it's imperative when you get into a relationship before you commit who leads and who follows think about in dancing you can't have two leaders you just can't think about running a company you can't have two CEOs you have to have that moment of who is leading and who is
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in the world subscribe right now the number one Health and Wellness podcast J shett J shett the one the only Jett these are confidence is such a important and Powerful topic I wanted to ask you because I think there's so much material and you do so many interviews
around confidence and what it means and what it feels like how do you define confidence for you and what does it mean to you and what is something that people can think of because I think everyone has a different view of the word confidence yeah I think most people
actually have the misinterpretation of what confidence actually is because they usually and I was of this when I was a stay-at home wife for 8 years I thought I needed it to get started and I thought I needed the confidence to live out my
dreams to actually go towards my goals and I was waiting to have the confidence and that I think is a complete misconception is what actually is holding so many of us back from trying anything and what I realized was in my own journey I actually just need to take
action I needed to go into something very insecure not knowing what I was doing practicing practicing practicing you know wax on wax off my favorite movie Karate Kid and and get so damn good that I build the competence to then lead to confidence so the truth is the
confidence is the byproduct of taking action and a lot of us don't think of it like that we think it's going to be the Magic Bullet that's going to get us to actually take that action at the beginning um and so that's where I actually reshaped and how I rethought of
the word confidence and then also for me confidence is like a muscle if you don't keep practicing it you won't actually get strong at it and if you stop practicing you will get weaker and just like when you go to the gym you may
practice like your biceps or your legs it's a different mechanism to practice working your calves then practicing your bicep so that is what confidence is it's not like you get confidence in one area and you're good to go yeah it's like you
get confidence maybe in being in front of the camera but being in front of the camera as you know Jay is very different than being on stage so when someone sees maybe you've got confidence in one area it doesn't mean that you got confidence everywhere else and I think people if
it's you and you're thinking about it you may then think that you're incompetent or you're no good or like it's just well I don't have the gene so I may as well not get started but the truth is identify where you want the confidence get started build that
competence and then eventually it will breed confidence yeah absolutely I I can agree with you more I remember once looking at the definition of confidence in the dictionary and one of the definitions is an appreciation of One's Own abilities skills and
qualities I was like I really like that definition like it's actually self- validation like confidence is being able to look at yourself and say I'm good at this I'm actually a kind of person I'm a thoughtful person I am a good public speaker I am a bestselling author
whatever it may be and you're almost validating a skill quality or attribute you have by yourself and I think it's so interesting and you're right I think we've viewed confidence as how do other people feel about us so we look at as like oh that person looks so confident
cuz they're like walking out their car they got that swag they're like dripping in great clothes or whatever it may be and we see that as confidence but we know that that person could be sitting in there going oh I'm I'm not the right size I'm overweight underweight I'm
whatever else it may be and criticizing themselves I was wondering what is something that took you the longest in your life to build confidence around oh I'm ever evolving but I think it really was to believe in myself that I'm capable and that all started from
because I was the stay-at home wife for eight years and I want to just make sure that I say this though there's nothing wrong with being a stay home wife at all it's actually one of the hardest jobs that was for me but I didn't want it that actually wasn't my dream it was I
felt like it was sucking the life out of me so as that staying home wife I didn't make any change because I didn't feel like I was capable of anything because I was so insecure that voice in my head was so negative Jay telling me all the
reasons why I was no good to try anything and so in order for me to build my confidence to move forward I was like well what if I am bad who cares you have to actually practice why do I think that I can be amazing at something right if
someone looks at you and they're like oh my God he's such an amazing podcaster how long have you been doing it years and years and years and years so when someone looks at you and let's say they're comparing they beginning to your middle or your end you will feel
incompetent and so for me I had to stop looking outside of myself at all the amazing people because I believed I wasn't good enough to try and so I had to build the internal confidence to take that action to actually just try and understand that it's going to be a
process and without that I never would have got out of what I call Purgatory the mundane where my life is just mundane enough and so I'm just stuck there day in and day out and that idea that even if you don't feel good enough you can still take action I think was
the biggest thing that was the hardest for me because I didn't want to get bullied I was already bullied as a kid for my lks from other women so you can imagine me trying anything that fear of being bullied from other girls was so
petrifying that I didn't even want to take a chance and so realizing a I have to build that Within Myself and you said the word validate actually earlier that word really sticks with me with me because I think a lot of us wait for validation external validation we wait
for someone to tell us that we're a good Greek wife or an amazing husband or a fantastic wife and that can actually hold us where we are because I was so seeking validation from everybody else and at the time I was getting validation from being that stay-at-home wife and so
you can imagine I have low self-esteem I don't believe in myself I don't think I'm good enough and everyone's validating me for this one thing even though I don't like that one thing that validation that feeling good about yourself is what kept me there so I
think the trick is is how do you make sure that you validate yourself and that became the path for me building my confidence every single day what am I going to do today to validate myself not get validation from my partner from my boyfriend from the ex how many likes I
got on Instagram no no how can I validate myself and that became my North Star versus everyone else making me feel good about myself absolutely I mean how did you get the courage to admit to your yourself that you weren't happy in that
moment because I feel like a lot of people friends that I know people have in my life will kind of tell themselves the story and we have to because you have to survive and you need a coping mechanism and we'll just be like no I'm all right I'm okay no you know this is
life like it's all right this is this is my you know this is my uh lot in life and this is what I have to do and this is just how it is and we say these things because we're scared of what maybe on the other side of admitting to ourselves that actually where I am is
not where I want to be and we kind of supplement it with oh everyone thinks I'm doing all right so of course I can't be doing that badly how do you kind of get the courage to say you know what I don't want this life because I think that statement requires a lot of courage
and I know I was scared to admit it to myself when I was I'd already left the monastery I was in a corporate job it was safe it was stable it was sturdy career progression was obvious and here I was going and by the way I was so scared I would never get a job after
