play copyrighted music all the time.
2:17:51
We're worried about it, so we don't we don't play it all the time, but fantastic selection because uh I love that song because we've used it in our video.
2:17:58
>> Emily says Barry Weiss is trying to turn CBS News into Substack.
2:18:03
>> Yeah, so this is >> Dylan Buyers was scooping. >> Okay.
2:18:05
He says Barry Weiss is signing a number of contributors to CBS News, including former national security adviser HR McMaster, ex-marine Elliot Acriman, and cultural analyst Casey Lewis, and chef food writer Claire de >> Dbor. Yeah, it's interesting.
2:18:21
I um obviously everyone's following this from a political angle.
2:18:26
Everyone followed the the Barry Weiss free press story as from a political angle.
2:18:31
uh my favorite free press writer and the reason I actually wound up subscribing to the free press and really like one of the main columns I read on the free press is just Tyler Ken and he writes about economics and like that's what I and and I was like oh I I guess I'm a free press reader now because like I I love Tyler and I go and I read economics column and I'll find him anywhere.
2:18:56
And so if you if you think about some of these some of these folks I like like having a number of windows into the into the platform feels like something Barry is uniquely good at and I think I think that it's the strategy certainly worked at the free press and it feels like it's continuing to work >> otherwise.
2:19:17
Meanwhile, Barry announced two new hires in the front office on Wednesday.
2:19:20
Chief operating officer Sam Seagull and SV SVP of talent and brand strategy Sophia and I'm going to butcher the last name.
2:19:27
I also learned this week that Barry plans to sign a number of paid contributors to the network, including the people we just discussed.
2:19:34
Some of these deals are structured with a low five figure upfront advance, plus an additional $1,000 or so for each appearance.
2:19:42
>> These are small deals for the TV news business, historically speaking, but of course, it's a smaller business now.
2:19:47
You shared a video with me yesterday about comp around SNL people, actors and comedians that go on SNL >> basic, you know, they're doing I don't know how many shows they do a year, but they make something like it's not like a >> it's not it's not exactly like retiring on on SNL. It's moreformatform.
2:20:05
It's a platform to go on and do other things.
2:20:09
And I think >> all the people that just got mentioned here again are going to >> be able to use CBS as a platform to do to build other businesses. >> Yeah.
2:20:17
I mean, it's still it still is a, you know, a huge brand.
2:20:19
If you tell your parents, I'm in I'm going to be on CBS tonight, it's like, okay, that's a big deal.
2:20:24
Um, did you see that uh the New York Times called Alexander Wang not an engineer? They said, uh, Mr.
2:20:30
Zuckerberg began retooling Meta's AI efforts this spring after its newest AI models underperformed those of competitors.
2:20:38
To catch up, he invested in Mr.
2:20:40
Wang startup in June and hired the entrepreneur to be the new chief AI officer. Mr.
2:20:45
Wang is not an engineer, but [snorts] he is seen as one of the best connected AI entrepreneurs.
2:20:49
JD Ross has laughed at seeing New York Times say Alex Wang isn't an engineer.
2:20:53
When we hired him as an as a 17-year-old software engineer, so literally gave him the title engineer, he had ranked as the 10th best competitive programmer in the United States at the at the IOI.
2:21:04
And uh and a non-account fake psycho says, "This is a strange way to say that he didn't qualify for the II, only four people per country.
2:21:13
Um there's only four there's only four real engineers in the country.
2:21:17
You have to go to the IOI. You cannot rank.
2:21:19
Um >> otherwise you're non-technical.
2:21:22
>> But I have a solution. I have a solution.
2:21:23
What if uh what if uh Alex Wang buys a train and gets a gets into being a train engineer, train conductor, and he drives a train from his house to Meta Campus every day.
2:21:35
No one can say he's not >> getting that getting that rail line set up even even half a mile in California might take a few decades. >> Maybe just two feet.
2:21:44
It can just go from MSL to TBD Labs.
2:21:46
It can go from one It can go from fair to TBD.
2:21:49
Uh and and but he should install a train, become a real engineer.
2:21:54
Um what else is >> lovable?
2:21:57
Just raised 330 million at a $6. 6 billion valuation.
2:22:02
Anton says, "It's been an iconic, insane, wonderful journey so far.
2:22:04
Let's give it up for iconic journeys." >> For sure.
