0:00
I think for me, I was I was looking at the the the playfield of like my career um when I was making this album too and I was like, "Okay, cool." I did limbo.
Search this video
0:06
I did this hip-hop album.
0:09
I did, you know, the the mixtapz where I dabbled into this.
0:13
I did the Kra duo collab project.
0:16
Like for this, this was really for me, this album.
0:19
And it really is my most personal thing I think I've ever gotten to work on.
0:23
And I'm really happy for myself more than I am for like the world to hear it.
0:30
[Music] By the way, Am here, everybody's got brand new album, 13 Months of Sunshine. Man, congrats.
0:38
I mean, you know, we knew in advance how good this album was, but it's different when you put it on and everyone else is listening to it at the same time because you just feel like you're having a collective experience, even if you can't see people, the energy of the world, you can feel it. Yeah.
0:48
And I felt when I put it on this morning again to listen to it on the way in, it just felt different to me.
0:53
It felt like uh it it was going to have a really wonderful moment for you, for all of us. Felt like an event, man. So, congrats. Thank you so much, man. That means a lot.
1:02
But it it kind of blew my mind.
1:02
It reminded me how diverse it is, too, in terms of tempo and emotion and stuff.
1:08
We've all been focusing on the uptempo stuff you've been giving us, but there's a lot going on.
1:10
We're going to talk about all that.
1:11
How does it feel now a couple of days out? Just really nice.
1:15
Honestly, I was so stressed trying to put put it together.
1:17
It was I think once people listen to it, they realize why I was stressed just because of the emotional kind of heavy heaviness to some of these songs. So, I don't know.
1:26
It just feels like a good release and like I went to therapy or something, you know? Yeah.
1:30
I mean, I feel like we all did listening to this, too.
1:32
And then and let's just get straight in there.
1:33
I mean, out the gate on New Flower, you lay out there.
1:37
We could spend the whole show just talking about New Flower.
1:41
Dude, that means so much.
1:41
I Yeah, I was I didn't I was like, should this be the intro? I don't know.
1:45
But like, yeah, dude, it's a hell of a life story. Thank you, dude.
1:48
How long were you uh sharing uh time in the complex age? Oh, yeah.
1:50
I mean, complex wasn't paying me either.
1:55
You guys got You guys have got a little support group going on. So, fine. Yeah.
1:59
I I like I I I never told Big Sean that story where he like tipped me $20. Yeah.
2:04
Let's just get a little more granular with that.
2:05
So, you're out there getting sandwich. You work for Dev Jam.
2:06
You've been interning or whatever, figuring it out.
2:08
And I was just figuring out cuz I didn't think like music would work out.
2:11
So, I was just, you know, I'm I'm an African. I work hard, you know?
2:12
So, like I I had a backup plan, you know?
2:15
I wasn't going to just live in the stars.
2:18
So, um I was getting sandwiches.
2:18
I was take I was getting paid in Subway cards, you know what I mean?
2:23
Like that was that was the only way I cutting social.
2:25
I was really eating plain rice, you know what I mean?
2:29
Like I was struggling and I and I remember being that being a tough time in my life where I was like, damn, like how how can I like work a 9 to5 and afford a you know, an apartment or have kids?
2:41
It was just like a stressful time in my life.
2:43
Well, you summed it up beautifully, man.
2:44
I feel like you took inspiration from the one of the greatest verses ever created on elevators by three stacks.
2:53
He talks about if you don't move your feet then I don't eat.
2:58
So, we like check and you took and extended that beautifully by saying if people don't like me then I don't get a check which means both my parents are staying in debt.
3:06
M and that that's a beautiful extension of that thought which is a really important reminder that we think cuz you make music Yeah.
3:12
A you're automatically rich. Yeah.
3:18
B you never have a right to complain about anything ever again.
3:20
These are the literally the these are these are the misunderstandings and cliches of artists to to the wider community. Yeah. I mean Yes. That you never grew up. Yeah. All that. Yeah.