leaving the monastery so even having a job I was very grateful because no one would give me one so now for me to be like okay I need to break this away and everyone's like wait a minute you're lucky to have a job bro you didn't work
for three years like so how do you how did you get the courage to admit to yourself I'm not happy here yeah so I love this question because it's such a small dripping effect and I liken it to water dripping on a stone a couple of drops is not a big deal over time you do
that year after year after year what happens to that rock it actually starts to change its shape and that's what I started to realize me ignoring my happiness ignoring what I actually wanted started to change change the shape of how I saw myself and after 8
years I didn't look like what was looking back at me in the mirror I couldn't recognize myself because I wasn't speaking up I wasn't having my voice and so there were a couple of things I realized that really um became like the straw that broke the camels
back if you will one of them was I was using gratitude which I love right it's like be grateful for things you have because there are other people out there that don't have that so the first couple of years from in in uh my marriage I was
using gratitude even though I didn't want to be the stay home wife now that looked like my God I don't like being a stay I don't like cooking and cleaning but actually I'm so grateful I have a husband that loves me my God the amount of people that don't have that healthy
relationship I'm so grateful I'm so grateful I've got a roof over my head I'm so grateful fill in the blank and that was wonderful but come year four year five year six year seven that gratitude started to really turn its head into almost toxic gratitude which
every time that voice that was speaking are you happy Lisa like you don't seem happy I would use the Gratitude to shut her down and that looked like how ungrateful are you how ungrateful are you that you want something else when you've got a husband that loves you how
ungrateful are you you Leisa that you want to go out in the workforce when you don't have to so that voice that gratitude started to come really toxic and so identifying that allowing the voice in my head to just turn up the volume allow her to actually speak
because we've been taught especially For Me growing Up Greek orthodoxes you live in service of everybody else you live in service of the family the husband the kids and so you put yourself last and I started to realize this voice is getting
louder what happens if I actually start to listen to her what does that look like because I'm such a self- ownership person and so if I'm unhappy what am I going to do about it what choices am I going to make different that's going to
lead me to a different outcome and I started to realize it was all on me I hadn't spoken up and told Tom my husband that I was unhappy so let let's just address step one acknowledge Lisa you're unhappy without shame and guilt acknowledge it to myself that was step
one then acknowledge it to my husband I love you more than life itself babe but I don't want to cook for you and clean for you anymore voicing that having the the strength the courage you said that earlier Having the courage to really own
where you are instead of sitting in the shame was a massive thing and then the final thing is just project your your life out what does it look like if you don't make a change in a year in 5 years in 10 years in 20 years and the TR truth is I would have been doing the same
thing I would have then slipped into being a mother I would because that's what my culture told me and then I would have slipped into giving over to the children and and the husband and in 10 20 years I'm exactly where I am just on
a different scale and those elements were the things I'm like oh well no one's coming to save you no one's going to come and change your life for you so what am I going to do right now to make that change that that resonates so deeply and I love that you brought up
that top a gratitude point because it's so interesting how we somehow deep down believe we deserve so little right like and whether it's conditioning where we grew up there's there's a sense inside of us and by the way I can relate to all of that we we
grew up in the same area we've talked about this before like a block away from each other literally literally and you know I kind of like when people ask me now like you know how how does it feel and everything I'm like I actually never in a million years
believed that any of this would ever be possible or even that I even had a dream for it I don't even think I dreamed this big and there was a part of me that just was okay with whatever would have come and whatever would have been and what
everyone around me was doing and now I see that that was because somewhere deep inside of myself I was hampering my potential I was restricting my desire because it's almost like you're so scared that it may never happen that you'd rather not allow the possibility
does that make sense yeah the fear of failure is actually or failing is actually worse than the fear of failing so you're like well I may as well sit in the fear of failing then actually fail and have everyone see it yeah exactly so for you what was that like like I guess
how have you dealt with that like you've been on both ends now like you've been in a place where you didn't even feel like you were allowed to deserve a different life you've now built one of the most successful companies you've built another incredible Media company
like you know it's like you've now seen the other end how is your belief system changed around what you deserve and what's possible yeah I think it starts with frame of reference so people don't actually realize that they have a frame
of reference and just to kind of explain frame of reference is just the way you see the world the way you think it ought to be not the way it necessarily is and so my frame of reference is going to be very different than your frame of reference and so take for instance the
very first time I introduced Tom to my family so I've got a very big loud Greek family and everyone talks over each other everyone yells at each other and so Tom comes and meets them and that's the family everyone's yelling and so we leave and I'm like oh my God they
clearly loved him cuz they're clearly very comfortable around him so I can't wait to hear how much he loves my family so we get in the car and like babe what do you think and he's like they were so disrespectful and I was like what and he's like I can't believe Lisa if
everyone's just screaming and yelling each other they ask me a question they don't listen frame of reference my frame of reference when someone yells and screams like in a happy way it's actually a a sign of greeting you being comfortable around you but Tom's frame
of reference is when someone's yelling it means disrespect so that just gives an example of what frame of reference means so you don't actually question your frame of reference and I think that was the massive thing is I still right
now to this day when now every day question my frame of reference on the way that I see things because maybe I'm missing something so being the stay-at-home wife my frame of reference was well this is what a woman does you're going to have children you will
get married it didn't even dawn on me Jay that I could question whether I want kids or not it didn't dawn on me and so going from that to where I am now is because I literally will question my frame of reference every day because it's your frame of reference that gets
in the way of you doing having the dream how many people say I can't I remember once I was coaching somebody and they were saying about how they're building this business and this is woman she's just had a baby and she freaking loves that she's building this business she
feels so good about herself and her dad every day would has a key comes in her house and would sit down at dinner and basically say that she was a neglectful mother and she's like I don't know what to do Lisa and I said okay well he's got
a key to your house either tell your dad that he has to set boundaries or he doesn't get the key to your house she's like I can't do that I'm like yes you can you just don't want to your frame of reference may be that I'm a terrible daughter if I take the keys away from my