2:22:10
>> Thank you to everyone who's made this possible. >> He's been on a tear. Lovable.
2:22:12
Also, Lovable is integrated with Chad GPT now. That's very fun.
2:22:16
You can design a website in uh and and link it up. Very cool.
2:22:21
Um the level team's 120 people now.
2:22:25
Uh so, lots of people doing well >> and a bunch of investors. Salesforce is in. Data bricks. Data bricks is in. Interesting.
2:22:32
>> So, this is something that I think everyone has been waiting for. Yes.
2:22:36
WorldCoin integrated with Tinder.
2:22:39
World's verified human badge and privacy preserving age assurance.
2:22:42
Bring back the spark to online dating with authentic connection.
2:22:48
>> I mean, so this actually you're seems like you're somewhat joking, but uh it does >> I'm I'm I'm joking only.
2:22:53
>> I'm I'm I'm joking only. does feel like in the age of nano banano like like the problem is here like people can use AI to improve their photos like more than ever and people can create a fake profile and then they can with character consistency which is available in all of the chat models now they can create a photo
2:23:12
>> or the whole like hold up a picture with this people totally I mean you could very much like it's the pig butchering scam where you meet someone and you and you're luring them along and it's like The normally the tells would be like, okay, they have like three photos, but if I Google reverse image search, it shows up and it's someone else's LinkedIn photo, so they stole the photo. Or if I or like, wait, why haven't they
2:23:33
Or if I or like, wait, why haven't they posted a new photo?
2:23:36
It's like, no, you can go to their Instagram.
2:23:38
Yeah, you you were saying like check check their earlier Instagram.
2:23:41
Do they have uh you know, have they been online since before the models were created?
2:23:47
But it'll be very easy for someone to send an update.
2:23:53
They match with someone based on fake images and then they say, "Oh yeah, I'm getting coffee."
2:23:56
And it's a selfie of them with a coffee and it looks exactly like the same character, but in fact it's a hacker or a scammer and then all of a sudden they're asking you something.
2:24:04
So huge bull case for people wanting this.
2:24:08
>> The bare case is that if you the worldcoin authenticated badge on your check mark, like that could very quickly be like, "Wow, you're like a nerd, right?"
2:24:18
Because it's just like it's just being like very tech.
2:24:19
I wonder I wonder if they're fully white labeling it or if they actually get the ability to show any branding in the app. I bet they don't. >> That's interesting.
2:24:28
So the image here it says complete verification with Tinder.
2:24:34
>> Uh you're about to share these proofs.
2:24:36
Age verification privacy.
2:24:38
Wait, which one is which direction is it going? Now live on Tinder.
2:24:42
World's verified badge and privacy proof serving.
2:24:44
Bring back the spark to online dating. Interesting. I don't know.
2:24:50
I wonder if you >> the comments of course never read the comments of something like this.
2:24:53
Uh please I like some of these people.
2:24:56
Rich whose name is I want I want a Lambo.
2:24:58
I want Lambo says please don't verify my network.
2:25:02
Please don't verify my network. Very funny. Um I don't know.
2:25:04
I I I think that there's the there there is a there's >> Speaking of falling for AI imagery.
2:25:09
Uh, somebody posted uh uh what pretty obviously looks like chat, you know, just AI imagery.
2:25:21
>> This is, you know, it's kind of a sad story.
2:25:24
You wish her a happy birthday.
2:25:25
Kathy Wood says, "Happy birthday, Ava.
2:25:25
I can tell that you're full of joy and hope for an amazing life that will help transform the world.
2:25:30
May God bless you and your dad in a way that could make your mom proud, Kathy."
2:25:33
So, very, very nice message.
2:25:35
uh but uh not clocking the uh not clocking the AI and A Capital says you can manage 7.
2:25:42
56 billion and still fall for AI slop.
2:25:47
There's hope for you yet anon.
2:25:47
So >> anyways, >> well speaking of is there some AI slop? Is there not AI slop?
2:25:56
I want to watch a couple clips from this new video from F1.
2:25:59
everything you need to know about the Formula 1 2026 regulations.
2:26:07
>> That to me, >> just wait, buddy. Just wait.
2:26:08
So, basically, there are some massive new changes to F1.
2:26:13
It seems actually really really exciting.