3:30
And then people don't realize how hard you have to work.
3:32
The fact that money comes in slow if at all.
3:35
And and number three, you have just as much if not more to complain about because like you're backing yourself.
3:40
You're not in the matrix with some kind of healthcare or some kind of support network, you know? Yeah.
3:43
And I almost kind of I I don't want to sound like a baby complaining about it on the record.
3:47
So that's what kind of made me feel a little uh nervous about putting something like that.
3:51
Honestly, terrified of that.
3:52
Just scared to tell your truth.
3:54
I'm genu I was genuinely terrified to talk about some of those things on on a song just because, you know, you're putting yourself out there.
3:59
You don't know how it's going to be taken.
4:01
Sometimes it's sometimes it's just nicer to just go crazy on a song.
4:03
I think it's important though.
4:05
I think it's important for fans to really like understand that like yeah, it's not all just like PJs and like bottle service. You know what I mean?
4:11
Like it's just not what it is.
4:13
Like I mean it's not it is not especially if you if you have a family, you know what I mean?
4:18
Or or you have close friends from back home.
4:20
I'm very family and friends orient oriented.
4:21
So um it's just the things I think about just like all the people who depend on me.
4:27
We were just talking about this with Cole from Dive, you know, who um you know, he and his and his family are one of the many who lost their property in the in the fires earlier this year. Yeah. I mean, we all are. But I mean, amazing.
4:36
He's been incredible and I've I've spoken to him on on text and we just spoke today on the show and he was like, man, you know, like my kids are very young.
4:42
They're not thinking about that.
4:43
We're going to get back to work.
4:44
We're going to make music.
4:44
We do shows be part of rebuilding and and that's it, right?
4:48
And I think that I don't know, man.
4:49
I'm just going to make a statement here.
4:50
I I I think that I I think the art the backbone of all musicians is grossly under appreciated and under undervalued.
4:58
I I appreciate you saying that. That that means a lot. Yeah.
4:59
Can I um ask you about one more thing in that song before we play which is um I don't know the story so tell us as much as you want to extend but but what happened on Sunset?
5:08
That's Yeah, that's like a story I feel like I can't even talk about.
5:10
Um that that was a that was that was a lyric that in a bar that was written for my sister.
5:16
Um and we can leave it at that. But my friends Yeah. Yeah.
5:18
that that hit home for a lot of people who know that story who are close to my family and friends.
5:23
But um yeah, it just makes me emotional talking about it sometimes. Yeah. No, fair enough.
5:27
And it's interesting, you know, because you put things in songs and some of it's fair game and some of it needs to stay exactly where it is.
5:32
And the beautiful thing about the music is you have it for what it means to you.
5:35
We have it for what it means to us. 13 months to sunshine. That's right.
5:38
You have no idea how real that is. That's right.
5:40
As someone from Seattle, bro, dude, I always forget you're from Seattle.
5:44
First of all, let me say this, too. Is he though? I'm from Seattle. 10 years.
5:48
I've been gone for 10 years, but I'm from Seattle.
5:52
People from Seattle really wret Seattle. Let me ask you this.
5:54
I'd love to tease him about it though, man. Yeah.
5:57
Was there ever a point when you're when you're growing up in Portland when you're pursuing these dreams that you feel like you're going crazy because, you know, living in LA and even going to New York to pursue the arts?
6:05
For some people, it's like, yeah, I see it.
6:07
But you got to think outside the box so much to live in those cities to pursue, especially the kind of music that you make.
6:14
like a there's like a like a Bay Area, West Coast through thread for a lot of cats from that area.
6:19
And for you to to dive into the sounds, you've done albums with Kronada where you're at musically, but this did you feel crazy at points? I definitely felt crazy. Are you crazy?
6:28
Like like being from Portland, it just feels uh you know, sometimes it never felt like your dreams could ever come true.
6:34
You know, they they call Portland sometimes the place where young people retire.
6:36
That's like the like our joke.