dad but how is it serving you and so that I think was the massive thing that I realized that I had a frame of reference about life belief system whatever you want to call it and sometimes it doesn't serve my dreams my goals and where I want to go and so
having the self-awareness to ask myself where am I where do I want to go how am I going to get there and what belief system do I have that's either going to propel me forward or hold me back what did you do in this in this I think another thing
that and I know a lot of women especially struggle with this what had you and Tom done before the point that you could actually have the courage and confidence to go and say to him I love you but I don't want to cook and clean anymore because to me that kind of a
transition in most marriages or long-term relationships it could look like I love you I don't want to live here anymore I love you I don't like this thing that you do I love you but whatever right fill in the blank what had you and Tom done before that you
felt confident enough to say that that you knew it would land or did you actually take a risk and you didn't know at that point whether he'd react positively or negative obviously now you've been together and all the rest of it but in that moment did you know that
he would react well to it or did you take a risk because it was so true to you yeah everything's a risk you never how many times have you spoken to someone you're like I know exactly what their answer is going to be and then like or you go to R right and you're
like all right and then she gives you a completely different response than you ever expected but you still know him for so many years so I didn't and there's never a guarantee but really I went into it going okay how would I want him to
talk to me about this because here's the thing I need to be very self aware that I'm about to make his life more difficult so just to paint the picture he would wake up his clothes were next to him literally by his bed Jay he would put them on he would go to the gym he'd
come back his work clothes were ready he'd get changed I would hand him lunch to take to work so he didn't have to do anything in the house so I knew I can't pretend that his life isn't going to be worse it is I'm making his life more
difficult so a have give him the grace that of course he's going to have an opinion of course it's actually going to make his life more difficult so give him even though it's unfair exactly for you you still are being empathetic in giving
Grace of course and even with the unfair though I agreed to it it wasn't like he was like forcing me to do it so that's another thing I said yes I also chose that life so I had to take ownership over I chose this as well he didn't force me to but now I want to make a
change so how do I do it so giving him the grace that of course he's going to have a feeling and then understanding the idea of G grief grief is where you have to let go of something someone something that you didn't expect and so he had an idea of the wife that I was
because I had painted that idea for eight years so I know he's going to have to grieve the wife that I was so giving him the space to grieve is super important and then the last thing is almost like I to say but like a drug addict where you like wean them off I
was like he's addicted in some way or habitual to the fact that I would do this every day and just like any habit you cannot change that overnight and so what I said to him is look here's a game plan maybe this will help what if next week I'm just going to cook and clean
for you six days a week and then the week after that I'm going to do five days four days three days right and so what that did was show him I was willing to work with him on the transition and then the final piece is letting him know I'm not
happy babe I'm profoundly unhappy this isn't your fault this is because I made decisions but now I need your help right so I'm asking to be a part of this I need your help because I'm not happy and I don't think I can do it alone now as
my husband he has the opportunity to be there for me instead of him being in his own in his own head selfishly like I can't believe he's like oh my God my wife is actually asking for help so that help piece was a big deal as well and then overall I think when you're
approaching anything like this how do you see your relationship I think relationships are like a game of tennis you're playing a sport you're playing the same sport but are you playing singles or doubles if you're playing singles you're both on each other side
of the net and you're just hitting the ball back and forward and ultimately only one of you can win and you seej I'm sure you've seen a lot of relationship where someone's just trying to make a little jab at them and it's like it's literally this back and forth It's not
coming together but a game of doubles you're on the same side you either win together or you lose together and if I'm weak I tell you I'm weak and that's where you get stronger and vice versa so in this moment I'm saying to my husband
I don't know what I'm doing I don't know what the future looks like but I'm not happy I am weak metaphorically I need your help and so he turned around in having laid all that out being honest with each other that's also the foundation is is your relationship
building on honesty once you had that discussion his response was what kind of husband would I be if I put clean underwear ahead of your happiness and that became the moment where he realized we were in it together I wasn't happy and he could help me navigate out of it
and it C came to that one day where he doesn't have clean underwear Jay I didn't do laundry for like a month and he turns around yells from in the other room babe I don't have any underwear and in that moment I paused and I was like
oh no is this where the truth comes out and he's like I can't believe as my wife you don't give me clean underwear and he turned around like so I guess I'm going to work Commando and he goes to work with no underwear on now what that did was the way that I handled it brought
him in we did it together made that moment was like a makeup break he could have been mad he could have been like see I knew it the resentment and contempt is like the two things that will identify I think by 90% guarantee that a couple won't last is if
you see resentment and contempt in a relationship and so that would that is exactly what would have happened he would have built contempt day by day that my wife isn't cooking for me my wife isn't cleaning and one silly moment like I don't have underwear could be
that breaking point of that relationship but because we'd set up that Foundation that moment that could have broken us actually brought us closer together yeah I mean that but that is literally an emotional maturity master class like that it's it's incredible that you had
that emotional maturity then and that Tom did too and obviously you know you you see it in your continued success of your relationship and marriage but I wish everyone would have a conversation like that because here's how it usually
would go you'd have the realization that you're not happy you'd probably suck it up and live with it for a bit longer then you'd go up to me and be like I can't believe you've controlled me for the last 8 to 10 years I can't believe that you've dominated me I can't believe
that you've made me this submissive person and I'm not happy and I'm never going to cook for you again I'm never going to clean for you again do it yourself grow up and you could have said it like that and then he'd turn around and go get
over it that's what you signed up for and and I think a lot of people end up having that version of it and it's really interesting I I say this to a lot of people it's almost like when you share something are you sharing in a way that is looking at the 360 of what you
just said like well what did I sign up for what did they sign up for how does this change affect them the change will never be seamless and smooth that now that I've said it from Tomorrow everything's going to be perfect and it's incredible to me to