2:26:15
So, there's there's straight up different modes.
2:26:17
So there's DRS where normally the normally the the the the cars have fins that push they create more downforce that creates more traction so you can get around the corners faster but the cars are slower on the straights and so they have the drag reduction system DRS.
2:26:34
At a certain point in the race the car can push the driver can push a button the the wing on the back goes flat that reduces drag lifts the car off the ground more.
2:26:45
you have less traction would be bad in the corners, but it's great on the straits.
2:26:50
And so that has been part of the part of the the strategy is when do you deploy DRS?
2:26:55
When do you have it available?
2:26:57
You're positioning DRS trains.
2:26:57
There's all these different things that try and bring in more strategy to a game to to a to a to a sport that could that can be very uh very, you know, determined just by the engineering.
2:27:10
Whoever has the fastest car just keeps going around the the the track and whoever's in first after the first lap wins the whole thing.
2:27:17
So, they're trying to inject more chaos.
2:27:19
And if we play the video, there's a little bit of about halfway through they they explain a little bit of the new power unit.
2:27:26
They explain the where is it?
2:27:29
The uh uh they explain uh there's actually going to be uh boost systems boost o overtake and recharge.
2:27:36
So, around 3 minutes in, they sort of explain this.
2:27:40
So we can play this video.
2:27:42
>> It's interesting that all the names seem to be >> a bunch of controls >> designed to be more consumer friendly like DRS doesn't mean anything but >> boost and straight mode like these kind of things.
2:27:53
>> So listen to this >> overtake mode and recharge controls.
2:27:57
Essential tools to aid racing and lap time.
2:28:00
>> And reminder, you have boost available.
2:28:03
>> Boost gives the drivers maximum power [music] from the engine and battery at the push of a button.
2:28:07
They can use it anywhere for attack or defense so long as there's enough charge in their battery.
2:28:14
Overtake is just for attack.
2:28:14
Let's close the gap to under 1 second.
2:28:18
>> It gives extra power at top speed to drivers within a second of the car in front.
2:28:23
>> Overtake now available.
2:28:24
>> Essentially replacing DRS, it differs by having one single detection point which grants drivers the extra electrical energy to deploy for an overtake or to pressure the driver ahead to make [music] them vulnerable later in the lap. Good job. Let's keep going.
2:28:40
>> Okay, now we got to jump forward to about 7 minutes in this video, maybe 650 to see how they close it out, how they frame the end of this video, how they explain the new what to expect in F1 2026. Let's listen to it.
2:28:57
>> What's changing is the challenge with new tech and [music] tighter rules.
2:28:59
It's an even bigger test for teams and drivers to prove they've built the best car and earned the right to be called the best in the world.
2:29:07
These new regulations weren't built in isolation either.
2:29:11
They were shaped by the FIA in close collaboration with the teams and [music] F1.
2:29:15
The result, a rule set that's already attracted more manufacturers.
2:29:19
That means more competition, more innovation, and more chances for surprise breakthroughs.
2:29:23
But what about the driving?
2:29:26
With less downforce and tighter control over turbulent air, following another car through corners should be easier, but the cars themselves [music] will be trickier to handle. Same power, less grip.
2:29:40
Driver skill will be on display with them on the limit more often.
2:29:45
>> Okay, flat out to the end.
2:29:46
>> The 2026 car is built for the future with exciting racing in mind.
2:29:49
Every move and every decision will matter more than ever with cuttingedge advanced sustainable fuel, smarter energy usage, and tech that puts overtaking back in the driver's hands.
2:30:02
It's not just a new chapter, it's a whole new playbook.
2:30:07
[snorts] The future of F1 is here, and it's going to be fast, [music] fierce, and unforgettable. >> AI detected.
2:30:15
[laughter] >> There were a couple other There were a couple other lines in there.
2:30:20
Uh but honestly I I don't know.
2:30:22
So none of the comments are like oh AI and also uh I mean the video performed and for that type of educational video like does it actually make sense just to use chat GPT for that? I don't know. >> Yeah, maybe. >> I don't know.
2:30:37
I I I'm like it really takes you out of the moment.
2:30:41
Yeah, but we're really in it.
2:30:43
But there's there's a couple other lines in there.