6:38
Um, and it's it's it's so beautiful there and there's so much talent there, but it never felt like um I could ever make it out of there at times, you know?
6:47
It was just it's a gloomy city, you know what I mean?
6:50
So, making kind of the brighter music and the dance music that I do make was out of necessity for my for my personal self.
6:57
Like, I needed to make that kind of music in order to feel better, you know, especially in the hip-hop space cuz I I was in the elevator the other day and it was a whole bunch of folks and we was leaving this little day party.
7:05
Everyone's saying where he was from.
7:06
One girl says, "I'm from Connecticut."
7:07
Another girl goes, "Knetic? who's from Connecticut?
7:08
Like being black people from like Seattle and Portland.
7:12
Oh yeah, I get that all the time.
7:14
But that's why I always like when I first came in, I think a lot of people assumed I was from like Atlanta or LA or whatever.
7:19
And I always say Portland because there's a huge community, you know, you know, I mean, there's a huge community of black people over there and it's just it's unspoken for sometimes.
7:29
So I love I I mean, yeah, I'm going to rep my city till the day.
7:31
Let's talk a little bit about misconceptions, you know, because you came out when it when it finally did click and Caroline hit and then of course that six times platinum now.
7:37
Congratulations, by the way.
7:39
That song continues to grow and I mean it top charts and it became that kind of moment.
7:42
You hope you get to have at least one of those in your life, right?
7:45
But then then the dust settles. You take a look around.
7:47
It's like, well, how do people see me if they've only heard that one song or seen that one video?
7:52
Which part of that do I want to take with me and which part do I want to leave with that song and not be that guy?
7:57
Did it feel a little bit like that? For sure.
7:59
I think for me, I was I was looking at the the the playfield of like my career um when I was making this album too and I was like, "Okay, cool. I did limbo.
8:08
I did this hip-hop album.
8:08
I did, you know, the the mixtapz where I dabbled into this.
8:12
I did the Kra duo collab project.
8:15
Like for this, this was really for me, this album.
8:17
And it really is my most personal thing I think I've ever gotten to work on.
8:22
And I'm really happy for myself more than I am for like the world to hear it.
8:27
That's why it's going to happen for you because this is such an authentic, genuine reflection of who you are.
8:31
And by the way, whether you meant to or not, as Rick Rubin says, never change one note of music based on what anyone else will think about, but but the truth is like whether you meant to, and I know you didn't. Mhm.
8:41
Your timing is perfect cuz the sun's coming out. People want tempo.
8:45
It's just that there isn't an EDM or a scene yet for everyone to kind of galvanize around and build business around.
8:53
So when you have artists like yourself making records like this, like we just shouted out Soul Action, you got like No Worries coming out with their uptempo returns. Oh, we're finding tempo.
9:04
It's coming in at the right time. Yeah.
9:06
I mean, it's it's the like this time.
9:08
I mean, me and it's the anniversary of Kra Media today, by the way. So, yeah. Wow.
9:11
This this time right before summer starts is like my favorite time to release music just because, you know, everyone's planning their trips and their their plans for the rest of the summer.
9:21
This is coming with me, bro. Yeah.
9:23
I I just like people getting to live with the music.
9:25
I think um it's it's nice. It's it's that time.
9:29
I never really saw myself as like with dropping music in December.
9:30
You know, that was like never although although I mean you got a song on this album which is December song. No question about it.
9:38
History is a December song.
9:38
It's like you know you and Katie go deep on that.
9:42
But to get into a space with with Katie with Wax a Hatchee where you get to actually you know dive into real copyright territory.
9:48
I mean, that's an acoustic guitar demo that's been developed into a beautiful thing or a piano demo, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
9:55
That that was kind of the goal with some of these songs.
9:56
I was just trying to kind of write on bare bones situations and then remix them like five times with different producers. Yeah.
10:03
Cuz a lot of these songs have 10 different versions of them. Yeah. Got the deluxe lined up. Well, yeah, man.
10:10
I mean, I think the deluxe is necessary.