hear the M emotional maturity surrounding that and I hope that everyone who's listening and watching my compassion goes out to people who I do feel are with someone who may not have the emotional mat to receive it even if it's shared with the maturity that you
just shared it I think I do know a lot of people who have tried to share something similar with their partners and the partners will be like oh just get over it oh you'll be fine tomorrow don't worry about it like you know how would you have dealt with it if that was
the case How would how would you guide people with radical confidence how would you deal with that yeah God that's such a great question because there's no guarantee that your partner is going to respond the same way Tom did even if you
dropped it perfectly right like that's the point I think we live in a world where we think if I say everything perfectly then someone and we know that's not true so let's say you dropped it perfectly and Tom had it's right babe that that's what women are meant to do
that's what wife's meant to do that's what um or that's what you signed up for we both signed a contract that's what it was what would you what would you have done and that's really important because that's the thing it's like was it a non-negotiable for him because even to
where I said I originally wanted four children and I don't want any that idea of um that non-negotiable if he was the type of person where one of his non-negotiables were having children and having a stayhome wife I actually understand that we're not meant to be
together then because I don't want to force my opinion on you you need to live the life that you actually want and if that life means that you really want children you need to go and find that because we're going to make each other
unhappy no matter how much I love you and so if Tom turned around to me and said yeah no that's what you signed out for I think in that moment I would have been shocked I wouldn't have expected it I would have had to go back and be be
with myself and be in silence and start to write out what my value systems are what my morals are and how I want to show up every day and then check to see if then what Tom is saying aligns with that because I had been going along with the flow for so long and thinking other
people's opinions were mine and so we don't really know what is our own thoughts until we are still until we write out what we actually care about and so our value systems happen to very much align our value system is is I will support you even in spite of things that
may make my life more uncomfortable right my value system is is that you have you are an ambitious man I will protect you and support you in your ambition even if it makes my life more difficult so if he's working which is true two years ago he was working 120
hours a week two years ago yeah like for like uh 18 months that was very hard and so for 18 months I was supporting him until it started to become detrimental to us and that's where it's like support each other know your value systems but
never let your own values diminish your own wants and need diminish and that's what I did for eight years and that's kind of what I talk about in the book about how a relationship can be literally the the winds beneath your wind your wings that can help Propel you
right it can it can make you feel better about yourself as you're on that Journey but it also can be that anchor around your ankle that can if you dropped into the ocean would just take you deeper and deeper and so who are you with do they want to
see you shine do they want to actually see you thrive and what are their non-negotiables but I think ultimately if Tom had said that I don't think we would have stayed together and that's the key cuz when people say you and Tom are so lucky you're so lucky to have
someone like Tom and I said no no no no I've got Tom because we communicate and he's the person that is okay with a wife going from a stay-at-home wife to now an entrepreneur and I'm okay with having a husband that Works 100 hours or 120
hours a week most people aren't and that there's no judgment there but that's what makes us beautiful dance partners and so never I just did it too long Jay never anyone listening don't ever diminish your dreams don't ever uh um negotiate your boundaries for somebody
else know what they are first and then ideally find somebody that respects and complement them yeah it's such great advice and it's you know and I know you mean it and and it's funny because I I think I resonate strongly with that as well is that when I think about me
and rad it's it's very we obviously we no longer have been together as long as you and Tom have but I see a lot of similarities in how we're growing in that way and and your your relationship is a beautiful example of that like you and Tom and how long you've been
together and and all the Transitions and and I love seeing it it's it's really inspiring for us and I think it's it's similar for us like I always I genuinely believe it that the reason why me and Ry work is because we communicate and is
because we're both able to respect and adapt and know what the other person needs I think what's really interesting though Lisa is that a lot of the time what we want we've got to really think about that word because I wonder whether sometimes we've always it's so funny
because I'm going the other way but we started off talking about like we we all believe we deserve less but sometimes in our relationships we can be really demanding in a way that isn't taking into account who the other person is so I'll give you an example let's say what
you wanted and and I know Tom so I'm going to speak for him a bit and you can edit the parts I don't get right if you had said Jay I'm excited to get married and the guy I want I want him to be someone who um every evening spends time
with me every weekend is free and available I want him to think about planning a vacation four times a year or twice a year or once a year I want him to be someone who just wants to cuddle up and watch a movie every night even if you wanted all of that Tom
was not the right guy like that's not Tom like he's he may be some of those things but not really not really yeah exactly from from my perception Tom's not that guy you guys know each other you know I know Tom yeah yeah like Tom's not that guy and and and I'm not saying
that makes him a good or bad I'm just saying that's not Tom and it was similar with me and rad like you know like I I I think I said something ridiculous to to rad when we first started dating and I was like look if you want the guy who's
always free every weekend to hang out with family and goes to a movie on Friday night and then goes like I don't know like house shop Furniture shopping on the weekend I was like I'm not that guy like I'm just that's not me like I have a mission I'm I'm excited about
stuff like I'm I'm passionate I want to live a purposeful life like this is my priority and so sometimes what we want and who we're attracted Ed to don't mesh yeah like you can be attracted to Tom for his intelligence his brain his looks whatever else it is
and he can be attracted to you but then you're like but wait a minute I actually want someone who's ambitious or not ambitious I want someone who's this or this and so sometimes I think we're trying to force someone to be something that they're not and I see that a lot
I'll have a lot of friends who will say to me like I wish he was just a bit more ambitious I'm like but he's not and he's not suddenly going to become that like he's he's he may become that because we can all change but obviously he's not
showing you that two years where someone will be like you know I wish didn't work so hard like I you know like but you know his goal is to be a billionaire like as in do know I mean and he's dedicated to that so I'm like where does that want and attraction kind of go
together yeah I think it's such a great question yeah cuz here's the thing though Jay is of course we want everything of course we do everyone does so just accept that okay you're not going to necessarily be able to have everything so what's what's
the cost so I find ambition extremely sexy and attractive and so I'm attracted to someone that has ambition and so what comes with that what is the cost of being attracted to someone that has ambition it means they're not going to be there every night at 7:00 p.m.