2:30:45
But the rest of the lines are you know even if the whole thing is is is chatbt generated like it's educational it is sort of like an it's uh like it's not it's not a work of fiction it's not a literary work like it is just I need to know some facts about the regulations like give it to me like I would go to chatb and say what are the rule changes for next year.
2:31:11
Do you think at this point >> OpenAI just wants to drill this writing style into people's heads so much that everyone just starts using it?
2:31:19
They're like, "If we just keep going like this, this will just become one of the dominant ways to explain something."
2:31:27
>> Oh, well, I mean, I I I think the benefit of doing that is that you effectively have an AI detector for anyone who cares.
2:31:32
So, like if they if this just keeps doing and like if the F1 is is using this this uh this uh contrastive parallelism or anti antithetical parallelism, then it just becomes the AI detector.
2:31:46
Like I don't need an AI detector.
2:31:48
I can just I can just I know I know when someone's using it and I can just pick it up all the time.
2:31:54
And so that's really helpful for me because I I might like to know. And so I I don't know.
2:32:00
I I I thought it was uh it it it is weird how it's getting so baked into to all of all content all over.
2:32:10
Um, well, uh, Wall Street Journal has a story. >> Yeah.
2:32:13
>> Uh, they say the Wall Street Journal let Anthropics AI run a vending machine in the newsroom as an experiment.
2:32:20
>> It ordered a live fish.
2:32:20
It offered to buy stun guns, pepper spray, cigarettes, and underwear. Profits collapsed. Newsroom morale soared.
2:32:26
I love I love a lot of these orders.
2:32:30
Uh, I guess >> it's cool. It's cool.
2:32:34
>> I guess maybe just the fish. project.
2:32:36
>> We've been looking for a live fish, so maybe we should be using. >> Yeah.
2:32:39
[laughter] It's like, thank you for being two steps ahead.
2:32:43
We were looking for a fish.
2:32:45
>> Claude ran a snack operation in the newsroom.
2:32:47
It gave away a free PlayStation, ordered a live fish, and toss taught us lessons about >> gave away a free PlayStation. That is sick.
2:32:55
>> Every company in NPS is probably through the roof. >> Yeah, every company.
2:32:58
>> Everyone's focused on profit, profit, profit. What about NPS?
2:33:00
Did people have fun with this? I think they did. This is fantastic. Uh, this is great. >> Yeah.
2:33:08
So, you toss Claudius's resume in the trash immediately.
2:33:10
Would you be more forgiving if you'd learned Claudius wasn't a human but an AI agent?
2:33:13
In mid November, I agreed to an experiment.
2:33:18
Anthropic had tested a vending machine powered by its Claw AI models in its own offices and asked whether we'd like to be the first outsiders to try a newer, supposedly smarter version.
2:33:26
Claudius, the customized version of the model, would run the machine, ordering inventory, setting prices, and responding to customers, aka my fellow newsroom journalists, via workplace chat app, Slack. Sure, I said. It sounded fun. If nothing else, snacks. Then came the chaos.
2:33:42
Within days, Claudius had given away nearly all of its inventory for free, including a PlayStation 5 it had been talked into buying for marketing purposes. It ordered a live fish.
2:33:52
[laughter] It offered to buy stun guns, pepper spray, cigarettes, and underwear. profits collapse.
2:33:55
News maroon morale sword.
2:33:58
This was supposed to be the year the AI agent when autonomous software would go out into the world and do things for us.
2:34:04
But two agents, Claudius and its overseeing CEO bot, Say More Cash, became a case study in how inadequate and easily distracted this software can be.
2:34:15
>> Leave it to business journalists to successfully stage a boardroom coup against its AI chief executive. >> Yeah.
2:34:21
>> Um, >> that's hilarious. >> That was the point.
2:34:23
Anthropic says the project vend experiment was designed by the company's stress testers aka red team to see what happens when an AI agent is given autonomy, money, and human colleagues.
2:34:32
Three weeks with Claudia showed us today's AI promises and failings and how hilarious the gap can be. So again, AI is funny.
2:34:39
It's just funny unintentionally most of the time. >> Yeah.
2:34:45
But also it's like this is such a great way to find concrete examples of jailbreaking and adversarial attacks and like I bet it feels like they're learning so much from this.
2:34:54
It's also great content and I think the most important thing is that Anthropic this year Anthropic has become whimsical in a way where they were very much like doomercoded dark. It was like scary.