10:12
Like I really loved how Charlie did her deluxe and it was like completely different music but it was the same songs or whatever but to me yeah I think it's a there's a deluxe saturation you know what I mean?
10:24
So I only want to do it with intent with especially with music that feels so emotional like this.
10:29
See it's just cuz we call it something like what what I like about the concept of deluxe is that people just keep kind of amending their music in real time.
10:36
And I just wish there was more of that conversation and it's less like a sort of again a kind of understand why but it's less of a trade where it's like hey now with five extra songs that's like old language like kids don't think like that.
10:48
If they like it they'll spread the word so fast and it's like oh they've just added to the album. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
10:53
I mean there's there's definitely like five songs that we had trouble trying to decide on which we're going to make it on this album that I would love for people to be able to hear.
11:02
Um and they still hold a like a heavy weight in my heart with those songs.
11:06
You know, you got the title though for it, right?
11:07
I mean, that's the thing you got to start with.
11:08
You know, it's like 13 and a half months of that's so funny.
11:12
Just leans into the marketing is there. The marketing is there.
11:16
If you have an album with time in it, it's the deluxe winner.
11:18
You know, 16 months of It just keeps Well, I mean, we said 13, but put 16 songs on there.
11:26
We were like, are people going to think we're super stupid for like 16? Someone did.
11:30
But, you know, I haven't heard anyone say it yet.
11:32
Someone thinks that someone's like stupid 16 songs I'm not even going to play.
11:37
Yo, what's up with you, man? Like, no. That's how it is, man.
11:40
You can't you can't listen to them. You know, we love Katie. Oh, man.
11:41
I mean, what was it about here?
11:43
I feel like Birmingham and Portland does share a little bit of that ethos, right?
11:47
Like the the creative communities there are so vibrant, but it also does feel like fame in a traditional sense is kind of out of reach.
11:53
What was it about Katie that kind of like I don't know connected with you emotionally or in that that place of vulnerability if you listen to that last track?
11:59
I there was uh this time I think around this time last year like May um I was listening to Right Back to it uh like I think 50 times on loop like uh in in a we were joking about we were joking about how MJ Linderman's harmonies are like it's the best harmony I think I've ever heard ever heard in my life and yet it takes you 19 listens just to get one note right.
12:19
He's so in an unusual pocket on that song. Yeah.
12:22
I mean they're both so like talented, you know what I mean?
12:24
But I I was playing it on loop and then I I wouldn't think Katie was a fan of me at all. you know what I mean?
12:29
I was just a fan of hers.
12:31
And then that's when we started talking around there when I was just posting the song like a million times.
12:36
And uh she was so sweet, man.
12:39
Katie is like a real one. Like goat. Absolute goat.
12:41
She's so just so kind about everything and doesn't doesn't uh make anything that feel that big of a deal.
12:47
Like she was just so I just sent her audio message like, "Hey, I have this song that I really love.
12:51
Would you like to be a part of it?"
12:52
And she sent one back and yeah, it happened.
12:54
Like that's beautiful, man.
12:55
People again underestimate the courage it takes from one artist to reach out to another.
12:58
It It's nerve-wracking, man.
13:00
Like reaching out to other people, you're like, "Man, what if this person hates me?
13:03
What if they don't get back to you?
13:05
What if it's like text red and there's no response?" Exactly.
13:09
But I've learned I've learned over the years that that fear was just something you come up with in your head and you have to be okay with rejection and it's fine.
13:15
It's like, yo, if they if they don't text back, well, dude, when you're out getting sandwiches for Big Sean and getting under the early days of Complex, then you know, a non-rely is going to be okay.
13:25
It's going to be definitely, man.
13:26
God bless you, Mina, for coming in this morning, hanging out with us, fresh from doing like a a traffic stopping show to celebrate your album in Los Angeles. A massive underplay.
13:34
Like I said, when you can find a shade of love, a shade of something that has been written about and talked about so many times in life, and you can find just a unique way to look at it, an angle that hasn't been looked at that much. Yeah.