they're not taking time off on the weekends they're not filling the blank okay well what's more important to you like now just look at those facts and go if you're ambitious this is actually what comes with someone ambitious if you want someone that is a stay-at home
again freaking love it but just know that probably means they're going to work a 9 to 5 that that that way they have the time to be open to them spending date night with you but are you okay with that what life do you want what's more important like actually
almost prioritize them and so for me that was a very early wakeup call with Tom where it's like I know who I married and so just because I've got a ring on my finger doesn't mean now all of a sudden he has to change in order to fit
all the things I'm looking for in life I actually know that the cost of being with him is that I don't see him on a Saturday night or a Friday and then that extends to children when we were even talking about kids he said babe I love you I'm not going to wake up in the
middle of the night and clean the baby's diaper because I am ambitious and I will be resentful going back to that word I'll be resentful if I give up my ambition for my children and my wife I won't be able to be the man that you love and you want me to be because I'm
you are literally strip stripping me away of the fundamental person I am and when you can respect someone for being that honest and that transparent I only receive it with utter gratitude to be honest like thank you for telling me before we have children what type of
Father you're going to be and so he said I'm going to be working really hard I'm not going to be coming home at 7: p.m. every night and I'm not going to get up with the kids because I need to make sure that my cognitive load is like on
fire when I'm in my business but then on the weekends the truth is that I want to be an amazing father and so I'm going to be on the weekends taking my kid to soccer practice and doing all these things those are the reality of who fundamentally he is and how that shows
up in our relationship cool now that I know that do I still want children knowing that pretty much Monday to Friday I'm a single mother because when people don't have these conversations it ends up being the biggest thing that breaks that relationship because you you
are now judging the part I can't believe he's not waking up and I'm I'm left all by myself or did you have the discussion so that you knew again there's zero judgment but you knew what the mother wants and what the father wants and this
goes both ways right it's not just Tom what do I want out of life and how did children fit into my lifestyle but those are the things that we spoke about every step of the way so that we can always give each other the utter respect in
being the person they are because when you strip away that you can't bring your whole self you know you've written in your book about how you have to have a relationship with your purpose your partner has to have a relationship with their purpose and then you come together
but if you're stripping each other of their purpose you can't have that beautiful dance and that relationship so knowing all of those factors is exactly where I was like I still love you I appreciate it I still find this very sexy and now the understanding is is
that he's not going to be home in the evening and that was actually part of what made me decide that I didn't want children because I don't want to be a single mother Monday to Friday I freaking love my work so I actually don't want to give give that up either I
didn't want to have children and have nannies bring them up no shame just my decision and then on the weekends I'm just going to be utterly transparent and honest with you is that I don't want to be second or third on his priority list
when is there going to be time for me and him if he's working all week and on the weekends he's with the children yeah and the thing that I will protect the most is my relationship with my husband mhm so knowing that now what decisions do we make to protect our relationship
and I understand people especially with kids like you won't know what it's like until you have kids I bet you get that all the time especially in your culture the truth is no I don't know what it's like because I don't have them but I
there's nothing that I'm missing or losing because I don't know what I'm missing out on it's kind of like a dog making fun of us humans for our sense of smell it's like their sense of smell is freaking amazing but I don't know what it's like so I don't look at a dog in
longingness I just go know my sense of smell and it is what it is so but I do treat it as fact that I bet you nature takes its course and make sure that biologically especially as a woman that you then prioritize your children so then again asking Tom are you okay with
going down on my priority list when we have kids because nature will make sure that that child is the Center of My Universe I don't pretend otherwise and being able to have that type of honest conversations with zero judgment giving
each other the grace to just be who they are then allows us to say do we have children do we still stay in this marriage without that growing contempt that then ends up breaking all couples it turns you into a person you're not proud of you start arguing you start
saying things you don't like you start doing things you're not proud of yourself you're using potentially their vulnerabilities against them in arguments because you haven't had that truth conversation from the get-go yeah I mean there's so much to unpack there
and I I love the first point you made this idea of if you're attracted to something that's a non-negotiable or a priority first of all just draw a line as to what the cost of that is so if you want someone ambitious naturally they'll
have less time if you want someone less time naturally they'll be less ambiti that's just how life works and neither of those are good or bad but if you go I want someone who's really ambitious and has loads of time that's just not happening and so you need to know your
deal breakers and you need to know your priorities and I I love the way put that because I do think that we do want it all and we want it all now and when someone doesn't give it to us all we then think it's their fault and that's what creates this resentment and
contempt because we're like well wait a minute like don't you want to work a bit more and it's like no but the thing you love about them is that they're always available like I have friends who's like their Partners will come on them with
their work trip and then they'll be like oh but don't you have something to do and it's like but but you love the fact that they're always with you and then there's this break you know this this break does that make sense or or even this idea of like I have some of my
friend say to me like oh you know my partner's just a bit boring and I'm like but you wanted someone who didn't do anything like you wanted someone who was you know like didn't have interest was always around was always always available now you're calling them boring
for it it's like but you've never really you know you've never encourag them to or you've never been attracted to someone who wanted to explore it's it's fascinating to me can we take it even go for it yeah go for it all right so think
about women in the workforce now so a lot of women are which I freaking love right I want to empower women I think it's incredible that now we have the options to really be able to go into the workforce instead of be stayhome wives or mothers but what I'm noticing is
happening is a lot of some women I would say a lot are really building that confidence and I freaking like it and I interviewed somebody I won't say their name but she's a really big Powerhouse and she's successful and she's wealthy and she had just got divorced and so