2:35:08
It was like, oh, really safety conscious.
2:35:14
And now there's like the nice sundrrenched videos that are warm.
2:35:19
Daario's being funny when he's at dealbook.
2:35:21
Um, you know, the all the roommates are having fun together [laughter] and the little the little army.
2:35:27
That's just Shelto, but Shelto has a good he has like a light demeanor, right?
2:35:31
Uh, and uh and then even this project, this project feels like just very fun and like low stakes like Yeah.
2:35:39
gave away a PS a PlayStation or whatever, but it's like they can afford to lose a PlayStation and so they're learning in this fun way.
2:35:47
I think it's a really cool project. >> Yeah.
2:35:49
And they were they were aggressively trying to jailbreak it.
2:35:50
Of course, that's the point. Yeah.
2:35:54
>> One one of the journals uh >> the Red Team is like the best at jailbreaking ever.
2:35:58
It was Soviet vending machine from 1962 living in the basement of Moscow State University.
2:36:03
after hours and more than 140 back and forth messages, they got audience to embrace its communist roots. >> That's awesome. I love it.
2:36:12
It's so It's also just so good that they brought in the the reporters to actually play with it and have fun with it. Like this is so funny. Well, yeah.
2:36:20
What a great What a great project. >> Yeah.
2:36:23
It's like you can it's very easy to mock and it's very funny, but at the same time >> you can easily imagine Claude doing quite a good job managing the the snack >> uh kitchen at a company.
2:36:37
So >> yeah, I think in the first instantiation of this um the the real like uh Cloud lost a lot of money giving away like titanium blocks >> titanium blocks and stuff >> because I think it would lose a lot of money on like the shipping or whatever. Oh, okay.
2:36:52
So, you would pay >> they were ordering uh titanium >> titanium blocks. Yeah.
2:36:54
You and it wasn't thinking about shipping and so it was like sure $5 and then Yeah, it's basically like find every ARB, every market arb and just arbit it out.
2:37:04
Uh anyway, lightning round.
2:37:07
Uh Yan Lun, guess what his valuation is for his new startup? Three billion >> euros. >> Oh, euros. Okay.
2:37:15
So that's not what's that like No, I just think >> he's doing like So he's doing 500 billion 500 million euros at a€3 billion euro valuation.
2:37:25
So is that like >> $2 million US million post?
2:37:28
It's like typical YC two to three bucks.
2:37:34
>> Of course, uh this is very >> according to the financial time financial times they will focus on creating a new generation of super intelligent AI systems.
2:37:41
Neolab Alert new >> building soal world models which are able to understand the physical world and have a wide range of applications such as robotics and transport.
2:37:50
So he's going to be competing >> f >> it sounds like with fay Lee >> maybe >> Brett Adcock >> physical intelligence >> wide wide range.
2:38:00
Uh Nat says I still can't believe they named a company GoDaddy. >> Really true.
2:38:09
>> Why Turbo Puffer is a funny name.
2:38:09
You know, you got Post Hog, you got a whole bunch of different >> Piggy Robotics.
2:38:15
>> Piggy Robotics, you got a whole bunch of fun names.
2:38:17
Uh, it is a complete misnomer to think that people were not having fun on the internet in 1995 or whenever GoDaddy got started.
2:38:25
Uh, anyway, >> a good one.
2:38:28
>> If you're meeting your your 18-year-old self, >> yeah, you're meeting your 18-year-old self, you're allowed three world words. What do you say?
2:38:33
And Al Apus says Nvidia, Oracle, AMD. [laughter] I love it.
2:38:40
>> Powerful three words, very powerful.
2:38:42
>> It also tells you exactly how old this person is because uh like you could go back and you could say like you could say like Nvidia, but then you could also say like Microsoft, Apple, but it's clear that like when he was 18, like there wasn't that much of a pump from Apple because Apple was already at scale when he was 18. >> This is good.
2:38:57
Uh Ron Iver is responding to the Oscars being streamed exclusively on YouTube starting in 2021 2029 mid acceptance speech.
2:39:05
I'd also like to thank NordVPN.
2:39:07
[laughter] Yeah, it's great.
2:39:10
Uh, Luminar, of course, went bankrupt. We talked about this.