13:46
I love the way you explained it when when we were talking. Yeah.
13:49
I mean, that song to me is about being in a very committed and loving relationship and recognizing that even with that grass can grow under your feet and that it doesn't mean that you're going to move to next door to the yard next door.
13:59
You're going to do something crazy to or the restless is going to get on top of you.
14:02
It's just give me a little second and I'll come right back. I'm all good. Like everything's cool.
14:06
I just need to go and be weird in my own head space for a minute.
14:09
And it's just beautiful, you know? No, it's beautiful. Beautiful.
14:11
I wouldn't be able to convince no girl to do that.
14:14
They need to be like, "You're leaving. You're out of here. You're being weird."
14:18
They're very secure in their relationship, but that's probably why I'm not in long-term relationship. So funny. Yeah.
14:23
I want to talk about Leon Thomas, too, though. We play that. Yeah.
14:27
Like you caught him at the perfect time because if you had to think of, you know, a new class of R&B artists, he's pro as far as like R&B vocals for on the male side. Yeah.
14:36
He's probably leading that joint.
14:38
Mut is going to be we're going to hear Mut for the rest of our lives. Like this is later, man.
14:41
Like, bro, like you talk about hooking up with him too for now.
14:44
Yeah, Leon is like I'm so happy for Leon right now, man.
14:47
He he we worked together in the studio months back like way before he would like I think I was with him in the studio before he dropped Mud and all of that stuff. Wow.
14:56
stuff. Wow. We were working together for for a time and boy one day introduced us years ago and he's just such a talented kind human being man like Leon if you know him personally like he is he really deserves everything he gets not because of just the music just him as a personality he is like great and uh when
15:13
we were doing uh New Flower like I was working with Dahi at his studio and we me and Dahi were just trying to cook it up and Leon came through and and sang his part and it was sick like I didn't I Leon being on that song right It's not some like like label play of like mud is popping, let's drop this. It's just no. It's just no.
15:32
Leon's voice coming right after my father skit is so like meaningful to me, you know what I mean?
15:37
And for this song and he he does it so well so well. Okay, cool. Yeah, he does so well.
15:42
I didn't know if I could cuss. Yeah.
15:45
Um but he does it so well and I I really love Leon's voice on that song that it means a lot.
15:52
It feels like such a good closing.
15:53
you know, because he's it's what the reason it's so meaningful at the moment is because um Leon's been that that artist for people, but then as he's been regrouping and figuring out where his authentic voice sits, artists have responded before anybody else.
16:04
So, if you talk to artists, they artists love Leon Thomas.
16:08
They can't wait to work with Leon Thomas.
16:09
So, fans are discovering him really. He is insane, man.
16:13
He'll he'll make a sample like his own sample in front of you.
16:16
Like, I've seen him do it.
16:18
I mean, we talked about this with the selection.
16:20
A new episode came out yesterday and Leon Thomas is on there and he does a shade a flip.
16:23
It's just like a and it's just like it stopped me.
16:26
Dude is the most versatile. Like he he's good.
16:28
He'll be around for the next 15 years, man.
16:30
I'm glad you mentioned your dad.
16:32
He plays a really important role in this in this Yeah, my father Yeah, my father's really all over the album.
16:36
Uh he didn't he didn't know that he was on the album till it came out.
16:42
Uh it was it was his birthday January 25th.
16:44
So um I knew I didn't really have skits or anything on the album yet.
16:46
And this music meant a lot to me.
16:48
So, I was like, "You know what?
16:50
By chance, I'm going to go celebrate his birthday and we'll go have a boys trip and spend this one-on-one time together."
16:54
And we took a walk on the beach for like 2 hours.
16:56
And my dad just like started talking about doing the best I can and growing a garden.
17:02
And that like I didn't tell him to say none of that. That was all him.
17:07
And when he was doing it, I was trying my best not to freak out.
17:09
Like I was like, "Man, this is so good."
17:11
And I was just let I was being like, "Yeah, uh-huh. Uh-huh." And letting him talk.