she's telling me the story about how she's like yeah I'm I'm owning my sexuality I'm owning who I am and I'm a powerful woman so she chats up this guy in a bar and she's like and he became my boyfriend he's younger than her so he moves in with her and she's like I
freaking love it no gu's ever going to control me again so she and I'm like amazing I respect that you know what you want you go after it halfway through the interview she's just like yeah and I can't believe he doesn't like book any
vacations he never pays for dinner he never takes the lead on something and I'm like because you didn't set up your relationship for that to be like that and I think ultimately this is something I'm really playing with new that's really Weighing on me is that I think
one of the things people don't ask each other and they're worried especially in today's society but I think it's imperative when you get into a relationship before you commit who leads and who follows MH and the having that actual conversation and here's the thing
following someone doesn't make you weaker it doesn't make you submissive it just has a way think about dancing I've brought up dancing for some reason this conversation I'm not quite sure why dip yeah it's a dip exactly um think about in dancing you can't have two leaders
you just can't think about running a company you can't have two CEOs you have to have that moment that's such a great point you have to have that moment of who is leading and who is following but if you can remove the stigma that maybe
you have against the word follow then you can have that H conversation and that's what Tom and I did is babe I want you to to lead he wants to lead and I want him to lead that doesn't make me less of a powerful Confident Woman it actually makes me stronger in my eyes
because I'm strong enough to know I can still be strong in my own conviction my ideas my boundaries my standing up for myself and I can still have faith in somebody else is going to lead me now of course if he goes up step I'm going to
have the confidence to speak up But ultimately I'm not challenging him for that role and in today's society again it's just weird to for people to say about roles in a relationship and I think there's no right or wrong what do you want in your relationship but you
have to have that role discussion yes no matter what gender or person is going to take the lead you have to have that discussion first yeah and and one thing that Ry and I found is also that we lead and follow in different areas so when it
comes to our health Ry needs she decides what snacks we have in the house she decides what we eat for breakfast lunch and dinner she decides where we go to eat for restaurants if we're going out she decides what we eat when we're traveling because I trust her that she
knows more about the body than I do as a nutritionist and dietitian and all of her expertise and so I'm going to follow her when it comes to working out I follow her she she's the one who's like setting the paces to like all right you know when I met her I didn't even work
out just played a bit of sport or whatever and she was the one saying no no no it's really great for us to be active and do this together so she leads when it comes to our home I lead interior design cuz that's my thing I love it I love art I love aesthetic I
love the feel I love everything and I get so into it and so she let me lead she was like Jay you're in charge like that's your thing when it comes to spending time with family and vacations she leads because she loves taking care of her family and loves traveling
together and giving them experiences and so she'll lead then when it comes to uh the direction of like should we move now should we do this where should we invest I'm leading that conversation and I think it's beautiful because there's
leading and following across all these different areas and all of a sudden it's like you're both playing to your strengths you both be feel valuable you both feel significant and you both feel like you get to rely on the other person which is beautiful which is what you
want and I think it's yeah it goes back to the doubles in tennis you're playing doubles exactly exactly like you take that shot I'll take this one and that's a that's a beautiful analogy and and and I think that that the reality of what's
helped us as well is being humble enough to say you lead your better at this and then being confident enough to say no I'll take this one because that's my strength and I think that requires so much humility and putting your ego aside and it also requires so much
self-awareness and by the way this isn't perfect we're constantly playing with it like they constantly be something like I want you to do this because I don't want to do it she be like I don't want to do it either right there's that stuff too
yeah and and then there's stuff where you're both arguing over who's going to lead because you both want to lead it I think what we're both coming back down to is the importance of that conversation because I know so many of my friends actually have' been scared to
tell their Partners going back to the kids thing and this could be about anything kids is an example where they're not ready for kids but their partner is so pushing for kids and it's like no one's listening to each other now it's just our desire is superseding
the code that your partner is trying to suggest to you of I'm not ready I'm not sure but your desire is just like no no no it has to happen now it has to happen now and I find that to be like I think I'd really me and Ry kind of went through that like before we moved to the
place that we're at now I really needed to move because we lived in a place uh that we were renting that I never slept well in we had people taking stuff like our maale would always get stolen we'd have there were a lot of animals that
were in the floorboards it was an old home so you'd hear like animals rustling around like it was just one of those homes where I always felt uncomfortable and anxious and so I don't think I slept well for one and a half years or I would
be living in fight or flight every night thinking what if someone's in my house and that is not a comfortable feeling and so I kept pushing I was like Ry I need to get out of it I need to get out and she she loved that home so she couldn't get it she was just like this
place is beautiful and I'm like yeah it's beautiful during the day but at night trust me I'm like really anxious here and I'm not really an anxious sleeper I sleep well and so it was very new for me and I could tell she wasn't quite getting it and so I had to start
looking for new places cuz I realized that I was like until she sees something better you're amazing she's not going to get the point and so it was literally like and and that's natural right like cuz her she was like I'm happy here I'm satisfied here I was like no but I can't
and she wasn't getting the subtle nudges and so I started looking started dragging to house viewings we found this place even then she was like no no no the other place is more beautiful blah blah blah blah blah and then finally I was like you must be kidding me and then
we moved and now she's grateful that we moved but it was really interesting how like even though there was a bit of conflict and friction I still knew I had to lead but I knew I didn't have to lead by like trying to convince her or make
her feel bad for not understanding me or because I could sense it wasn't that she didn't understand me or she wasn't listening to me or maybe there was a bit of that we just weren't getting if that makes sense do that yeah what's interesting is I go back to the value
systems because the value for you was I need to the value of sleeping because of how I know how important your brain is to you in your mind and how you think and how you show up and run your business and everything like that it actually aligns with your value system