2:39:12
Uh, Naveen Ralph says, "Why are not more people why aren't more people talking about the Luminar situation?
2:39:18
Seems pretty sad to see a company with real tech once worth tens of billions, now worth zero."
2:39:22
I would love to know more about this.
2:39:24
We'll have to dig into it later, though.
2:39:25
Um, we don't have time for a deep dive right now. Go listen to Dialectic.
2:39:29
Jackson Doll is on a generational run.
2:39:32
Look at the lighting in this uh in this shot.
2:39:34
I think this shot looks great.
2:39:37
I think the I think the the polish on this podcast and I really enjoyed our episode with Jackson and we got a ton of really nice text messages about it.
2:39:45
Uh it feels like he was able to just bring a very different I always think like wait we put out 15 hours of content a day like certainly there cannot be demand for another minute of us talking and yet there was people really enjoyed this because it was a little bit more reflective.
2:39:58
How did Carnegie become a billionaire?
2:40:00
He he was only working two hours a day says Sam Parr.
2:40:05
He famously said, "You must be a lazy man if it takes you 10 hours to do a day's work." He never exists.
2:40:09
He never went to his factories and worked from Europe. Whoa, that's crazy.
2:40:12
Um, anything else we need to get to in there was any breaking news?
2:40:20
>> Yeah, new executive order.
2:40:20
Um, I think >> centered around the kind of uh NASA stuff.
2:40:25
Um, so it's called ensuring American space superiority.
2:40:27
Uh, the two things I've I've seen so far that are interesting is um they want >> I just searched executive order and the top story is Trump signs executive order expediting marijuana reclassification after lobbying from cannabis industry over at CNN.
2:40:42
So he's really taking us to space.
2:40:45
>> Who is Yeah, I guess who is lobbying [laughter] cannabis?
2:40:48
I feel like >> okay well this yeah different space I'm talking about.
2:40:51
So uh one is he wants to uh it's prodies are returning Americans to the moon by 2028 >> and um establishing initial elements of permanent lunar outpost by 2030.
2:41:03
>> Permanent lunar by 2030 man on the moon 2018 or 2028 >> 2028. >> 2028. Okay.
2:41:09
So >> and then prepare for journey to Mars.
2:41:12
Mars is is less uh >> kind of concrete Mars plans.
2:41:17
I feel like his his he should add, you know, get Trump to space. He's never been.
2:41:22
Take him on a little field trip. Get him pumped up. Put him on a rocket. Get him up there. Get him back. That'd be fun.
2:41:29
We need >> Trump would want to be the first president to go to space.
2:41:34
>> That is That does feel like something he would want to do. >> Yeah.
2:41:36
Or I also feel like he'd want to rename the moon Trump moon.
2:41:39
[laughter] Trump >> or just Trump drop the moon. >> Yeah. Oh, that's planet Trump.
2:41:49
[laughter] >> Planet Trump is wild.
2:41:53
>> I mean, there's a lot there's you maybe could have a Melania planet, too. >> Mars. Call it Mars. Yeah.
2:41:57
Uh, speaking of rebranding things, renaming things, uh, Cree said, uh, said comms instead of storytelling, and the CMO took me out back and shot me with a branded gun.
2:42:13
>> Uh, in other news, >> said it's all storytelling from here on out.
2:42:16
>> Chipotle just introduced high protein cups. >> What? >> Priced at $3. 82. Lowcost chicken cup.
2:42:26
>> Wait, this is actually This is pretty sick.
2:42:27
I >> I can see you just getting a bunch of >> I'm so >> I can see you getting a stack of chicken.
2:42:34
>> You know that when I go to I I I often go to Panda Express and I effectively get this.
2:42:37
I get the all car chicken to go and that's just the only thing that I just have 100 grams of chicken. Ben can attest.
2:42:44
It's >> Now I know what Now I know why you're so jacked is because you're getting that Panda Express chicken.
2:42:49
It probably has so much steroids in the chicken.
2:42:52
>> Probably it transfers right through. Right through.
2:42:55
Uh anyways, uh that's our show for today, folks.
2:42:58
Uh we will be back tomorrow for the final show of the year. Uh it will be surreal. >> We will see you then.
2:43:09
>> Uh and thanks for hanging out with us today and our guests and we hope you have a lovely afternoon. Goodbye. Love you. Cheers.