17:17
And um yeah, we just cut up some of that like 2hour recording for the album and it and it just worked.
17:21
Um it's beautiful when you get to a place in in your relationships in life, especially the ones that are most precious where they turn a corner into something else.
17:28
And uh you know, you've been you know, you and your your father have been at various ro sort of like crossroads in your lives when you're young and it's like you look to them like like a like a hero or whatever and then it's like, "Oh, I'm forming my identity."
17:42
And he's like, "Oh, I've lost my kid." And then you come home.
17:45
It's the most It's the boyhood effect.
17:47
If you ever seen that movie, like at the end, the parent is just the kid moves out and it's like the saddest scene ever.
17:51
But for me, like putting my father on this album.
17:54
You don't want to see the last latest latest episode, The Last of Us.
17:57
You don't want to see what happened last. I haven't seen it. Don't tell me. Don't tell me. Don't tell me.
18:01
I mean, it's that on Wow. Don't tell me. Don't tell me.
18:03
I I was so cooked last night.
18:07
But my father being on the album meant a lot to me also because of the Ethiopian heritage.
18:12
I wanted people to hear my father's accent.
18:13
I wanted people to hear what my father actually sounds like cuz I think when they hear me rapping they think like oh man I mean his dad must be like the coolest rapper ever or something and like my dad is like the funniest heaviest accent around. You know what I mean?
18:28
The things he said he's been in America for 30 years and he still sounds like that.
18:31
It's the funny I love it.
18:34
That's like we already play Feel So Good, which is one of my favorites and I got to talk to you about that. Yes.
18:38
You know how I feel about that. Absolutely love it.
18:39
Doing the best I can by Amina.
18:41
Uh he's our guest right now.
18:43
fresh from a a big underplay in Los Angeles last night to celebrate the release of your brand new album, 13 Months of Sunshine. Man, cooked.
18:48
But you've cooked for us today, which we appreciate.
18:53
Thank you guys for having me.
18:54
This is this felt like it was only 2 minutes long. No, man.
18:55
I mean, it always kind of sad to leave.
18:57
Yeah, it feels good with you every single time we get to spend time with you, but also extra special at this point.
19:01
Um, as we've acknowledged at various points in our conversation and the leadup to this album.
19:06
I really appreciate the questions.
19:07
Really, really, really, really sweet.
19:09
We love the album and you know we listen I met you back in 2016 South by Southwest.
19:14
You rolled up to me and were like, "Hey man, I got this song Caroline."
19:18
I was like, "I know that song. It's popping off."
19:19
And you were like, "Yeah, yeah, yeah."
19:20
And I'll never forget what you said to me.
19:22
Do you remember what you said to me? No. What did I say?
19:24
You said to me, "Yeah, Caroline is great and I'm really grateful for that song."
19:28
It was like a 45se secondond conversation.
19:30
I just done a keynote so I was like, "No, this does sound like something I would say."
19:34
And you were like, "Caroline is great, but man, I just want you to know like I'm a I'm a I'm like a complete human, like a complete artist, and I have lots of things I want to make and lots of different things I want to do." Oh, wow.
19:47
I swear you said this to me. That's so fire.
19:48
And you were like, "So, I'm really glad."
19:50
But I I'm happy I said that.
19:50
You like, "I'm in this for the long run, bro.
19:54
So, please don't just think of me as the Caroline guy."
19:56
That's what you said to me.
19:58
And here you are nearly 10 years later and you're not just the Caroline guy, man. You know, you're not.
20:06
You've gone on and you've proven that.
20:08
So that being said, you are still the Caroline guy, man. And we have to Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, that's fine. I get it. It's popping. I get it.
20:19
But I mean, it's really just to take us back to that original conversation, man.
20:23
cuz you have really gone on on a journey and you've given us an enormous amount of great music and I know now a long it will continue for a long time.
20:28
Yeah, I appreciate that man.
20:30
That's a really good story.
20:31
I didn't know I said that.