now maybe um Rad's value system was homemaking I want to be somewhere I'm comfortable so actually both of your value systems again there's no right or wrong but that's where your value system was colliding because she feels like I've made a house out of this value
system your value I'm not getting what I need I can't work I don't have the mindset value system so actually what was happening is your value systems were colliding but you're not talking about the value you're talking about the house
yes yes yes that's so that becomes that even with the kids thing it's like okay well the person that wants to delay the children what's your value system there I haven't gotten to where I want to in my career and my career right now is
super important and maybe the per the person is my values syst I've always wanted a family and so I value family over business so now you can see one person's valuing business over family the other person's valuing family over business and you're colliding but you're
not actually talking about the thing you're just talking about the kids but it's actually about the value system that's colliding the silly example that I learned this lesson with Tom was over making the bed I was like what do you mean you
don't make the bed of course you make the bed it was like the thing I was taught my whole life and Tom was like no I won't make the bed and we would Collide I'm like you don't get it and these and so he would get frustrated every time I would make the bed cuz he's
like I have to unmake the bed now I'm like it takes 3 seconds and I was dismissing and mocking him if I'm going to be very honest thinking he was wrong that of course you make what kind of person doesn't and I was literally putting my value system on him until we
started to D what does making the bed mean to you and to me it was about neatness it was about calm I have ADHD so I need those moments of calmness around me I need things to be neat in order for me to be centered but I didn't say that I said I need the bed to be
made for him his value system is time he's like it's the one thing I'll never get back and so if you ask me to do something that doesn't actually align with the vision of what I want my future to be don't like you're asking me to be someone I'm not so his value system is
time my value system is tidiness and so you can see in just that silly thing of making the bed we freaking Collide and how many people couples do that every single day over small little things and what ends up happening is that oxytocin
that you had when you first started dating is no longer there and all you have are these collisions day in day out I love that and and I I feel I really hope everyone who's listening and watching like takes a moment to to break this down for themselves like we had it
the other way around a few couple of months ago my wife's book came out her first gr book yeah thank you I know you interviewed her for it as well and it was you know and it was just it was a really exciting moment rad had poured three years of her life into this
cookbook I saw her work hard on it I've never seen her work that hard in my life never seen her just be so consistent you know how much work it takes you know look we're sitting here talking about radical confidence one year on right and
one year on two two oh my gosh it's been two years yeah two years on of radical confidence and you know how much work goes into this book I know how much you poured into this book this was your first ever book and I said to Ry I said to her I said you know what Ry like
we've been together now for 11 years we've celebrated a lot of things but you've never had a book out so I don't know how you want to celebrate this because not every celebration's the same like you don't celebrate a birthday how you celebrate an anniversary and how you
celebrate Christmas they're they're different celebrations and so I was asking and checking in with her and I was like I actually don't know what you'd like to do in order to like make this moment feel special and she we were on a hike and she just
said to me she goes oh we just celebrated last night and I was like what do you mean what I couldn't even remember what we did last night I was like what do you mean we celebrated last night and she was like yeah like our friends came over I cooked from the book
and they love the meals this was the day before the book came out and I was like wait that was a celebration to you like it wasn't there was no it wasn't like the joyful book event there was no fancy like cards with it was just a few mates
came over and she cooked from the book which I don't even know if she told anyone and they loved it and they loved the food and she was like that felt like a celebration to me because I made food I love for people I love and I was like wow you just saved me this Grand idea I
had in my head of like throwing a big party or like you know putting the joyful banner up or whatever which is what I would do and I was just thinking about that and I was like it's so interesting to me that her value of Celebration is that my value around
celebration is totally different but again so many couples and relationships can go wrong because we're constantly either celebrating the person we love or we're criticizing the person we love based on our value system and now all
we're talking about is the criticism or the celebration and not talking about the value yeah and and it's fascinating to me that it works both ways whether it's a good thing or a bad thing because sometimes you do something something nice for your partner and they don't
appreciate it and you're like why don't you appreciate it they're like cuz that's not what I appreciate it's not what I value and I applaud you for just asking her because so many people either wouldn't ask wouldn't do anything or just assume and that's I think where a
lot of couples almost get mixed up where it's like well if if they love me they should know and it's like oh that breaks my heart it's like they're not a mind reader like like you said we all change we all evolve you would have done
something with the biggest heart right like I want to celebrate my wife and she were looking like what do you you mean there how many times and then what happens in that moment you feel unappreciated for having tried to show up and do something amazing she doesn't
feel seen or heard so now this whole thing this act that you've done to try and really show her doesn't achieve anything you and her both feel badly and then again you almost like look at the other person like you're wrong or you're crazy or how could you have done this
and so the idea of just just asking like remove all the IDE of what we've been taught of like if they love me they should know and just say ultimately I want them to feel what I want them to feel loved I want them to feel seen okay how do they do that I sometimes don't
know let me just ask so one of the things actually so I stopped being the stay home wife I stopped cooking for Tom we laid out all of our things of how we want to show up for each other and we changed and grow we both change and grow
since then so only last year Tom turned around to me and he said you know what babe like I feel like like I have a need that's unmet right now I was like oh my God what's the need babe and he's like I actually now miss that you don't cook
for me right so we've been like 15 years he's been fine with it but instead of me judging him he told me I'm not supposed to guess he just said that and I said okay babe what does that look like and he's like I like you to preempt my needs when it comes to food I said okay
instead of just leaving it at that I was like okay can I order Postmates and have it delivered would that satisfy the need and he's like yeah you can or do I have to cook it he's like no no you can have postmes okay do I need to Plate it for
you or can I leave it out on the doorstep and just text you it's here and he's like well if you can put it on like my kitchen counter like his little side and he's like that way I know I was like cool now I've heard you I don't have to assume I now don't have to go straight
into oh my God he's now asking me to cook I don't want to cook I went there I was that person I don't want to get trapped no none of that we just broke it down bit by bit of understanding what exactly that need looks like now here's
the other part maybe I'm not willing to do it and in that moment I just would have said right now that actually doesn't fit my lifestyle of what I need to show up so how do we find a compromise is there a compromise or is it sorry I'm unable to do it but what if
I do it for three weeks on on a holiday right now come up with ways that you're not just shutting the other person down you're hearing their needs and they feel heard that you're trying to find a solution because ultimately I think not to just stereotype but typically I think
women want to feel seen they want to feel safe they want to feel needed and they want to feel appreciated it's not the money it's not the height that a lot of people are saying they need to be six foot and and seven figures no no if you really do
stop and pause and ask your partner how they can fill those roles then you can start to actually create a beautiful relationship on the the long term and then the same for a guy obviously I don't know and I'd love to hear your thoughts but I've tried to process what
is it that I think a guy needs they want to feel appreciated they want to feel powerful not controlling powerful um and they want to be respected yeah I'd agree with that and so knowing okay if that's actually what you want I'm just going to say it people
may hate it but I just go to truth how do I make you feel powerful that's what I would ask Tom how do I make you feel powerful what are the things that you need now again I then go back to my value systems I say does this align with
me but I'm not going to guess I want to make sure that my husband's happy and that we're always constantly in alignment and when you've been together for 23 years I met him when I was 21 we've built multiple companies together so how the hell have we been able to
stay so aligned it's these little things that people may be embarrassed to do maybe be ashamed to do or they don't want to do it that's the reality that's the reality we want something but we either feel guilty shameful embarrassed or uncomfortable to ask for
it and then we take that feeling out on our partner for not knowing it and we get triggered when they say something like I wish you'd cook for me again that triggers all of our PTSD from that time and now it's like how can you even ask me to do that you know how hard that was
for me yeah not realizing it's just a suggestion it's just an idea it's coming from a good it's that space that I think we've been talking about today is can you kind of create a safe space to have these uncomfortable conversations without any
shame or guilt right and that becomes the foundation that ultimately selection matters who you choose to be with will absolutely dictate the outcome of your relationship and so I used to say the key to a relationship is communication I don't actually think it is I think it's
a growth mindset because if you do not have a growth mindset no matter how much I communicate you said that earlier right they may not be able to respond now think of all the hurdles and humps that we've been through in our relationship how have we survived those
because we are open to having the hard conversations we're open to communicating endlessly until we get to the solution one of the rules so Tom and I have a bunch of rules one of the rules is never apologize if you don't mean it and even in the moments of I'm deeply
upset he absolutely can say baby I know if I just apologize to you right now I know that you're going to feel better but I can't can't apologize because I'm not sorry for it and what that does is that absolutely elongates the conversation the argument it may go no
now for 2 days 3 days but ultimately we're not brushing it under the rug we actually resolve it and go okay I'm still very hurt by it but let me actually work through that hurt why am I hurt why was I triggered why did you say that you know and then we just peel away
the onion peel away the onion to get to that core but it all comes from that growth mindset and if you don't have it no matter how much you discuss it you're going to hit a wall where you cannot be seen or heard absolutely Lisa you are
amazing the book everyone is called radical confidence 11 lessons on how to get the relationship career and life you want today we did a deep dive on relationships which I loved uh but when you open up this book you'll learn how to handle your negative voice how you
can overcome failure how you can actually work through your emotions and understanding them setting your values system is a big part of this book breaking through your beliefs building that growth mindset is all inside this book called radical confidence if you
didn't get grab a copy two years ago make sure you grab a copy right now uh if you don't already subscribe to and watch uh women of impact make sure you go and do that as well uh Lisa it's always such a joy talking to you because
it's so lived everything you share is such lived experience and I know you live by it cuz I know you and Tom and on top of that it's just so real and I love having these really pragmatic practical conversations around topics that can be very
ethereal and uncomfortable and woo woo and kind of a bit like oh you and and to be honest manipulative and controlling like oh if you want him to do this do this if you want her to and it's almost like you actually can't get anyone to do anything all you all you can do is all
you can do is accept them for who they are or not and I think when we're having these conversations I'm I'm really hoping that everyone walks away with an understanding of what type of quality of interaction and conversation to have with the individual and the
growth mindset point is in a relationship is huge because adaptability and flexibility is at the core of anything long term and I've seen that with me and Ry too there is just there I realize it all the time it's things would only never work if we lost
our flexibility and adaptability and that's all growth mindset you you have to and it's so interesting how so often we don't want to be flexible and adaptable and by the way that's okay too so Lisa thank you so much for for showing up as always and just shedding
so much Clarity on a really difficult topic thank you Jay thank you for having me you're you're such a good dude I freaking love you I love Ry like we connected from day one and the support and human that you are I just want to say thank you like for always being
there as a friend thank you always always here for you and anyone who's been listening and watching make sure you tag me and Lisa on Instagram on Tik Tok on X whatever platform you're on in the YouTube comments let us know what resonated with you what's stuck with you
what you're trying out with your partner or potential partner please pass this on to a friend someone in a relationship who's struggling who's going through a tough time I really believe it will give them the tools and the resources that
they need to navigate and guide them through and of course go and grab your copy of radical confidence it's available in paperback right now thanks so much everyone thanks Lisa thanks J if you love this episode you will enjoy my interview with Dr Daniel aan on how to
change your life by changing your brain if we want a healthy mind it actually starts with a healthy brain you know I've had the blessing or the curse to scan over a thousand convicted felons and over over 100 murderers and their brains are very damaged